Damn dude. You are one badass mutherfucker.
I didn’t read the entire thread but ----------
sharks with frickin’ laser beams attached to their heads
No, I am not. I just know how to shoot well and a few other things. It doesn’t need to be a fair fight when you just want to hurt someone.
I don’t think this is evil at all. It’s entirely natural and normal for a victim to want revenge against an aggressor, although you may be in the more hard-edged classification of the normal spectrum, so to speak.
What would be evil would be if someone wanted to be an *aggressor *against innocent victims, not the retaliating victim.
Yeah, none of this is remotely objective.
I am pretty unhappy about being bad, because I want to be good. But then I’ve got a minister friend who believes everyone is inherently bad (kind of like the OP) only it’s because we’re all flawed in comparison to God, and he honestly doesn’t seem to sweat his moral inferiority that much. So it all depends on the person, I guess.
I envy people who are just, ‘‘Meh. Good enough.’’
Thanks, that makes me feel a little better. I am obviously not going to physically hurt anyone but I sure do spend a lot of time thinking about it and find other, non-violent ways to hurt people that have wronged me.
I have been a little lucky though. Many of my worst enemies have died painful deaths on their own through their own stupidity or just through really bad luck. My college roommate that I really grew to hate came down with a terminal brain tumor in his early 30’s and had to kill himself. The person that bullied me in high school came down with maomao disease and, while he didn’t die yet, he is disabled. That is just a sample and the list goes on and on. I am sad for their families because many of them are decent people and even friends but I don’t feel bad for my enemies at all. I am even a little happy when I find out one of them gets killed or something horrible happens to them.
My mother jokes that I need to quit wishing death, disease and dismemberment on people because it seems to work too well. I only have a couple left at this point and I am going to throw a parade if one of them gets killed in a car wreck or something equally bad.
I was taught that you shouldn’t ever feel that way about anyone so I think that is where the cognitive dissonance comes in. You are probably right that it isn’t abnormal though. European history (among most others) and even the Bible itself are just a really long series of revenge stories with an addendum that tries to tell people that it isn’t nice to whack off heads or burn people in oil.
Poe’s Law…?
But then you go and do something like this:
You may have some anger issues, but you’re not evil.
mc
I see the world around me. Parents cussing at their kids at the grocery store. People on the internet being unabashedly racist and sexist and ignorant. I read stories on Reddit that remind me how depraved human beings really are (and that’s just the r/relationships subreddit. I’m not even talking about r/MorbidReality or r/Rage). People at work being obnoxious and having a “Fuck you” attitude towards anyone who has a problem with their obnoxiousness. And then I look at myself.
Yes, I have flaws. I’m far from perfect. But I don’t do those things. I don’t pick fights. I don’t go out of my way to annoy people or make their lives harder. Now, when I die, no one is going to say I lit up any rooms with my eternal sunshine. No one is even going to say I’m the type of person who’d take the shirt off her back if someone else needed it. No, I’m the type of person who’d raise some money for them so they can buy their own shirt, since I don’t intend to make myself cold to keep anyone warm, barring some very special circumstances.
But I don’t fixate on how “bad” I am anymore. “Bad” is a concept that should actually mean something. By lumping myself in with people who really do shitty things (like abusing their kids), I’m tossing all perspective and critical thinking out of the window.
Maybe “bad” is an apt descriptor for you, but I doubt it based on your posting history. You strike me as a complicated person who doesn’t always operate in a optimal fashion, just like everyone else. So unless you’ve been withholding some juicy stories from us, I sincerely doubt that you are a bad person. Compared to the typical Doper, you’re probably an angel.
Shagnasty, what you’ve described of your animosity toward some people is disturbing to me. I simply cannot relate to such feelings.
I say this not as a judgment on your character, or any kind of insult, but as a response to what seems to be your theory that everyone shares your experience in some way, shape, or manner; or perhaps to a differing degree. I can only speak for myself, but what you’ve described is completely foreign to me.
I agree with this. I don’t think people should be judged for their thoughts or feelings, necessarily, if it doesn’t impact their actions. But I’ve never felt that way about anybody.
The closest I can come is I once felt a kind of grim satisfaction at the ‘‘just convicted’’ tears of that piece of shit cop who raped a bunch of women using his legal authority as a threat. I think most people have their ‘‘burn in hell’’ moments, but seeing someone in a state of prolonged suffering is really disturbing to me no matter who it is. Someone once argued here that if you aren’t happy to see bad people suffer, you must yourself be really messed up, and I don’t know if it’s true. I don’t know how many people can relate to what Shagnasty is saying.
[QUOTE=monstro]
But I don’t fixate on how “bad” I am anymore. “Bad” is a concept that should actually mean something. By lumping myself in with people who really do shitty things (like abusing their kids), I’m tossing all perspective and critical thinking out of the window.
Maybe “bad” is an apt descriptor for you, but I doubt it based on your posting history. You strike me as a complicated person who doesn’t always operate in a optimal fashion, just like everyone else. So unless you’ve been withholding some juicy stories from us, I sincerely doubt that you are a bad person. Compared to the typical Doper, you’re probably an angel.
[/QUOTE]
I think I’m getting closer to accepting myself without overly harsh judgment, it’s just a belief that sticks sometimes. I impose some pretty harsh ethical imperatives on myself at times, but it’s a losing game because nobody can ever live up to their own standards. I get something out of the act of trying, like I would rather try and fail than never try at all. I acknowledge that it is complicated and sub-optimal. 
