I am not a good singer, but can tell when someone else plays the wrong notes or sings out of tune. For a song I know well I can be in tune myself, but cannot tell otherwise if I am in tune consistently (unless my long suffering wife tells me). This seems a common problem with so many bad singers about. Its almost as if one doesn’t really listen to ones one pitch?
ones own pitch
[note to self must preview better]
Might it have to do with the well-known phenomenon that one’s own voice sounds different resonating inside one’s head than it does to others in the air?
I don’t know but I can tell when I’m singing off tune and it frustrates me sometimes when I still can’t get myself to sing on tune. Unless I am only picking up some of the time and the rest of the time I am just singing badly without knowing. Maybe if you are imagining someone else singing on-tune while you’re singing you think you’re hitting the same notes as them when you’re actually not. This is demonstrated on long car trips, sitting next to someone singing along to their iPod.
You haven’t learned to really listen to yourself yet; to actually picture the melody in your mind and hear yourself while singing. It’s like an awareness. It’ll come with practice, trust me
virtually yours
Presumably this is part of the reason why musicians/singers have ‘monitor’ speakers on the stage, feeding back the sound they’re making to them, to check that what the audience are hearing is tuneful.
I find that it helps me to hear my own voice much better if I cup my ear into my hand to sort of channel the sound coming out of my mouth into my ear canal (instead of hearing the vibrations internally). When I do this, I am much better at being on key.
In the studio they wear headphones for this, but I’ve seen performers do the hand-ear-cup thing while on stage as a quick way to do a “am I on key?” check.
I agree that feedback is essential, and even good singers sing off key if they cant hear themselves. I wonder if part of the problem is that normally we are trained not to listen to onesself (partly because it is too distracting in everyday life). Singing takes extra training to learn to pick up ones own voice. I guess I am only about half way through the process then
Without hearing you, it’s impossible to make any credible suggestions, but here’s something else to consider.
Singing takes both intention and coordination. Your mind decides what you mean to sing, but your body’s physical habits determine the outcome.
From the sound of it, you know what pitches you intend to sing, and you’re perceptive enough to tell in-tune pitches from out-of-tune ones (at least in other people).
But your voice isn’t a “point and shoot” system that does what you want it to - it’s an elaborate mechanism involving many muscles and processes that has to be well coordinated in order to function well. Accurate pitch perception and intention in combination with poor physical vocal coordination often results in very out-of-tune results.
Consider that you might be singing in a way that impedes your body’s ability to sing accurately. You could be singing too hard (or heavily), not energetically enough, without enough breath involvement, too high for your natural voice placement (or too low), or any number of things.
When you’re busy singing, your ability to focus on the results are very limited, and your perception is impaired. What you think you hear when you’re singing is ususually more a reflection of what you mean to sing than it is what you actually are.
The sound of your voice in your head is indeed very different from what other people hear, but that’s less relevant when it comes to pitch. It matters more in areas of tone color and voice quality.
I’d suggest you seek some professional advice if you really want to improve. You’d be surprised how effective lessons can be if you’re open to input and change.
That is the technique my choir instructor taught us to help us learn to hear ourselves and determine if we were on pitch. We were only a choir of 14 (3 altos) but we did very well with a capella perfomance peices in competition written for 30+ member choirs. Obviously we each had to be able to hold our own part, and project well to pull it off. He was a very good instructor. It could be a combination of not being able to hear yourself very well, and maybe some flaw in your delivery technique as Figaro suggests. The instructor I mentioned gave us in depth training on how to produce sounds, and what muscles to use or not use. (I won’t soon forget being told in essence to clench my buttocks tight enough that they could hold a dime, but relax shoulders, knees, and throat etc…) We were even instruced on how to breath properly in order to produce the best sound, other things like how to feel where the notes of varying pitch “come out” when you produce them. Not operatic caliber I’d wager, but some operatic techniques applied differently perhaps? We didn’t have the operatic sound in any case, though we sounded larger than we were.
I don’t know but singing can be strange. My daughter when singing alone can’t carry a tune in a basket. However when singing with others, as in the church choir she was in, she does just fine. What I can’t figure out is how she got into the choir in the first place. Didn’t the directer listen to her sing before letting her in?
Could it be that your daughter has great coordination, but lacks skill in intention (using Figaro’s fine definitions)? It may be that she doesn’t have the melody in her head, but when she sings with others she can borrow it from them via what she hears? I am a lousy singer and can rarely carry a tune by myself. But sometimes I do alright along with another person or instrument. I suspect that I adjust my pitch quickly to match what I hear and that the accompniment covers my tracks.
Thats what I keep hearing, and not just about my singing! 
But thanks for that thoughtful post
No, I’m exactly the same way. I can’t sing solo worth a damn, but when I’m in a chorus (contralto section, natch), my voice comes out sweet and blends well with the others. The choral directors love me because I know my music theory and can understand their directions well. But just let me pick up a guitar and attempt my solo Joan Baez shtik, and I’ll clear the room instantly.
OK, you can’t sing on tune by yourself. So how did you get in the choir? Didn’t the director audition you? And if he or she did, how was it known that you could sing on tune when others around you were singing? Or did the director just let you in because you’re so classy?