It’s only reasonable that if one person knows the market, he should be the one naming the first price.
If you know the value of the item, it is advantageous to name a price first. (Anchoring effect)
If you don’t know, you’re often better of not going first.
If you don’t know, but you could’ve found out with some research, you are an idiot.
Rule 1 of negotiating is not about who goes first. It is: do your homework.
I just donated the kids band instruments to the school rather than put up with this. I know they aren’t worth what I paid for them (used) because the music store I bought them from needs to mark them up to resell them - but frankly, its easier to donate them, get a donation letter from the school and take the tax writeoff. They are used middle school band instruments - which means they probably need a little repair as well - which will bring down the amount that I’d get from the used music store (and fairly, they need to pay the repair guy), but won’t take down the value on the tax writeoff. And I really don’t want to deal with Craigslist. Plus, I get the warm fuzzies of helping a middle school band student who wouldn’t be able to take band if their wasn’t a donated instrument (or, in this case, two).
I used to work in a thrift store. Customer brings item, how much? In my mind, I have $2 as my price point. If I say that, customer offers $1. If I let customer start the process, I still have $2 as my price, but customer says $3. If they offer $1, I can either say no and make no sale, or decide wth a buck is a buck.
This reminds me of a friend of mine. He has a sports car he never drives and he wants to sell it.
But he never puts it on the market because he “can’t get what it’s worth”, he says.
I say, “You mean, what you want for it.”
He says, “No, what it’s worth.”
What the hell? If you can’t get what you think its worth then it’s not, in fact, worth that…no?
Well…let’s just say that I am not into the idea of “taking advantage” of anyone.
I’m quite happy to make a fair deal - but I am not about to “take advantage” of someone’s ignorance. I don’t find it “right”.
I think the WTF may have been on my face but what I said was
“Better take that offer because I can’t come close.”
I recommend people do a little research and try to fihure out what their item is selling for. Many won’t bother. That said, If I tell people daily that if they want to maximize what they get then they can sell it themselves and expect more. If you decide that’s a hassle and you want it to be quick then understand that folks like us who resell want it for considerably less.
This really has nothing to do with what I’m talking about. I don’t expect them to be skilled negotiators. They have one or two items and all they need to do is have some idea of what they want. It requires just a little effot. And the people I’m focusing on are the ones who clearly have some idea of what they want but refuse to say it.
It really doesn’t have to be that adversarial or cut throat. We’ve been in business a long time and want to keep the reputation of being fair and a good place to bring used gear. We have regular customers who understadn the obvious. We buy to resell and need to be able to make a profit. They ask a reasonable amount, we pay it, and we’re done in 5 minutes.
I tend to take people at their word and if they don’t want to give me a number that’s fine. What I’m talking about are those that obviously did have some idea of what they wanted and just refused to say so. Then after I’ve made an offer that is below their expectations they act offended or disgusted.
Maybe my expectations are to high, but I expect reasonably intelligent people to understand that a Used Music store buys to resell so we can’t pay full value.
You know what “full value” is, though, and they don’t. Even if they know you’re going to give them 50% of what you’re going to sell it for, they don’t know what that is; all they know is the number in their head that sounds reasonable based on what they paid for it
I’ll give you an example. I just sold a road bike on craigslist, but before I did I took it to my local Trek store to get fixed up. While I was there I saw that they sell used bikes, so I told them to make me an offer. I knew that I paid $700 for it 4 years ago and it had less than 100 miles on it. I know electronics depreciate like crazy, and to a lesser extend so do cars (IMHO because they’re full of electronics now as well), but a road bike? I figured it should be worth around $400. So I went out to CL and saw that they were listed for $300 to $350. I don’t know if any of them sold for that price, but I know that if I listed in on CL I was going to ask for $350.
The bike store guy asks me what I want for it. I don’t know what they’re going to sell it for ($500?), so even if I assume they’re going to give me half, I don’t know what that is. If they’re $300 on CL I know I’m going to get less than that here. See, I really don’t know enough to even tell them what I think they should give me. I could ask for $350 but why? I’m not going to get it. I could ask for $250, but that’s based on a complete WAG. They know what they’re going to sell it for, they should make the offer.
