I ask this because I do a lot of cooking, and outsideof pepper, salt, and oregano, I hardly use stuff like:
-cloves
-mace
cinnamon
-cassia
-nutmeg
-tumeric
-etc.
Yet, in medieval times, cooks used these spices in everything they cooked! In fact,the whole “Age of Discovery” was driven by the european’s desire to get a direct line to import these spices-and the consumption of these spices was huge! My question: when dd people shift to less highly-spiced foods? Are there any modern cookbooks wth versions of medieval dishes that I could try? Were typical medieval dishes like say Indan food today (currys typically contain lots of different spices).
Has anyone here actually tasted some of these spice-intensive dishes? Did you like this food?
We were told in school history classes that use of strong spices in olde worlde food was to mask the taste of the putrid meat that was available at the time. It does seem odd to me that Europeans risked life and limb navigating the globe to find spice-trading routes; I would have stayed at home and eaten pickled/smoked/salted meats and fishes myself…
Well, the peasants mostly did without, or just used salt and local herbs.
Some of the spice consumption thing was class and wealth related - a form of conspicuous consumption.
In some cases it probably did help disguise meat that was a bit off, or really gamey meat brought in from a hunt.
I’ve also heard a theory that many of the time thought that such spices either came from a place like Eden, or such spices figured prominently in heaven, so in that sense they were literally a taste of paradise.
Like most things, it was probably a combination of things.
Two points. Firstly, your cooking must be very bland 
… I use all of the above and more on a regular basis.
Secondly, I’m pretty sure we have a far greater ability to use salt in cooking than in previous eras, which in many cases is used indiscriminately where spices could be put to better use.
So I’m guess I’m suggesting that the question should be the other way around - why did we stop using spices?!
To support Staggerlee’s point: I recently visited Henry VIII’s country retreat, Hampton Court. I took a guided tour of the gardens and kitchens. We were told that the nobles would periodically organise large hunts of deer, which would provide meat for the ensuing months. As time took its toll, the meat would go rancid but judicious use of herbs and spices would continue to make the food palatable. As an interesting aside, we were told that they were not especially keen on vegetables at the time. As an example, tomatoes were grown but were only used as a decoration at the dinner table: they were not considered edible!
Not to forget that spices were also used for medical purposes.
For a long time both potatoes and tomatoes were considered poisonous because they look very much like the deadly nightshades (Solanum). Which is obvious as tomatoes and potatoes are a part of the nightshade family (Solanaceae).
What makes you think that they did?
So this whole “age of discovery” thing took place directly after the Middle Ages. Got that?
No, because most of that shit hadn’t been discovered at the time. Indian food at the time wasn’t even like that. Chilli comes from the New World (the Americas). The hot Indian curry that you eat today wasn’t available then, because no-one had yet brought the chilli back from South America.
If it seems odd to you perhaps you are not looking at this in the light of capitalizm. No one sailed that far so he could have currey lamb, but so he could sell it. People demanded these spices, some were willing to risk the trip for the reward.
I did find some recipes from around 1300 AD, and it seems that spices like cinnamon , cloves, and nutmeg were used to spice meat dishes, whereas today we would use those mainly for pies and sweet cakes. Of course, the europeans of the tme had planty of native herbs to season their food (eg. garlic, thyme, oregano, chives, etc.)
I’ve heard the teory about the gamy/rotten meat thing, but I tend not to agree-they europeans knew how to preserve meats with salt, vinegar, or smoking. Also, europe was cold enough in winter, to allow for preserving the meat by freezing.
But, I have to admit, sometimes a spice like cinnimon can go well with meat-if you make greek moussake (ground lamb with macaroni) a pinch of cinnamon gives the sauce a very nice falavor.
Spices did not just cover the taste of bad meats, they help the meat not to become putrid. Spices have an antimicrobial effect.
Cinnamon & nutmeg rubbed onto plain old pork chops is mighty nice, too.
:eek: Eggplant!
Moussaka is made with eggplant not macaroni.
I was going to make the same point. Then I read the OP again and noted:
which I thought might be about right, though I don’t know for sure. If ralph124c is correct, then spices *were * available in medieval times. They had to take an indirect route to reach Western Europe, however, and were consequentially expensive. The spice economy that was created in medieval times could thus correctly be descibed as “driving the age of discovery”.
They certainly were available. Via the Spice Road, through central Asia (think Marco Polo). The problem with this for Europeans was that they didn’t have any control over it - spices would be sold on from one merchant to another, each knowing how to get them through another leg of their tortuous journey. Being able to take a shipload straight from Asia to Europe offered huge profits.
Um, maybe 'cause they taste good?
