Are Quakers considered Protestants? Because I think Nixon was a Quaker.
The germanic tribles settled England as the Roman influence waned; primarily Angles and Saxons. (The French cut to the chase and call England “Angleterre”, while the Anglish themselves mispronounce the name). In Europe, Angle and Saxony were two distinct tribes with two somewhat distinct territories.
So “anglo-saxon” means people from England, even though technically the Normans were the dominant class since 1066. By now they’ve blended into the anglo-saxon base. (Normans - norsemen - viking invaders who eventually settled in … wait for it… Normandy.)
As the comment says from Wiki, the term is loosely used for norther european white people in general, but technically it means the central English base, not even including the Welsh (ancient Britons?), nor the celts of Ireland or Scotland.
It’s like generically calling black people (negros) “Africans”, even though everyone knows there are also Egyptians, Bedouins, Arabs, and since the 1600’s white Afrikaans of dutch ancestry. If you have to be precise, you can be so precise the point is lost in the massive collection of clarifications.
Yes, presidents tended to be from the core WASP classes of original settlers, but since it is America, land of opportunity, Dutch, German, Irish and lately more varied others have managed to infiltrate the ruling class on a regular basis.
Class, your assignment for this week is to read The Protestant Establishment: Aristocracy and Caste in America by E. Digby Baltzell, published in 1964.
He did not coin the term: he popularized it. Even so, when 60s people talked about the Establishment this is what they were talking about. WASPs and the Establishment are not identical, but they overlapped so greatly pre-60s that there wasn’t much room for difference.
The Dutch always maintained a special elitism in New York social circles because they had been there first. But if you say that the Roosevelts weren’t WASPs and part of the Protestant Establishment then you’re using the term differently from everybody else. That goes for the Scots-Irish as well. (It took me a long time to figure out that Scots-Irish didn’t mean geography: it was code for Protestant.)
For extra credit: are Southern Baptists really WASPs?
Yes, I’ve always though - how much more American-white do you want you black president to be? He was raised by his white mother and grandmother, over 2,000 miles from the nearest black ghetto, in an academic environment of university life, with virtually no contact with his (black) father who wasn’t from the US ghettos either. he had almost no interaction with the black community in America until after he graduated from an elite US college. His tone is very WASP, I suppose.
Not only Ireland. President Obama and I are cousins (along with several million other people; we all try not to presume). Our common ancestors are Burr Harrison, b. 1637 in London and d. 1706 in Virginia, and his wife Sarah Burdette. Definitely WASPs, by all of the definitions given in the thread so far.
—and I’m not a WASP either.
If you happen to speak to cousin Barack on your next family gathering, tell him to email me. I’ve done some thinking on the weekend and came up with a good peace plan for the Middle East.
Of the four major party candidates (Obama, Biden, Romney and Ryan), Obama is the only Protestant (assuming that you don’t consider Mormons to be Protestant).
Agree with all this.
Beat me to the point about Obama. Ancestrally and culturally, he’s one of our WASPier Presidents. He was raised entirely by his northern European Protestant maternal relatives, is descended from colonial stock, including Mayflower passengers. He never spent any time in the hood til he was, as we say, a grown ass man.
And Fillmore and Taft were Unitarian. Whether THAT counts as Protestant is also up for grabs.
Not true. There was a rumor that Hannibal Hamlin (Lincoln’s first VP) was partially non-white but it was never definatively proven. Charles Curtis (Hoover’s VP) was 3/8 Native-American.
No, they are WACKYASSs
White Accented Cousin-Kissing Yokels Against Same-sex Sex
[Moderator Warning]
Saint Cad, religious jabs are not permitted in GQ. Since you’ve had similar offenses before, I’m making this a warning instead of a note. Do not do this again.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
My apologies. I zoned and thought I was in a different forum.
Right.
Many early presidents are considered to have either Deism or Unitarianism as a faith.
I think the rumors about Hamlin’s ancestry are as spurious as the similar rumors about Harding.
But you’re right about Curtis. I forgot about him.
How could you have forgotten about Charles Curtis, vice-president under Herbert Hoover?
From the Wiki article:
Course judging by the accompanying pics, he looks pretty white-bread to me.
^
Yes, Curtis was one of three people of native American descent mentioned in the Book of Knowledge who were famous in the past century. The other two were Maria Tallchief and Jim Thorpe.
Quick: who was the first president who was actually born Amercan, even? Everybody before was in violation of the Constitution (to be amended).
Seriously? How much time do you think the average person spends thinking about Charles Curtis?