We are looking for a school with an emphisis on teaching the basics without all the religious crap. I am an atheist and my wife is an agnostic. Our soon-to-be 4 year old son is attending a private school now but with a christian indoctination program. They say the pledge to our flag (of course) followed by the pledge to the Bible and then another pledge to the christian flag of the school. WTF!
However, our attempts at looking into a regular daycare were met with simple babysitting without teaching and in small, over capacity rooms. Little more than holding areas.
How can I get my son on a solid footing in education with the sciences, math and history without all the mythology baggage? We want him to be aware of the religions of others but not have it drilled into his young mind.
Where are the secular private schools that are needed so badly these days?
If your “where are they?” question was genuine", there are many excellent secular private schools in the Boston area. Then again, Boston is an education capital and leans towards that sort of thing. So, they do exist.
It may be a little harder to find in Florida. Have you considered a Montessori school? They are spread out everywhere and tend to be secular. Here is a sample one in Florida.
I know fiour places that have great secular schools. Two in cities. Two in very pretty suburbs. They have great emphasis on science and math, with a terrific curriculum in the liberal arts. Not to mention healthy and sane sports programs. There is no violence, and no indoctrination of any kind. But, I’m not going to tell you where they are. Because, it seems, you are in need of an education yourself, manners-wise. It’s mind boggling that you wouldn’t realize that some readers (myself included, who does not attend services of any denomination) would be offended at the tenor of your query. You’re fully entitled to your opinion, but if you’re asking for someone’s help, you might want to be polite. So, I suggest keeping your kid in the school he is in. It sounds like he’ll get a good education. Plus, he’ll probably learn what it seems he won’t at home: manners.
Thanks for the help. We do understand manners and your condescension and side-stepping of the OP is what we want our son to be removed from. I suspect we have a better understanding of what he needs than you. If some little toes have been stepped on, I am sorry. The frustration of trying to find a school that teaches FACTS is what is mind-boggling.
Again, thanks.
Shagnasty- It is completely geunine. Thanks for the useful input.
Are there no good public schools around you? Do you open enrollment programs in Florida?
I would hope so, but I know this isn’t always the case.
A side note of sorts. I went to public, christian, and catholic schools growing up, and I now teach at a public school. I found that while the christian schools normally did push thier particular brand of religion in many ways, that the catholic schools normally did not.
Most of the catholic schools I have known of are very well thought of when it comes to academics.
Good luck in your search.
If you’re looking for a school in the Fort Myers area, consider Canterbury School, my alma mater. Or if you’re in Naples, our biggest rivals were Community School. If Lee and Collier counties can each support private, secular schools, I’m sure wherever you are in Florida can’t be too far from one. If you want more info on Canterbury, e-mail me and I’ll tell you what I know.
Have you looked into Waldorf Education? While there are definitely Christian philosphies underlying their work, I’ve not found them terribly offensively expressed. I suppose it would depend quite a bit on the administration and teachers of each particular school, but the two we have around here are not overtly Christian. In fact, they’ve been pretty pagan-friendly to me and my friends. Very inclusive of personal beliefs (or lack of), but still insistent on teaching morality and personal responsibility. Check out the link for theories, philosophies and learning strategies that are involved.
Did I mention they’re obnoxiously expensive? That’s why we haven’t been able to send our kid there, unfortunately.
Waldorf Schools are weeeiiiird. I know. I went to one. As for your religious concerns, we certainly learned about religion. We aknowleged and sort of celebrated Jewish and Christian holidays as they came around, but it was certainly not indoctrinatory. From my experience, these schools are a really good fit for some kids, and an awful fit for others. I also suggest looking into it, but this may not be what you’re looking for.
Our son is in K3 now but soon to K4. I don’t know how much the local public system addresses this age. It’s my understanding that they do not. I appreciate the input on the Catholic schools. I would not have thought it to be this way. The one he’s in is not Catholic.
SanibelMan- the email is sent. Please look for it and let me know if it doesn’t get there.
WhyNot-I will look into the Waldorf Schools but the cost may be prohibitive.
Thanks everyone. These are good leads.
My children attend this school.
Very small, only about 400 students, K-12, with a 100% college placement record. My children attend as day students, although there are a number of boarders, many of them from foreign countries.
I’ll get behind WhyNot on Waldorf.
2 of my 3 kids would have been eaten alive in the impersonal one-size-fits-all public school system. By the administration as well as the kids who are quietly taught to berate anything different. Waldorf, when done right, celebrates difference and lets each kid figure out where they fit in socially, and to recognize that everyone’s different. They get that crap out of the way shortly after kindergarten, so the time in the grades is more easily spent learning stuff they’ll actually need to know. The experience is a deeply spiritual one but reasonably nondenominational. Any observation of Judeo-Christian holidays comes from the from the simple reality that this is the background of most of the kids in the school, as opposed to indoctrinating them into a culture. There is a lot of emphasis on religion and myth, but it’s done in the spirit of putting those beliefs into perspective of the child’s life and daily experience–they get the kids to relate to what the Greek/Roman gods were like as individuals, how the poeple of the time related to them, and how the gods reflect characteristics of all of us–which provides another link between people of the past and us. Jesus, JC prophets, Norse gods and others are treated the same way.
When Waldorf is NOT done right, yeah, it’s definitely weeeiiiird, but then the same can be said about any school methodology. And the cost…well, cost is all relative isn’t it? My ex & I have chosen to live like paupers in order to keep the kids there–we care that much about them being ok with who they are and where they fit. The self confidence that comes from that is rare and a positive boon when facing a world that will only see the pace of change increase…unless W gets a third & fourth term…
You have made an implicit assumption here that confuses me. He is not yet 4 and you want him to get a good footing in math and sciences already? Or are you looking ahead for schools for when he is in first grade?
