In a week when religious freedom and privilege have been hot topics, we have just had a fascinating insight into the beliefs and motivations of UK Christians.
A little background. We had a census taken last year and the results are still to be published but in the same week of the Census the Richard Dawkins Foundation commissioned Ipso/Mori to conduct a poll on those who *self identified *as Christians in the census.
[ul]
[li]54% of those polled identify as Christian and when that group were questioned further…[/li][li] [/li][li]Asked where they seek most guidance in questions of right and wrong, only 10% of Census-Christians said it was from religious teachings or beliefs[/li]
[li]37% of them have never or almost never prayed outside a church service[/li]
[li]Just a third (32%) believe Jesus was physically resurrected; half (49%) do not think of him as the Son of God[/li][/ul]
So the source is robust, the data is solid and the conclusions are pretty much in line with my impressions of living in the UK. A very, very small proportion of the UK are Christians in any functional sense. They identify as such mainly for cultural and historical reasons and it is not an important part of their lives.
It is something often suspected but we’ve been missing hard data on it. This gives weight to the argument against religious privilege.
That matches my impression of the UK pretty well. Most people don’t practice of even think about religion and if prompted will give some sort of vague ‘I believe in something but I don’t know what’ answer, which I assume simply means that they don’t care either way
Exactly, which prompts the question, Who the hell does Warsi think she is representing? This data shows that few people actually want religion mixed up in politics.
In the UK ticking the Christian box in the census is practically the default position. Until recently I’ve done it myself despite not being religious. It is in no way an indication I/we are devout or give a flying rats ass about religion except as a way to get our kids into the best schools (which are often Faith based as they are allowed to practice selection and can discriminate in favour of church going families).
It certainly does not mean we want to see it up front and in our faces in public life even if we’re quite happy to have its harmless trappings as part of the pagentry of state occasions.
But what we do have since 2001 is greater reference to it as an identity response to real or imagined islamism and immigration.
It is the feeling that we are threatened by those who (real or imagined) do take religion so seriously it is their primary identity/loyalty.
Again this is connected with the impact of immigration (not to mention US and African missionary work).
My strong impression is that the UK is becoming more secular but there is a growing vocal religious minority ready to nail themselves up if they aren’t allowed to discriminate against gays or have prayers minuted in council meetings (when they can quite legally hold prayers before the start of the meeting, just not during it) etc.
Yet despite all this persecution the local evangelical group is in the town centre every weekend spewing their hatred of gays and other sinners unmolested.
I’ve yet to see an atheist counterpart. Nor am I aware of reserved seats for atheists in The House of Lords.
Yet should Dawkins open his mouth or a There is no God’ poster get stuck on the side of a bus then it’s hammering time.
As usual what ‘christianity is under attack’ means is ‘being called on our bullshit’.
It’s funny that you would include (1) in a thread discussing the fact that many Britons who self-identify as Christians are not religious. Why do you think Britons who self-identify as Muslims are, by definition, religious?
Just a slight nitpick. The pollsters questioned people who said, when asked, that that they self identified as Christians in the census. So they asked people what their answer was on the census, then asked further questions of those who answered Christian. I am sure the UK census does not give out data that associates names with answers on the census form. That would be criminal in the US.
Correct, this needs to be clarified as some people are picking up the percentages quoted and imagining that they apply to the whole population…not so.
e.g. only 10% of 54% said they got their ideas of right and wrong from religious teachings or beliefs.
suggests that pollsters contacted people based on how they answered the census. My nitpick is not about the data but the suggestion that pollsters have access to individual information from the census forms, which would be illegal in the US and, I hope, illegal in the UK. The pollsters did not visit people who answered Christian, or anything else, on their census form because they have no way of knowing that.
That does add another layer of uncertainty to the poll data when compared to the census data but that wasn’t my point.
I’m not surprised by some of these results, but I’m very surprised to see that 49% do not believe Jesus is the son of God. As I see it there is no way to be a Christian in any sense of the word without believing that. Unless 49% of British “Christians” are so ignorant they don’t understand the most basic and central belief of Christianity, I can only assume something is wrong somewhere with the polls. Either half of those who listed themselves as Christian in the census are practically lying (not just ticking it because of some vague belief, but with NO belief in it at all) or the Richard Dawkins Foundation poll was not conducted well. The latter seems most likely to me.
English Anglican Christianity is very weak tea even among the clergy. They are ticking it because of ‘some vague belief’. That phrase practically defines Church of England theology. Being C of E has nothing whatsoever to do with belief in any tenet of Christianity or caring one fig one way or the other and being a nominal Christian in England is nothing like being one in the USA where religion is actually taken seriously.
The poll was conducted by MORI and not liking their results is not grounds for thinking that MORI have suddenly forgotten how to conduct a standard poll.
I suspect that those are people who check Christian because they come from a Christian tradition. They celebrate Christmas with gift giving and caroling and crackers, and celebrate Easter with Eggs etc. Basically there is a lot of Christian tradition one can be a part of without actually believing the doctrine.
I suspect that those are people who check Christian because they come from a Christian tradition. They celebrate Christmas with gift giving and caroling and crackers, and celebrate Easter with Eggs, believe in love thy neighbor etc. Basically there is a lot of Christian tradition one can be a part of without actually believing the doctrine.
Quite. The C of E is one big club we’re all born into. It’s only when women or gays start getting uppity that it summons up any enthusiasm for doctrine.
We’re maybe taught to recite The Lords Prayer at school and get taught a few Bible stories (unless you go to a real hard core religious school). And if you asked us to name the Holy Trinity I suspect The Easter Bunny would get a lot of mentions.
One can follow what a person says without accepting their divinity. I think Granny Weatherwax is wise beyond measure but I don’t actually think she exists. (though the genius of Terry Pratchett is such that we all know a Granny Weatherwax)
No, this is one of the reasons for the survey in the first place. People in the UK tick “christian” without giving any real thought to it, they certainly aren’t religious in any meaningful sense (see the other poll results) and yet the religious powers use this inflated number in order to justify their privileged positions.
It was a MORI poll, not an RDF poll. You can be absolutely sure that this was rigorous. And take it from those of us in the UK, this is bang-on with our own personal experiences.
I know of very few religious people. Those few I do know disagree on the more homophobic and sexist proclamations of their religious leaders (muslims seem to be the exception to this). I certainly know of people who would claim to be christian just because they think Jesus (whether real or a character) said some nice stuff that they broadly agree with. They would be horrified to think that some bishop sees fit to speak for them.
