When would a minority of people be religious and how would society look like?

The bit by eldubose63 you quoted was an effort to try defending the old canard about atheists in foxholes, and given his repeated statements that “everyone is spiritual/religious”, I obviously took it as meaning “looking to someone or something” in a religious sense. And I’ve never done that.

The circumstance under which Ike said those words:
Dwight Eisenhower: There are No Atheists in Foxholes - SELF-EDUCATED AMERICAN (selfeducatedamerican.com)
"In remarks broadcast from the White House as part of the American Legion “Back-to-God” Program, February 7, 1954, President Eisenhower stated:

As a former soldier, I am delighted that our veterans are sponsoring a movement to increase our awareness of God in our daily lives. In battle, they learned a great truth-that there are no atheists in the foxholes. They know that in time of test and trial, we instinctively turn to God for new courage…Whatever our individual church, whatever our personal creed, our common faith in God is a common bond among us.

At the next year’s “Back-to-God” Program, February 20, 1955, Eisenhower stated:

Without God, there could be no American form of Government, nor an American way of life. Recognition of the Supreme Being is the first – the most basic – expression of Americanism."
In other words, he was telling an audience of voters exactly what they wanted to hear.

LOL :sweat_smile: :rofl: :joy:

Being an atheist does not require one to suspend all sense of wonder and appreciation of nature and the universe in which we live. If you think hard about it, spirituality is in no way required for you to appreciate everything you’ve described.

Here are some atheists in foxholes, in cockpits and on ships:
Military Association of Atheists & Freethinkers | Atheists in Foxholes, in Cockpits, and on Ships - Military Association of Atheists & Freethinkers (militaryatheists.org)

As I said above:

But here is a fresh stick for that deceased equine.

Make the quote, then claim that contesting the quote is pointless?
Sounds fair to me. :roll_eyes:

Check your facts, I didn’t make the quote.

But you supported it.

nevermind

I appreciate your comment. To be honest, I’m 58 and all of my life, no matter how I tried, I could never wrap my head around the idea everything, all of it just happening by accident. When I look around in nature, I see design everywhere in the trees, animals, the stars. When I lost my right side back in 2016 due to smoke inhalation from a fire while I was asleep, my two pitties Jasper and Bones jumped on my bed and pawed and licked me awake. Well, I managed to get the fire out but passed out landing my neck on my steel fire stove. Next thing I remember was waking up with Jasper and Bones licking me all in the face and whining. That’s when I realized that my whole right side was gone with no feeling whatsoever. I managed to push and pull myself across the floor to call my girlfriend who in turn called 911 for me. Anyhow, after reflecting on it I was so thankful for my boys and the natural instinct they had to save me. I don;t know about you but I thank God for giving them that instinctual wisdom which saved my life that night. I would not have made it if not for them. Sorry I took so long to reply. Takes me a while to type.

So some of us have told their anecdotes about life threatening episodes in their life that didn’t have any spiritual impact on them, and you have shared yours. I see that you as a person cannot come up with an explanation that’s not spiritual, and that’s ok and I believe you, but please believe our personal experiences as well. How does it follow that your spiritual explanation applies to each and every other person on the planet? That’s a big fallacy.

No apologies necessary and I’m sorry that you’ve had to overcome something so obviously traumatic and difficult in your life.

I can type out a long post on why your dogs behaved they way they did, or question your decision to call your girlfriend rather than 911 (unless she works for the fire department … :wink: ), but all that would just be me trying to talk you out of a position that you were never logically talked into. All I ask, is that you consider the possibility that there are other, more plausible explanations to those of intelligent design and God.

If you are curious and willing to explore these ideas, I recommend you read a few popular and well respected books on the subjects of nature and the universe: The Selfish Gene by Richard Dawkins, The Moral Animal by Robert Wright, The Universe from Nothing by Lawrence Krauss. There are many other great books on the subjects you raised here, but I find these are most accessible to people looking for scientific explanations rather than spiritual or religious ones.

Thanks. Yeah, I’ve pondered that decision many times and still don’t know what I was thinking. :grinning: I appreciate your suggestions. By the way, with much therapy, my condition has improved to the point of getting around on my walker. Very grateful for that. Gotta go and have a good one.

Good for the dogs. We used to raise guide dogs, and knew the story of the blind person whose dog led him down the stairs of the WTC during 9/11, saving his life.
But maybe you should thank hundreds of generations of dog breeders who turned wolves into the dogs we have today who have the bred in responses to save you.
Study evolution - and the books mentioned are a good place to start - and you’ll see that we and everything else evolved for reproductive advantage, not by accident.
But I tend to prefer accident for some things. Is it more comforting to think that some god sentenced hundreds of thousands of people, including children and babies, to die in tsunamis? I much prefer that this is because of uncaring natural forces.
I care about the earth because we live here. How many of the devoutly religious seem to think god gave us the earth, and that since he’s going to take some number of us into heaven it doesn’t matter if we wreck it. Some evangelicals care about the earth, but way many don’t.
I don’t have a spiritual bone in my body - it seems to be genetic - and I’ve done just fine. It is very relaxing to not find a cause for the horrible things that happen to some people. It is humbling to know that the good things that have happened to me don’t come from blessings by god (which would be funny given that I don’t believe in him) but by the good fortune of my genes.

“Very unusual” =/= “just doesn’t happen”, which was the whole of my point.

Sure, and…?

Not always Western. And pretty much, yes, it does exist in most of the world, since Christianity and Islam are more than half the world.

Only pedants say “most” when they mean “barely more than half”.

And that’s ignoring that a proportion of the 1.9 billion Christians included there are not going to be "regular church attendance & clear membership " Christians. Nominal Christians exist, and may even be the majority (if you believe the 1.2 billion figure one guy proposes in Wikipedia - seems a little high to me). I don’t see how folks like that are any different from Mijin’s Chinese folk religionists, quite frankly.

Did you not use that very word, when referring to less than half?