What's our basic moral obligation?

I keep doubting whether to say what I really think here, as so much seems so reprehensible. So I tone it down, and bite my tongue. I felt like posting that it’s our basic moral obligation to donate hundreds of dollars to the Democratic Party and to vote a straight Democratic ticket, every two years. But then I fear I’m being too extreme, and I don’t post it.

Then I read something like this, from today’s Washington Post:

Elon Musk, right-wing figures push misinformation about Pelosi attack

Elon Musk and a wide range of right-wing personalities cobbled together misreporting, innuendo and outright falsehoods to amplify misinformation about last week’s violent assault on Paul Pelosi to their millions of online followers.
A forum devoted to former White House adviser Stephen K. Bannon’s right-wing radio show alerted its 78,000 subscribers to “very strange new details on Paul Pelosi attack.” Roger Stone, a longtime political consigliere to former president Donald Trump, took to the fast-growing messaging app Telegram to call the assault on House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s husband an “alleged attack,” telling his followers that a “stench” surrounded mainstream reporting about the Friday break-in that left Pelosi, 82, hospitalized with a skull fracture and other serious injuries.
The skepticism didn’t stay in right-wing echo chambers but seeped also into the feeds of popular online personalities, including Musk, Twitter’s new owner. “There is a tiny possibility there might be more to this story than meets the eye,” he wrote Sunday morning, pointing his 112 million followers to a sensationalist account of the episode published by a site known for spreading right-wing misinformation before deleting the tweet several hours later. […]

Politics is so exhausting. I donated my hundreds of dollars, and minutes ago I got back from voting a straight Democratic ticket, and then I read this, and it still doesn’t feel like enough.

So, there, I said it. It’s our basic moral obligation to donate hundreds of dollars to the Democratic Party and vote a straight Democratic ticket every two years. This is where we’ve come. I’m sorry to see us losing democracy, such as we had it.

I’m a Democrat.

That’s a fact. And I’ll be glad to explain why. But that’s not quite the same as saying other people should vote as I do.

The political science research on the effect of campaign spending is mixed.

I suppose that that some of the charities I have contributed to have no scientific evidence for their value. Probably most. So my last paragraph isn’t a real good reason not to give money to your favorite candidates. But telling other people how to vote, directly, or indirectly by funding TV ads, is less of a moral obligation and more of a good way to annoy them.

My most basic moral obligation is to not intentionally hurt anyone else. I believe that at this point in time not voting for Republican candidates adheres to that philosophy.

Your basic moral obligtion is to not demnd that other people support you when you are capable of supporting yourself. You are born a free person. That means you have a responsibility to care of yourself to the best of your ability. No one owes you anything, and you shouldn’t demand it.

Be an asset to your community. Instead of being jealous of what others have, work to improve yourself. Treat others as you want to be treated. Don’t impose your will on others through force. Pay your debts, and keep your word. Be kind to the people around you, and when you die take comfort that the world was a better place for having had you in it.

There may be some theoretical world, maybe one located in Canada, where more idealistic thoughts can apply. For those of us who live in the pragmatic reality of the current United States of America, however, Napier’s words are the only possible morality that a decent human being can adhere to. With the necessary qualification is that the voting must be done every single year, as local elections count just as much.

“No one owes you anything”: sort of. No individual selected at random owes you anything, but society as a whole is obligated to you, as you are obligated to it. So give more than you take if you can; don’t demand anything if you have viable alternatives. But I didn’t choose to live in a society only to have it drop me like a hot brick the minute I was down on my luck.

Isn’t that the big debate though? To what extent we are obligated to society, and vice-versa? And what forms those obligations take?

Whatever one’s “basic moral obligation” in regards politics, it is incumbent to realize that lots of people clearly don’t share it. The fact that many Americans do not perceive lies, corruption and criminal intent as being against their long-term interests – let alone, sense of morality - is imo an indictment of the educational system and its failure to effectively teach essential critical thinking skills. With little or no actual evidence, I believe this is in part intentional, as politicians (who exert considerable control over education) understand that the dumber people are, the easier it is to stay in power and perks. More recently, education has been the victim of natural causes (shutdowns from Covid) that seem likely to exacerbate the problem.

It is not my intent to discourage anyone from trying to change things for the better in any legal way they see fit, but without recognizing the nature and scope of the problem - worldwide, not just in America – such efforts would only seem to prove that a morality not predominantly practiced cannot be called “basic”; and as tens of millions of Americans have shown with their votes, support and finances, it’s clearly not an “obligation” either.

