In a Guardian/ICM poll published today, “an overwhelming majority see religion as a cause of division and tension - greatly outnumbering the smaller majority who also believe that it can be a force for good.”
Moveover, “the poll also reveals that non-believers outnumber believers in Britain by almost two to one.”
I would be interested in hearing American perspectives on this - if you think you had some take on GB, how does this seem?
It seems to me that religion in Western Europe is more personal than it is here. It seems that here in the U.S. people make a point of proclaiming their religion. From large and small vinyl stickers and religious vanity plates (number plates) on cars, to office cubicles adorned with crosses and religious messages, it seems inescapable. It’s as if they’re in some sort of contest to see who’s the most holy, with prizes. ‘I’m going for the toaster oven, God!’ My impression in other countries (with notable exceptions) that people are either religious or they aren’t, but they don’t make such a big deal of it.
From the article:
Or more precisely - a **non-**religious country of many faiths. I wonder if that was what they actually meant to say.
Not just the US. In Latin America this is normal behaviour too. In the UK, in contrast, while private belief is respected, public displays of piety are the subject of mockery. Celebrities do not rush to let the public know that they are deeply religious the way they do on this side of the pond. Around the time the UK Labour party got elected in 1997, the spin doctors were not too keen to highlight the fact that Blair is religious, for fear that it might harm his credibility, IIRC.
On the whole, though, being non-religious, an agnostic or an atheist is far more common and socially acceptable in the UK. When I lived there, in the circles I inhabited it was more or less the default. It was surprising to find out that a friend, acquaintance or colleague was anything else.
That’s one of the ‘notable exceptions’. 
I think the credit or blame, depending on your point of view, lies largely with the influences of Marx and Sartre on European culture. Socialism and existentialism, especially combined, practically demand that atheism be axiomatic.
I’m thinking too that with so many prior fights and wars over religion, they’ve already gone through all that, and-I don’t want to say they’ve moved beyond that, that they’re somehow above the US and such.
It might also be part of the culture too-reserved and private, perhaps?
Lib, if that were the case, then you wouldn’t see the big religious displays in Eastern Europe, where they’ve experienced communism and such directly.
Nope, the original newspaper article referred to this aspect several times, so it’s not a misprint.
I think it is great that religion is on the decline in the UK and Western Europe. I am jealous of their success in these matters.
I keep hoping the current tide of religious fervor in this country dies out, but then I remember that the deeply religious folk are outbreeeding the agnostics, Unitarians and Atheists.
How does Scotland do in these Polls? If things get any crazier here in the US with AI & Creationism, maybe I could move to Scotland or the Lake District. I love those regions and would like to live there. How hard is it to immigrate to the UK from the US?
Even this board surprises me with the numbers of religious folk.
Jim
You would, because in Eastern Europe, religious display is an opposition to and a resistance to Communism. They’re religious because the Communists tried to suppress it, in other words.
I don’t think that religion, per se, is incredibly low in Britain, in the sense that atheism is on the rise. I think if you asked people if they believed in a god, or some higher being, most people would say yes. OTOH, if you asked people if they were Christian, or Jewish or so on they’d say no. So it’s less of a decrease in actual faith, more of a decrease in taking part in organised religion.
Total WAG on my part, though.
I once read (and I wish I had a cite !) that in England, more people can be found in mosques on Friday than in churches on Sunday. Not percentages, but in actual numbers.
Can anybody find some statistics on church attendance?
And if its true, what does that say about the future of British society?
Here’s some 2005 figures for Christian church attendance. Not sure of the veracity but it looks about right at a bit over 3 million per Sunday. This claims 930,000 mosque worshippers per Friday. I think the confusion is about Church of England as opposed to all other denominations.
Nothing notable, in my opinion.
Although I can be a militant atheist at times, I’m tempted to agree with you here. The fact that most Brits’ reaction to all this is ‘meh’ indicates how a society can function quite happily with very little reliance on or reference to religion.
Then it’s contradictory - all the findings point to Britain being secular, so how can most respondents also describe the country as ‘religious’?
Because it’s a question about how people perceive the country to be, as a whole.
Above all, what the survey highlights is the difficulty in quantifying religious belief (and absence of): “A clear majority, 63%, say that they are not religious - including more than half of those who describe themselves as Christian.” It would appear to me that many are using ‘Christian’ as a social identity which is not inherently connected with a belief in the New Testament.
On a couple of occasions, I’ve followed this line of questioning with somebody who describes their religion as C of E:
And so on. Sometimes, people will not believe in anything at all which you could describe as specifically Christian, but will still self-identify with a Christian denomination. Because to do otherwise would be to reject something which has been part of their upbringing.
IMHO one of the big problems is that the Church of England are largely a bunch of jackasses, more concerned with handwringing. They’ve forgotten that organised religion is primarily social, and only secondarily religious, and not political. A church service isn’t a form of entertainment, it’s a group activity which reinforces the group. As such it should be enjoyable. And they don’t know the art of public speaking.
Including - who was it, the Bishop of Durham?
I can follow that, being an atheist Jew, but I would still make the distinction between “my country is made up of people of many faiths” and “a religious country”.
Clarification - my previous post was in reply to GorillaMan’s.
Annoyingly, I can’t find the original questions of the poll online (they were in the paper which I don’t have handy), and they’re not on the ICM site yet. But I’m suspecting the way the questions were phrased had some influence.
That’s an excellent point. Often, it’s much more exciting and romantic to flirt with a thing (like communism) than actually to live in it. I can see where young people especially might be influenced by things they find in principle to be ideal. Maybe the directness you mention shocks the senses.