So this is just another way of saying that people define others that look like them to also act and perform like themselves? I don’t agree with that at all but …
Isn’t that racist?
No, you don’t get my point. I’m the one who’s saying that bananas aren’t round. Roundness may be the characteristic of types fruit other than apples, but not all of them. Ergo, it doesn’t matter how many types of fruit are round - roundness is not a characteristic of ALL fruit.
Likewise, saying that rationalism is a characteristic of cultures besides White culture can mean one of two things: either its a characteristic of ALL cultures, or that there are cultures for which it is not a characteristic. Which is it? According to that stupid chart, are all cultures rational, or are some cultures not rational? And if it’s the former, why even bring it up?
First of all, part of the point of the chart is to point out that there is actually such a thing as white American culture, not just “American culture.” And, yes, one of the fundamental and foundational characteristics of that culture is racism.
Let me try a different tact. Say the chart had included “Personal Hygiene” as a value of White culture. Would anyone here have a problem with that?
I wouldn’t have a problem with that. I’ve heard white people complaining about the personal hygiene of non-whites. I’ve also heard Indians complaining about the personal hygiene of non-Indians. Both of those might have differing concepts of what is considered proper personal hygiene, but they both have them.
I see. Then I think you just completely missed my point.
I was responding to this:
To which I replied:
I am making no arguments about how many or what specific cultures do or do not also reflect some of these aspects. Only that the text on the page does not in any way imply exclusivity. It does not claim that white culture is the culture that includes any of these individual traits. The poster does not “straight up say” that if you reflect one of these traits that you only could have gotten it from white culture.
Again, I am not arguing for the perfection of this poster. I’m just arguing against claiming the poster says things that it does not.
As to this:
I could imagine including descriptors that are universally true for the following reasons:
- The list of descriptors is not a list of what sets culture apart from other cultures, but is meant to simply describe this culture.
- The list of descriptors is meant to highlight things that are deemed highly important (relative to other cultural markers) for this culture.
- The list of descriptors is meant to highlight things that are deemed highly important for this culture relative to other cultures (maybe all cultures reflect X, but this particular culture has a whole set of beliefs/behaviors surrounding X that make its implementation of X unique or notable).
I think that “Emphasis on Scientific Method > Objective, rational linear thinking” does not imply that there are “irrational cultures” out there (though I’m no expert), but rather that white culture in America places specific value on the scientific method, not just as a tool for scientists but as a lens through which to view things more broadly.
For example, I might say that that America’s obsession with “healthy food”, calorie and macro-nutrient counting, is a direct result of our “scientific method-forward” approach to life, and belief that quantitative emphasis, cause and effect relationships and rationality are the best first way to tackle problems (and you might debate that; again, I’m not intending to argue that everything on this poster is unquestionably accurate).
I’ll also add that some of the specific bullets that folks are flipping out over are being stripped of their context on the page in order to achieve maximum outrage.
The chart claims that an “Emphasis on Scientific Method” is an aspect of white culture, which is marked by “objective, rational linear thinking,” “cause and effect relationships,” and “quantitative emphasis”. Those three bullets in the context of “emphasis on the scientific method” imply something different than if they stood on their own.
Similarly "Protestant Work Ethic > Hard work is the key to success/work before play/“If you didn’t meet your goals, you didn’t work hard enough”, puts some culturally specific context around the statement “Hard work is the key to success.”
All that said, maybe (probably) some of these bullets are unclear, imprecise, or debatable. They’re certainly lacking in nuance and framing, which makes sense considering the format/medium. And I’m not arguing that any of them are 100% right or wrong. But hey, maybe one could do their own cursory research to discover some of the missing context! A quick google for “cultures that are not rational” made it apparent to me that there’s a whole field of study and discussion about rational and irrational belief systems and culture’s role in facilitating those beliefs, and that there’s differing opinions and disagreements within the field.
So, the answer to the question of whether some cultures are not marked by is, it seems, up for debate, not a simple question, and has little to do with whether or not individuals within a culture regularly make self-destructive choices (which seems to be the negative implication associated with “irrational” culture).
It was written in 1978 and I think it shows. There was this cultural obsession with “WASP’s” at around this time - remember that horrid 1980’s Preppy Handbook? This chart is recycling the same tropes.
One thing that strikes me is that I see these values being discussed - punctuality, delayed gratification, hard work - as American immigrant values rather than white values. It certainly isn’t what I think of when I think of white Europeans, especially historically - that evokes images of time-wasting rituals, formal meals every couple of hours, and upper class citizens positively steeped in privilege, living a lazy life of leisure at the expense of the lower classes.
The idea of America, the immigrant dream, is that you can rise above the class and life that you were born into through hard work and the other values under discussion.
And it worked for many immigrants - these groups found through experience that hard work paid off long term and that you could use these values to give your children a better life.
There was one group of “immigrants” that had a decidedly different experience and didn’t gain any advantage through long term thinking, work ethic and ambition - in fact those qualities might’ve served as a distinct liability. If there is any truth to the implication that African-American communities haven’t adopted these values as completely as other groups, this is probably the core of the reason.
Cite for that being made in 1978? The only date I’ve seen is the copyright on the chart itself, which is 1990, by Judith Katz. She wrote a book in 1978 called " White Awareness: Handbook for Anti-Racism Training " which she used for diversity training courses. The chart seems to come later.
I may have misunderstood something I read upthread, but in any case the chart is really outdated