When it rains, it pours. This morning I learned that two people I work with, people I admire and appreciate, are fleeing the United States – one of them having to leave their job to do so. Neither of these people is a straight cis white man, and this is the underlying reason they are leaving. I sent a message saying among other things that this is wise of them, and I wish I could say I was doing the same.

I’ve been wondering why more people aren’t leaving, and when I’d start seeing people I know doing so. And of course it’s not necessarily an option anyway, as leaving means you have to find someplace that will take you. But it’s true, I do wish I could say I was doing the same.

I don’t think it’s a political agenda that is the cause of the educational issues in the US. Rather I think it’s a misguided emphasis on how the US is doing relative to other countries.

I mean, I recall growing up in the 1980s, and hearing a slow, but steady trickle of how kids in the Soviet Union went to school six days a week, or about how Japanese 5th graders were already learning algebra. Or about how European kids did all sorts of other stuff that was far ahead of us. And I have to figure that if I was hearing/reading that sort of thing as a child, adults and parents were being absolutely assailed with it.

And the result was the outsized emphasis on testing and measurement that’s taken place since. It’s all counterproductive of course, because test scores become the main goal, and teaching intangibles like critical thinking goes out the window.

There’s also the very real phenomenon of a kid learning some critical thinking, taking it home, asking Mom/Dad/Grandpa/Uncle about why something is the way it is/tells them it’s unfair, and the adult tells the kid they’re wrong and why they think so. Kids aren’t really equipped to look at what their teacher told them, and then what their entire family (and community in some cases) is telling them, and make a well informed decision about that stuff. Maybe in high school, but a lot of the time, kids’ opinions and thoughts get snowed under by an avalanche of family/community beliefs about things.

Or worse, the critical thinking is modulated to fit within their family’s/community’s worldview. They may think critically, but the “postulates”, for lack of a better term are where they differ. For example, if a kid grows up in a right-wing household, he may well be a critical thinker, but he may also grow up in a worldview where it’s a given that poor people are responsible for their own plight, full stop. Or that there is one true religion, and the rest is heathen nonsense. Or that intelligent design isn’t a load of BS, or whatever. If you’re a critical thinker, but you’re starting out with a different foundation, you’re not guaranteed to reach the same conclusions as others starting from a different point.

The educational system as a very incoherent whole, doesn’t do a great job of teaching people to buck whatever their inherent views are, and I feel like that’s a consequence of having such a fragmented system- every state can emphasize or deemphasize whatever they feel is important.

This wasn’t enough for me, so I’ve been volunteering to help elect Democrats in local and statewide elections. Not disparaging anyone who doesn’t do the same, but after decades of just voting and donating (and watching Republicans win greater control) I realized that I couldn’t live with myself if I watched our democracy disappear without putting up more of a personal fight.

I believe our basic moral obligation (social contract) is defined by the preamble to our Constitution:

“form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity”

It’s a ready standard for measuring my decisions and motives. In the current context I agree with the OP - plus vote no on all judicial retentions.

What’s our basic moral obligation?

And what do you do if you live in an area where the general election winner is whatever Republican won the primary?

I think Akaj is doing something that we’re all actually morally obligated to do, and I feel a bit ashamed that I haven’t started doing it yet. My other volunteer things are more than I would have liked, and I’m tired, and… well… excuses.

But if you live someplace where the winner’s going to be Republican anyway, disappointingly, I don’t think that changes the obligations.

In the Presidential elections, my state is one of the bluest, though my county is (I think) the reddest one in my state. My Presidential vote doesn’t matter because there’s no practical chance it will change the outcome. Sadly, when I voted yesterday, there were about half a dozen elections in which no Democrat was running, which suggests we should also be running in elections, but I don’t know if I’m ready to handle the fear of those I love getting hurt.

There are a lot of good judges out there. Why vote no on all of them?

Not at the county level in my county.

The premise in the OP is pretty flawed. A political label being de-jure moral and just never leads to anything good.

To answer the question as best as possible, I don’t think there are moral obligations that force one to act.

Thanks for the shout-out! I keep reading about Republicans taking over starting at the school board level, while Dems focus on higher offices, and decided I had to pitch in even if my efforts are small and late in the game.

Interestingly, the local candidate I’m canvassing for says she’s pretty confident she’ll win, but she wants to “run up the score” so next time the party can divert resources from her district to one that’s closer. So even if your local election is a slam dunk (one way or the other), it can be worthwhile to get involved.

I think this is the fundamental difference between the sides in our politics. One side sees injustice and suffering and says we need to do something to help. The other side sees injustice and suffering and says, welp, not my problem.

Problem is, we live in a society. The second type is not compatible with a healthy society.