They didn’t have a lot of shopping malls, television or even (gasp!) the internet to keep them occupied. Aside from farming, which the spice-eating nobles didn’t do themselves, there was cleaning and spinning and dyeing and sewing and hunting and cooking. If I personally had been a medieval wench, I’d be spending as much time in the kitchen developing fantastic meals as possible to get out of doing the spinning.
When I have the time, I use all these spices and more. Weeknight crazy meals are unfortunately limited to salt, pepper, thyme, garlic, rosemary, basil and oregano, for the most part.
I rather doubt that this was the case, at least for Henry VIII’s dinner table. Tomatoes originated from the New World, and didn’t reach Europe until sometime after Henry’s death in 1547. It is true, though, that the tomato was thought to be poisonous by Europeans until the 18th century.
That seems like a whole lot of quoting and research in order to make a point that seems mostly wrong. It seems as though many of the spices listed in the OP were available, although often hard to get. (http://www.gallowglass.org/jadwiga/herbs/spices.html)
And: http://slate.msn.com/id/2107363/ (Note the comparison to Indian foods)
And a fairly good list of what was available in medieval Europe.
Thanks Finagle, now I don’t have to link to Jadwiga’s site…but let me kick in stefan’s florilegium where you can click on foods, and run down the list to rotten meat message.
I would also suggest to you that you browse around and look up peiod cook books=) What we have as ‘cookbooks’ from the period arent what we think of as recipes, but are actually aide-memoire written by professional cooks for their use, and the use of their apprentices and other professional chefs catering to the wealthy and the nobility. They are more lists of ingredients so they dont forget that you need cinnamon and vinegar in a cameline sauce, and that you can also add ginger if you have it=) Not to mention these professional chefs are actually working for people who happen to also hold the right of low, medium and HIGH justice, meaning they can try and have you executed if you commit what they deemed an offense. Do you think someone would actually serve rotten meat at a formal dinner? They knew quite well how to preserve meats and vegetables [comprendez-vous salt ham, smoked sausage, filch of smoked bacon, pickles, dried fruits?] There is a reason that lent hits when it does, that is the practical end of fresh meats, and the remainig animals needed to be kept for breeding stock. In general the reports of chefs we do happen to have [check out Cindy Renfrew’s page ] dealt with the aquisition of thousands of fresh eggs, live fish, live chickens, whole cows on the hoof, hunted meats for the feasts, and we have other references around including several sets of court records penalizing butchers for less than fresh meats, bakers for underweight or adulterated bread, spicers for adulterated spices…
And for those who seem to think that the medieval food in question wasnt tasty check this out
Fylettes en Galentyne http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cariadoc/meat.html#6
Two Fifteenth Century p. 8/52 (GOOD)
Take fair pork, the fore quarter, and take off the skin; and put the pork on a fair spit, and roast it half enough; then take it off and smite it in fair pieces, and cast it on a fair pot; then take onions and shred them and peel them, and not too small, and fry in a pan of fair grease; then cast them in the pot to the pork; then take good broth of mutton or of beef, and cast thereto, and cast thereto powder pepper, canel, cloves, and mace, and let them boil well together; then take fair bread, and vinegar, and steep the bread with the same broth, and strain it on blood, with ale, or else with saunders, and salt, and let them boil enough, and serve it forth.
2 lb pork roast (i.e. about 1 1/2 lb meat)
2 big onions, sliced and fried in lard
5 c beef broth (water plus 5 bouillon cubes, or canned beef broth)
*
1/4 t pepper
1 t cinnamon
1/4 t cloves
1/4 t mace
*
1/4 c vinegar
1/4 loaf of bread = ~1 c torn up
small pinch of saunders
1/2 t at least of salt
Roast a fresh picnic butt until rare, then cut into small pieces, 1 inch cubes are a good size, and place in a pot. Add the pre-fried onions, broth and the first set of seasonings. SImmer until pork is cooked through and tender. Soak bread in the vinegar and press through a sieve into the pot of pork, onions and broth to thicken. Season with salt to taste and add a small amount of saunders [red sandalwood, not the kind that you use as incense, this has no real flavor and just adds a reddish color to the thickened broth.] to color the thickened broth.
As you can see, the original recipe is more of an aide-memoire, which Cariadoc has taken, and worked out a modern recipe for. Just because a recipe calls for 20 different spices doesn’t mean you use a teaspoon of each! [and this dish comes out sort of a sweet sour sort of pork dish, but not violently sweet/sour like chinese foods…]
If I ever happen upon a quarter-pig, I will bear this thread in mind 
…
But very good point about it being an aide-memoire. Hey, let’s be honest, most of us would open a curry recipe book, and take a recipe and eliminate al the ingredients we don’t have, and perhaps substitue a few others. I guess this would be the medieval way - work with what you’ve got.