I’ve driven the Beltway in DC.
If this was enforced, half the commuters would be guilty of these charges.
My opinion is Fuck BLM Nazis.
Some people - religious, political or otherwise - are convinced that forcing someone to put up the outward appearance of something is the same as genuine conversion to that belief within.
Their is additional video of a second confrontation where they go after 2 white young men and this time some of the protesters are black.
If the ill behavior of other motorists on the DC Beltway is so frequent and common and yet does not routinely end in violence or unwanted contact such that no reasonable person would believe that unwanted contact or violence is imminent then no charge could be supported.
So when another driver honks at you, raises his middle finger, or yells at you and yet the experience of a reasonable motorist is that such behavior on the part of another driver is unlikely to result in imminent harm or offensive contact then no charge of assault could be sustained.
The behavior of that crowd in the restaurant is not so common or frequent that a reasonable person would have a particular expectation based upon past experience.
So the question is, would a reasonable person in that restaurant, with a crowd yelling at her and a woman leaning over her reasonably believe that unwanted contact was imminent? If so, a charge of assault or mayhem could be supported. IMHO the charge could be supported based upon the video evidence.
If someone gets in my personal space and starts screaming at me with their face inches away from mine, it’s reasonable for me to assume they’ll hit me if I make one wrong move. This is something everyone accepts when it occurs in any other context. The only reason anyone is questioning it here is because the screamers are BLM.
I’d say the diner in the video handled it about as well as possible under the circumstances; she kept her cool, and refused to reward their brownshirt tactics.
The one or two people coming to within a foot of her face and yelling are behaving in a threatening manner. I think administering pepper spray or a broken nose at that moment would be entirely justified from a legal and moral standpoint, but it would also be ill-advised: you would just transform an angry mob into a violent mob, and you’re greatly outnumbered. Taking out your cell phone to call the cops might also be risky, at least to your phone: it’s not hard to imagine someone swiping/slapping your phone out of your hand.
If I saw this happening to another diner, I would probably try to dial 911 before the mob came to me. I would tell them there’s an angry mob working together to intimidate bystanders, and I’m very concerned about the situation escalating to physical violence.
This. It may just be my contrarian instinct but the moment anyone tells me I must or must not do something, my “fuck you” circuits start beeping.
Even when it is a cause that I strongly believe in, being compelled to act or refrain from acting in a certain way makes we want to do the opposite. So no, unless I choose to of my own free will I won’t be joining in. Doesn’t mean I don’t support you or won’t materially support your cause but you don’t get to tell me how to do it, threatening behaviour won’t help and necessarily cheapens any superficial response you do get.
Like when the Islamist scum murdered the Charlie Hebdo journalists and people the world over equivocated on whether drawing cartoons was somehow “asking for it”. I never considered drawing an offensive cartoon previously but I absolutely did in the aftermath. No religion gets to tell me what I can or can’t draw.
Ooooooh! Is the fact that some of them were black supposed to imply that this situation is even more dangerous than your original scenario? Let’s see this video.
That is how I’m wired as well. I detest mob mentality.
Protest, march, hold up signs, shout slogans, but do so peacefully and don’t menace bystanders. Especially when they are minding their own business, aren’t there to counter protest, are in clear minority and disadvantage, and are not being menacing or showing outward signs of malice or ill intent.
I wish the protests would move to sit-in style so the trouble makers would stand out.
All the “OH NOES MOB VIOLENCE” is obviously stupid, so I won’t worry about that. When a group of people acts like assholes but does not actually lay a hand on anyone, it’s not mob violence, it’s mob assholery.
But I’m curious. Can someone quote from the videos the specific threats that were delivered? [Edit: it’s entirely possible someone will respond with some sort of hand-waving about how they sure looked threatening, or their voice volume was real loud, or something like that. If that’s your response, I’ll conclude you didn’t hear any actual threats in the video.]
And next week when your nonsense hypothetical fails to happen, you’re going to admit it? Or just keep coming up with more absurd scenarios and ignoring when they don’t actually happen?
I bring up anti-abortion protestors because they use the same or worse tactics in their protests, but people like you never seem to think that the cops need to swoop in, arrest them all, charge them with ‘whatever’, fingerprint them, check them for outstanding warrants, and let them know that this behavior will not be tolerated. It’s not ‘hijacking’, it’s pointing out that protesters being ‘in your face’ but non-violent (and not demanding money, lol) has a long tradition (at least 4 decades now) of being allowed and even encouraged by people with your general viewpoint.
So you support the Democrats arresting people who protest in an ‘in your face’ way that makes other people uncomfortable, and are not going to be upset if they start with the group that has a decades long history of routinely making such protests? That is, you are not only fine with but actively want the Democrats to start arresting anti-abortion protestors? Or is it only BLM protestors using these tactics that should be arrested?
“Angry mobs that yell at people and get in their face should be arrested! This BLM stuff is awful and next week they’ll be demanding money from people!” “What about the precedent that mobs who get in people’s faces shouting but don’t cross the line into violence are protected by the first amendment? Should we abandon that precedent and arrest the mobs who have been doing so for decades but happen to be idealogically aligned with you?” “Uh, citing legal precedent is whataboutism.”
I think screaming within 2 feet of someone during a pandemic of an airborne virus while your mask continuously falls below your nose constitutes assault with potentially high damages if the diner gets infected.
Until this post I was not in favor of any specific consequences for the mob’s action even though it is clearly bullying. But it’s definitely putting her in danger. (But it saddens me to have to specify that the danger is not as great as people brandishing guns in the street or in a governmental building, lest someone falsely jump to the conclusion that I am okay with those.)
I saw that video yesterday and have been wondering what I would or should do if it happens to me.
My first thought was to give them a “Heil Hitler” salute. Then I thought I’d start coughing and sneezing toward them. I don’t typically go about armed but I am giving it consideration; I have begun routinely carrying pepper spray.
The idea of just leaving (making no attempt to pay the bill) is a thought, but that will probably lead to the screaming jerks multiplying around the country.
Unless a better idea comes up if something like this happens to me I guess I will just immediately call 911 and let the cops sort it out. I will not give in to the demand of the jerks.
“Assault does not require physical contact or physical injury. An attempt to menace is sufficient to support a charge of assault. If a reasonable person would feel threatened by the behavior then it is an assault.”
Well, I can’t decipher the point of that blob of quotes, and none of them is by me, so all I can say is, what about it?
No, I’m pretty sure Dale Carnegie recommended that sort of behavior in “How to Win Friends and Influence People.”
Getting in someone’s personal space and screaming at them is threatening behaviour. It’s ludicrous to pretend otherwise.