I can believe it. I’ve personally witnessed a cat with no front claws climb trees, on multiple occasions.
Websters New Collegiate Dictionary
phalange: n, the singular of phalanx. one of the digital bones of the hand or or foot of the vertebrae.
(I never said it was a joint. It would be hard to remove a joint.)
I KNOW what I said. I don’t think my cats were happy about getting declawed, but they lived. I don’t think they were very happy about being spayed either, but they lived. But they have managed swimmingly with both.
I
Even if your older cat is declawed, I don’t think this will be a problem. He will teach the youngster who is the boss even without claws, and with the dominance established, the kitten’s claws won’t matter, even when s/he grows up. By the way, I believe that a female kitten is probably a better choice–mixed gender pairs of cats seem to be the most compatible. And not just in the way you are thinking.
Kilgore Trout Read the first post (the one where the word was actually used, correctly I might add). Since there seemed to be some confusion over the word it was simplified.
voguevixen
I don’t suppose you’d want to appologize to me for calling me a liar?
Hmmm, ok sure…Sorry about that. Could you tell me though HOW they did it? Now I’m curious, lol.
They grab the tree with their front legs (like you would with your arms) and propel themselves with the claws on their back feet. They use the front legs for stability. They can do it pretty quickly too!
Just to ease any concern, Jane is leash trained so he doesn’t roam about freely. While I acknowledge that some individuals may consider this cruel, I do not. He was leash trained to safeguard him from the dangers of traffic and neighbors’ dogs. It also insures that he will not venture onto my neighbors property and antagonize their pets. Our new kitty will be leash trained also.
Jane still has his back claws, so he is not totally defenseless.
At this point, I’m still leaning towards declawing the front paws, but I’ll hear y’all out. robinh has pretty much addressed the opposition up to this point.
By my count, we’ve got exactly one post with facts (albeit secondhand) from an actual expert: Robinh actually asked a vet. Everything else so far sounds like just WAGing, and is particularly patronizing at that.
Let me add another post quoting experts. We had four cats at one time. One was a hungry stray that used her claws constantly, but was far too old and heavy to consider declawing. A second was adopted as a kitten from a litter. The other two were discovered wild as kittens abandoned by their mother. Although they were quite young, they displayed a lot of aggressive tendencies towards both people and the other cats.
I consulted two different vets about declawing the two young kittens. One repeated the party line that “declawing is cruel” in principle but acknowledged, like Robinh’s vet, that declawed cats really seem to suffer no permanent pain or behavioral changes if the act is done early. The second vet advised that declawing, although it sounds barbaric, is essentially harmless, makes it easier for a lot of people to get more affectionate with their cats, and, if done by a reasonably careful owner at an early stage, is in fact a reasonably humane practice.
We had the younger kittens done at about 5 months (front paws only). Both came back from the vet a little groggy from the anesthetic, and both walked tenderly for a day or so. Within a week, they were back to normal, and, because they were easier to handle, probably began getting more attention than the other two. Close inspection of their paws about a month later revealed no evidence of open wounds that could lead to infection. For the past 5 years, they’ve shown no adverse effects from the operating in any way.
Both go outside fairly often, although we’ve watch them closely when they’re out there. Both have climbed trees like champions, they cooperate to hunt down and catch chipmunks, and they scrap with other neighborhood cats by wrapping with their front paws and kicking with the back (something our clawed cats do frequently also). In short, they’re indistinguishable from clawed cats in every way. They’re both personable and a pleasure to play with. Unlike our clawed cats, we can let them knead our laps to their hearts’ content.
Although I would hate to recommend someone doing harm to animals, I can see nothing wrong with someone having the front paws of a kitten declawed within the first six months of life.
I’ll join with the de-clawers.
My cats were both declawed. It was done by laser. The cat is put under general anesthesia, the claw is popped out and JUST the claw is lasered off. NOT the joints or tips of their “fingers” as it used to be, just the claw. They were home within 2 days and are fine. Yes, as Robinh mentioned, we had to use the litter made from recycled newspapers for a couple weeks, but that was no big deal. They day we brought them home they were both jumping and running as usual.
My two are HUGE scratchers. We tried everything; spray bottles, pennies in a soda can, even an air horn, but they would just scratch when we weren’t around. I even put masking tape on the chair legs (backwards, so the sticky side was out), but one cat would scratch right through it. They had destroyed an antique hall tree, and our dining room chair legs and table legs, the backs of the furniture and the bookshelves. I had bought every type of scratching post sold, even made a couple different kinds from scrap wood and carpet, but they preferred good furniture. I was nearly at the point of returning them to the shelter when the vet explained how simple the procedure is now.