Long story short, they told me it was junk and offered me $50. I said no thanks, paid them $70 or so to fix a few things, and sold it on CL the next day for $350. I don’t think they were being dicks, just elitists who had no clue what things sold for outside their own store. Me throwing out my own price wouldn’t have helped.
A few years ago I worked at a discount store. EVRYTHING was already at a nice discount. We had a small waste basket with a lid for $3. Some young lady says “How much for this?” I reply, “$3 just as the tag says”
"She looks at it and frowns. “I’ll give you a dollar”
“It’s $3”
“I know you will haggle here”
“IT"S 3 DOLLARS”
She just looks disgusted and walks off.
That’s the perception. The article I quoted above says it’s a false one.
Since I work in an actual store the prices are clearly marked.
That means “DO YOUR HOMEWORK” not don’t name the price first.
Well yeah because if this person had said "I want $200 or $250 and had done a little research they would have been far more likley to get $150
There’s nothing unethical about it and it’s not taking advantage of anyone.
One customer wasn’t getting what he wanted and commented “Well at least be fair” I told him “Here’s the fair part, I make an offer and you can say no”
We don’t buy from kids, they are all adults who ought to make some effort to find out what their item is going far, but just to elaborate a little bit
There is no definate fixed dollar amount for anything. It’s more of a window or range. Every time I buy I’m making an educated guess on what I think we can sell it for. How correct I am varies. Sometimes we make very good money on an item we buy, sometimes we make just a ittle, sometimes nothing, sometimes we lose money. Some items we have to repair or refurbish and that costs money.
The buying process is honest negotiation between two adults. We’re not out to screw people. If I ask and someone says “I’ll take a hundred” there’s nothing unethical about saying “okay” The customer is getting what they asked for and I and the company have a little more profit margin on this item {hopefully} to offset the items on which we make less , or nothing.
What’s fair, and right, and what constitutes “taking advantage” is somewhat subjective expecially in this situation.
They don’t have to know the exact number to have a reasonable idea of it’s value, as you yourself demonstrate. You knew if the bike sold used for around $350 you wouldn’t get to near that from a reseller. You’d be surprised how many people do their research and then ask for the full going price for thier item. It just isn’t reasonable or smart to do that to a resellor. Of course if they are just throwing out a number to get the ball rolling it’s NP.
To be fair, when they made the offer they were also going to invest the cost of the repair right? Your story shows tiy had some idea of fair value, and you knew not to expect what they might sell it for. Not everyone understands that even though it seems extremely obvious to me.
different people and businesses have their own habits and policies. I’m happy to say our owner and most employees want to preserve a rep for offering fair value and consistently more than pawn shops would. Fair being subjective , not everyone will agree. I had to keep reminding a new employee that the goal wasn’t to lowball everyone and buy things as cheaply as possible.
Comics seem really tough thanks to Overstreet. There’s defining what mint condition is, there’s explaining that while a comic sold for $200 somewhere once, not everyone is going to be looking for it everywhere.
I think you underestimate the power of information asymmetry. The seller doesn’t know what the item is worth, necessarily, and gains nothing by naming the price first. The buyer has everything to gain if the seller reveals the price. The buyer assumes that the other party has some ultimate minimum and will pad the price, so the buyer will use the seller’s suggested price as the maximum and work down from there.
Ultimately the seller has nothing to gain and profit on the table to lose by revealing the asking price. I suspect you are well aware of that and are simply griping about savvy sellers.
How about this for a strategy? The buyer has a maximum amount he’s willing to pay. The seller has a minimum amount he’s willing to accept. They both write down their figures and exchange them. If they match, there is a deal. If the maximum “I’ll pay” figure is less than the minimum “I’ll take” figure, there is no deal. If the figures overlap, you split the difference and have a deal. For this to work both parties have to write down their respective true limit figure and agreed there will be no “re-negotiating” after the figures have been exchanged.
It is a nice idea, but when it hits the real world it falls apart. It is the prisoner’s dilemma all over again. Both have an incentive to cheat.