Your words are appreciated, I just have to figure out how to get that sense of assurance from my own self. As it sounds like you’ve faced this hurdle yourself, any pointers would be appreciated.
That is why I started the thread. I wanted to see if other people have similar experiences or thoughts. I am usually described as “very kind” in person but also aloof and hard to know. I love kids and animals for example but the vast majority of adults leave me cold. I will be the first person to help you in an emergency even if I have to put myself in danger (part of that is my job) but I am not going to help anyone move just because they didn’t plan ahead. I am a pretty extreme introvert and I only enjoy being around a very small number of people. Another marriage is right out because I don’t see the point. I look at most relationships except biological family in capitalistic terms. If I think I am getting screwed on the deal, then there is no reason to continue it.
I don’t think I have the exact same feelings as Monstro but her responses in this thread are the ones that most closely match mine. It takes all types to make the world. I have former friends that told me I was too hard to get to know even though I was always on time and followed through on my commitments. They didn’t. I fail to the downside of getting rid of dead weight.
Other personality types have their issues as well. There are extreme extroverts that claim to know everyone while truly knowing no one because they are so fundamentally self-centered despite the presentation. This thread isn’t about me specifically although I will respond with my world-view. Lots of different types of people have their own issues. Good vs evil is just shorthand because almost everyone can understand what it means.
We focus too much time on personality strengths versus weaknesses IMO. This thread is just to talk about the latter.
Hurt other people for entertainment?
Never. In my whole life. I can’t even grasp its appeal.
In your OP it seemed as if you are equating doing or thinking evil with being evil. This is not something I agree with. I don’t believe people are evil. And I hope that you don’t really believe that you are evil.
mc
I know it sounded like I was joking when I mentioned reddit, but I’m being 100% honest. I used to feel really down on myself before I started hanging out there. After reading the millionth tale of woe written by someone stuck in a bad relationship, I stopped torturing myself for being single and unattached. My parents suddenly became paragons of virtue after listening to all the stories about abusive parents. My disadvantages and inadequacies don’t seem all that bad compared to all the shittiness that other redditors have to deal with. Getting a glimpse into the lives of messed-up people has made me appreciate how very non-messed up I am, in the big scheme of things.
I’m one of those pathetic people who can’t help but to rate myself relative to other people. I’ve spent most of my life comparing myself to people who seem “better” than me, because those are the people who I’m surrounded with in real life. But the internet has helped me to broaden my perspective by showing me the bigger picture of humanity. I may never win an award for having the best character, but I can at least take consolation in the notion that I’m not bad.
I never said for entertainment. I am talking about things like someone shooting your dog for wandering onto someone else’s property, bullies forcing your teenagers daughter’s head on the ground while they pour Gatorade all over her in her new school clothes or vandalizing your vehicle. Yes, all of those things have happened to me. I can’t see how a normal person wouldn’t see red and want them dead.
Of course you don’t do that because you will get in trouble.
Thank you. You are very rational and make a great distinction. Thinking something and acting upon it are two very different things. I don’t do anything that could be truly considered evil but I have thought about it plenty of times and I think that is normal but something that is rarely talked about. I am a Boy Scout in day to day life and I have no interest in hurting someone that doesn’t instigate the problem first. Unfortunately, there are a number of people that enjoy playing offense rather than defense.
I am a deeply introverted person and also have social anxiety so I’m not exactly a crowd-pleaser in the exciting and dynamic sense. But the relationships that I do have are deeply important to me and it usually takes several times of people fucking me over before I will let them go. I am a deeply loyal person. You know, it took 33 years with my Mom. So internally it seems like I am the opposite of you. Not only do I not like it when people who have wronged me suffer, I feel guilty when they do.
But it seems my view of myself is roughly as dim as your view of yourself, so this indicates that our evaluations of ourselves is highly subjective and probably arbitrary.
Human nature is a dark beast. We all have in us, to some degree or another, the ability to commit evil acts. For some of us it might take an extreme situation like prolonged imprisonment or torture or living under an authoritarian regime, but I keep myself in check at least by reminding myself that there is some situation somewhere that would break me. I do have rage issues, internally. I’m so angry sometimes that I can’t sleep at night. I keep that shit in check by writing about angry, violent people who also struggle with seeing themselves as good. I view them as a reflection of my internal self. People know know me sometimes find my writing shocking because it is so different than the loving, compassionate person they know.
We all have it in us.
Around 10 or 11, I accepted that some degree selfishness was a character flaw with me. My culture does place an emphasis on providing for others and sharing, especially between family members. But as I have always had to work damn hard for any money or material goods I had, there were times when I just couldn’t share with my siblings or cousins. The mental law I eventually worked out for my conscious was that it that as long as others had the things they needed sharing was no longer necessary to the point of everyone equally receiving their wants.
But the OP question implies that we are all evil?
This is surely not the case. In fact, though I am a newbie here, I highly doubt that we have more than a few truly evil members. We might have none. But if we do, the percentage is surely under 5% or so.
DO you truly think everyone is evil? You’re not one of those religious types that believes that we don’t have the right to exist outside of Hell–or however they put it–without god’s grace, I hope? I try to avoid that sort.
What do you think constitutes evil?
Please elaborate.
Thanks.