Now they just sharpen their paws.
They never go outside, so defense isn’t a problem. Our vet said basically he would prefer to keep cats clawed, but if it comes down to a cat going to a shelter or someone keeping it, and considering how simple the procedure is now, it’s okay.
This thead is very nearly Pit behavior. But I’m going to move the thread to Great Debates, in hopes that passions will ease just a teensy bit.
A couple things:
You CAN train a cat not to claw the furniture. I’ve had good luck with spray bottles of water - spritz the kitty when he claws the sofa. Also, make sure you provide a scratching post so there is a place for kitty to use. Loads of praise or using the scratching post and voila, a cat that is intact and a sofa that is too.
Declawing is not something to enter lightly. Claws are the cat’s first line of defense. A cat with no claws will start off defending himself by biting, since he has no claws, and a biting cat can do a lot more damage. Full declawing (removing front and back) also dooms a cat that accidentally gets outside.
If you aren’t willing to invest the time it takes to train the cat not to claw mom’s antique whatever, either don’t get a cat or ditch the antiques. Amputation is a drastic kind of thing to do.
–tygre, who’d have a kitty or three if hubby wasn’t allergic 
I have to chime in that declawing is not necessary. We had one declawed (done before we got him) cat and 8 clawed cats in our house when I was a kid (not all at once). None of the clawed cats ever went after the furniture–and it wasn’t because they went through any extensive training either. The declawed cat never had any problems with the clawed ones, either, if that’s what you’re worried about, as Brynda said, he let the others know he was in charge and they never challenged him for it.
Like others have said before me, if you want a cat without claws, then you do not want a cat. remember the debate about “twisty cats” (cats bred to be deformed and walk funny in a way that some sick souls thought was cute)? It’s the same deal. It just isn’t right to deform an animal for your own pleasure and conveinance. Even if you are taking care of a cat that would otherwise be in the pound. We don’t have the right to mutilate things just because we are doing them a favor. Cutting off the tops of a kid’s fingers isn’t allowed, even if you did adopt him from some terrible situation.
It is fairly easy to train cats not to scratch on furniture (we just use a rope scratching pole). Your older cat will establish dominance her own way, without claws. There are plenty of households with one declawed cat and one that isn’t. Cat social skill involve a lot more than brute force.
Finally, if for any reason your cat does get out, despite what others may say, being declawed is a major disadvantage to survival. Cats are clever creaters and can escape from almost any bonds. And can you be sure you can find someone willing to keep your cat 100% indoors in the unlikely incedence that something bad should happen to you?
I wish you best of luck with your new cat, and I wish your new cat best of luck with you.
As for myself we found a stray with no front claws one day and when we didnt feed him he did fine killing his own prey. As long as its done early it doesent matter one way or another i guess. Its like debating wether a bald person who always wears a hat or a person with alot of hair who wears a hat is better off.
for those who justify declawing because the cats ruin your furniture…
suppose i bought a tiger. what if the tiger kept eating my children? do i remove the tiger’s teeth? no. i get rid of the tiger. if i am not prepared to accept what the tiger does, or not prepared to train him to do otherwise, then i have no right owning a tiger.
cats claw things. that is what they do. just because you have no clue how to take care of a cat, you should rip out his claws?
So I’m just gonna answer the question that was asked in the thread title: IN THE WOMB!
Now to read the thread.
so I am prepared to answer Lib’s specific concern:
(and why do Lib’s posts so often make me think of the phrase “everything looks like a nail”?)
Anyway, Lib, if the kitten is peaceful and honest, it should keep its fingernails intact.
Otherwise, break out the needlenose pliers and the cauterizing machine.
Now to read some responses.
Habitual wise-asses back away.
Not from the opinion that kitty-declawing is A-OK. Just from the remark about needle-nose pliers.
Please don’t take me to the Pit.
Re declawing. Prob not nessesary, and a LITTLE cruel. 1st, train your cat to put up with having the toenails clipped ( by doing one claw, then reward, etc), next, add a few more scatching posts. There sb at least 1, prob 2, per cat. And try different kinds, also (there is one that goes on the floor, with catnip scented cardboard, that 1 cat REALLY likes). Next, unless you have a farm, and they are working farm cats, cats should never go outside. Claws or no, being run over is still dead.
Now, if clipping, training and extra posts don’t work, then try the 'cups", little plastic cups that go over the claws.
If that is not feasable, then try the laser proc, it is the least cruel.
In other words, what I am saying is: never get a cat with the intention of declawing. But, as some do not take to the training, it is better to declaw than to “de-cat”.
Look, folks, “moderation”.