I didn’t say you said “official according to American law” nor that you said anything was being imposed. I was asking you if it should be. Do you think it should be?
So it’s official according to the government of Maharashtra. Why should an American in America care about that? That government has no reason to expect Americans, communicating in their own language to other Americans in America, to use anything other than the American term for the city. Especially if courtesy is not a factor (although I think it should be).
Those Americans who care about simply being correct and up-to-date might care - you say ‘the American term’, as though that is something fixed and unchanging. Also, as I think somebody’s already mentioned, English is an official language of India, so talking of Americans using ‘their own language’ suggests a separation which doesn’t exist.
I have no problem with others using whatever term they wish. But I deny that “Mumbai” is currently a “correct” term–correctness is determined by usage, not authority, and “Bombay” seems to be in common usage where I’m at and in my social groups. If at some point, “Mumbai” is more useful for me and who I’m talking to, I’ll use it. I absolutely do not mean “American term” to have any connotations of permanence.
What it’s called in India has changed. What it’s called in America has not, for the part that I’m aware of.
And yes, both India and America use the language English, but that doesn’t necessarily give speakers in one location any influence over speakers in another.
Not really. From wiki :The name Mumbai is an eponym, etymologically derived from Mumba or Maha-Amba—the name of the Hindu goddess Mumbadevi—and Aai, “mother” in Marathi.[5] The former name Bombay had its origins in the 16th century when the Portuguese arrived in the area and called it by various names, which finally took the written form Bombaim, still common in current Portuguese use. After the British gained possession in the 17th century, it was anglicised to Bombay, although it was known as Mumbai or Mambai to Marathi and Gujarati-speakers, and as Bambai in Hindi, Persian and Urdu. It is sometimes still referred to by its older names, like Kakamuchee and Galajunkja.[6][7] The name was officially changed to its Marathi pronunciation of Mumbai in 1996.[8]
In other words, the name of the city has always been either (something like) Mumbai or Bambai, depending on what language the name was in. They just regularized the pronunciation to the Marathi pronunciation.
It does seem to be taking over, though - I started to look for a meaningful set of googlefight terms, but trying to compare news reports of the terror attacks of last year got confused with the recent attack on the Sri Lanka cricket team. I then went for Hollywood, and ‘slumdog bombay’ turned up the following top three results:
‘Young ‘Slumdog’ stars back in Mumbai slums’ (CNN) ‘Mumbai Celebrates ‘Slumdog’ Oscar Victory’ (NPR) ‘“Slumdog Millionaire” boosts Mumbai tourism’ (USA Today)
Also, ‘Slumdog Mumbai’ got twice as many results overall.
It’s not just about accuracy, it’s also about politics. The government of Maharashtra, controlled by Shiv Sena, an Marathi nationalist party, renamed the city Mumbai to invent a Marathi history for the city, and to explictly claim Bombay/Mumbai as a Marathi rather than a Konkani or Gukarati city. So, by calling it Mumbai, you’re agreeing to their claims.
It’s like, to take an example from the United Kingdom, whether you call the city in Northern Ireland “Londonderry” or “Derry”. The term you use depends on your political leanings, and who you feel have a primary “right” to the city.
True, and a good example, although there’s also exceptions to rule with (London)Derry…“Usage varies among local organisations, with both names being used. Examples are City of Derry Airport, City of Derry Rugby Club, Derry City FC and the Protestant Apprentice Boys of Derry, as opposed to Londonderry Port and Londonderry Chamber Of Commerce” (my bolding). Derry - Wikipedia
According to the Government of Spain the official name of the country is “España” so I will take it as a personal insult if anyone henceforward uses the old English name. If you want to be polite and accurate use España.
And the Pope’s name in Latin should be. . . who’s da Pope these days?.. I’m not keeping up with the news… Johannes Paulus Somethingus Orotheringus???
“Name
Because of the difficulties of transliterating written and regionally-pronounced Arabic, Gaddafi’s name can be transliterated in many different ways. An article published in the London Evening Standard in 2004 lists a total of 37 spellings; a **1986 column by The Straight Dope **quotes a list of 32 spellings known at the Library of Congress.[41] Muammar al-Gaddafi, used in this article, is the spelling used by Time magazine and the BBC. The Associated Press, CNN, and Fox News use the spelling Moammar Gadhafi, Al-Jazeera uses Muammar al-Qadhafi (Al-Jazeera English uses Muammar Gaddafi[42]) the Edinburgh Middle East Report uses Mu’ammar Qaddafi and the U.S. Department of State uses Mu’ammar Al-Qadhafi. In 1986, Gaddafi reportedly responded to a Minnesota school’s letter in English using the spelling Moammar El-Gadhafi.[43] The Xinhua News Agency uses Muammar Khaddafi in its English reports.[44]”
Bangkok’s an odd example. I believe there really was a small sleepy fishing village called Bang Kok (Place of Olive Trees) at the time the seat of power was relocated to here in 1782, following the successful Burmese invasion and utter sacking of the old Ayutthaya kingdom 15 years before. (The seat of power was located across the river in present-day Thonburi during the interval, but then some genius finally figured out they’d be safer from the marauding Burmese if they were on THIS side of the river instead.)
But I don’t think there is a Bang Kok anywhere anymore, and in Thai this city is unfailingly called Krung Thep (City of Angels). Krung Thep is actually a short version of the exceptionally long official name, but neither Bang Kok nor Bangkok appears anywhere in it.
I agree completely here. There is nothing wrong a place with having a different name in English. Nothing annoys me more than people who call the country Chile “Chi-Lay.” I want to ask them, “Do you also call Germany Deutchland or Italy Italia?”
The wiki page is a bit short on details, one of which is that the names Mumbai and Bombay may not be etymologically related- there are conflicting theories on this, because there are several Portuguese words which may have been conflated to form the name of the city (bahia, for example = bay). Bombay probably came from the name of the Portuguese fort (and later, port) of Bombaim around which the city grew. The earliest permanent settlement in the area which we know lots about was Mahikawati, which is now the island of Mahim. The area has been continuously inhabited for 2,000 years, but it hasn’t been a particularly important city for very long.
Well, how do you refer to it? Chyll? Chill? Chilly?
I was surprise to find that Wiki had mentioned it too, but I recall reading the column in one of the Straight Dope books many years ago and wondered if anyone had more to add where Cecil left off.