If you feel that he needs to start math and science early, then Waldorf is not for you. The philosophy they work off of is that there is no reason for a 6 or 7 year old to learn math and reading. At those ages they emphasize skills that will be used in math and writing, but not the actual process of math or reading. It is supposed to be a more organic process that gently leads into math and reading. Our children went to (and are going to) a Waldorf preschool and liked it a lot.
Also being an atheist, I didn’t even know that Waldorf was based on a Christian philosophy, even after the kids had gone there for a couple of years.
I think my statement about math and such is misleading. In later years I hope he will be in the same school that he has become accustomed to in PreK and that this school is focused on the essentials of learning and critical thinking. The trends set in the PreK enviroment are indicitive, to me at least, of the method and direction of teaching later throughout his learning life.
I also did not mean to give the impression of seperation from all things religious and, more importantly, spiritual. We have Santa and do the Easter Bunny and I want him to have a good grasp of many religions beliefs and value systems. I do not, however, want Creation or ID Science presented as equally likely as evolution and cosmology. Your explanation of the weight given these things at a Waldorf-type institution sounds great.
I have not yet been able to find something along these lines that is not an hour drive each way from where we are (40 mins. North of Orlando) but the search goes on.
Well… as a graduate of a Catholic high school (Jesuit, no less!), I can honestly say that religious dogma never took precedence over science or math at any point. I was taught evolution BY a Jesuit priest, and mathematics by another. It was all very rational and no mumbo-jumbo was involved. I guess (I never asked, and it never came up in class) that the assumption was that it’s reasonable to assume that God works through evolution.
For that matter, the only part of our education that was overly religious in a way people might find offensive was the morning prayer and the occasional mass we had to attend.
Even the theology classes were presented as an academic subject- no questions of belief or anything, just another subject to study. I’m not catholic, and it didn’t even make any difference.
If anything, it was fascinating because I learned so much history and gained so much perspective on Catholic beliefs that I’m better for it, and I think most anyone would benefit from learning about a faith in that manner. I’d actually like to learn about Islam in a similar fashion- it would give me a much better understanding of what all is going on in the world now.
Bump, I love Jesuits, and yes, that’s not an exception on how they teach. Also, for the most part Catholic schools don’t push their faith. I have a few atheist or Protestant friends who attended Catholic private schools (and universities) because they were good academically.
Nicodemus, Catholic private schools (and I’m sure other Christian schools, too) do not push their religion over academics. In fact, in many cases the academic part is the most important one.
The OP is rather vague. How much are you willing to spend? Are you willing to send your son away to a boarding school? Where precisely do you live? Are the public schools in your area so bad that you’re not willing to send your son to them? It seems to me that you’ve probably set yourself up for disappointment here. It sounds like you’re saying, “I don’t want my son to go to the public schools, and I don’t want him to go to a religious school where he’ll be indoctrinated, and I don’t want to send him away to a boarding school.” It’s possible that there simply isn’t any school that fits your requirements.
I don’t know how much variation there is between schools. AFAIK there is no body to inforce a set curriculum between schools.
The one I went to started the kids off with all four basic arithmetic operations in 1st grade. I don’t think you’ll see 5 yr olds doing division most places. They did start reading later, but I’m told by people who know more about education than me that this doesn’t cause any problems down the road. If you want your son reading earlier, just teach him. He may learn on his own anyway.
As for science, I wasn’t at the school for later years, but we definitely had some science. I remember arguing (3rd grade I think) with the teacher about how rabbits were lagomorphs, not rodents, when we were having some sort of discussion about mammals. This school only went through 8th grade, which I think is typical. How much science do kids typically learn before high school? I know I went to some more academically rigorous schools for junior high, and I still learned most of my science from reading things outside of class.
Tuition is probably $10-15,000/year, but a lot of schools will charge you less if you simply cannot pay that much (not so much if you just don’t want to pay that much.)
Two popular secular private school methods are Montessori and Carden. If I understand correctly, Carden schools are strong on math; I don’t know about science. You could Google the term or something, I’m sorry I don’t know more but have to run now.
Okay. Once more. My son is in 3K. I am not looking to send him off anywhere like boarding school. I don’t expect him to start learning calculus in first grade. I think a review of the Public School system is premature.
My question I think is being misinterpreted. I only want the secular version of a private school Pre-K and Kindergarten. Why must the decent one’s also have so much of the bible stories (Adam & Eve and Noahs Ark) and a pledge to the Bible and their Christian flag. Why is a good pre-school synonymous with Christian ownership? Is everyone of the opinion that christian organizations are the only one’s equipped to teach children? If you don’t want him to attend a dumpy, dark place with minimal interaction, you must accept the dogma. Why? I only want to be able to let him play, learn colors, shapes, a few numbers and letters, a little spanish, social skills and such without the doctrine. There references to math and such ARE FOR LATER, hoping to be able to keep him at a school with which he is familure without preparing him for the seminary.
I thank the many who have read the posts and have enlightened me on the lack of dogma in Catholic schools. I guess the image of Nuns with rulers is exaggerated.
Again, many thanks.
There’s no way to answer your question without having more information. If you’re not willing to give us your precise location, there’s no way for us to tell you what your options are. I think you would do better to get a list of all the private schools close enough to your that you’re willing to send your son there and visit them all. All we can do is tell you about what the varieties of private schools are like in general. As I said before, it’s possible that there may be no schools in your area that will satisfy you. In some areas, all that exists are the public schools (which you apparently aren’t happy with) and private Christian schools which do push their religious views heavily.