A) 90%? A group will usually support policies in its interest. This is a democracy right?
B) 1%
Blacks who have reasoned debates with racists: 0%. It would be difficult for black Americans to take my advice. Point taken.
That’s partly because affirmative action itself is racist, and based on racist ideas.
Another problem is that AA can reinforce racist ideas rather than combat them. I mentioned it in another thread.
If you admit blacks to universities based on a lower standard than for whites or Asians, then the black students will tend to drop out more and get worse grades. It is difficult to avoid seeing that the bottom quarter of your classmates are disproportionately black, and if everyone denies that they got any special breaks, and were admitted under the same standard of fairness of everybody else, it is not going to reinforce any notion that we are all the same and race is meaningless and all that.
Regards,
Shodan
You seem to be at pains to type replies without saying anything of substance. Is this your favored MO because I would just rather skip your posts after seeing your name.
nevermind, misread something.
Thanks for the answers.
If true, why isn’t AA synonymous with gender divisions but racial ones? Where’s the wave of misogyny that’s created by AA? Why does every single discussion on the merits of AA boil down to people’s unease toward racial preferences? If AA is the root of social tensions it tends to steer this tension solely towards African-Americans.
It’s simple, AA does not create modern-day racists; just like it doesn’t create modern-day misogynists. Racists and misogynists already exist in society and they hitch their wagon to their pet causes.
Will, do you really not know the difference between a justification and a rationalization?
Racists may rationalize their backwards thinking by saying it’s because of AA or Welfare (although, as I said, IME they generally blame drugs, rap, or genetics). But these are just rationalizations. If all of these things went away they would still be racists, they would just blame other things.
How do I know this? Because there were racists before all of these things existed (or were known about in the case of genetics).
Because racism is not a position you reason yourself in to (nor can you reason someone out of it, by and large).
Garbage. Racists are irrational, as well as malignant scum. You deal with them by overpowering them, not by reason; the Civil War wasn’t won by reason.
I see no reason to buy that for a moment. Nor, just as importantly, is most of the racism that still exists anywhere near as strong as it once was. If you were right, where’s the pro-slavery movement?
Show me in the Constitution where it mentions you by name. Because I’m unaware of the part where it says Will Farnaby decides what’s constitutional. The way I’ve heard it the Supreme Court makes those decisions and they apparently don’t agree with your decision.
As I said, we tried it that way for a hundred years or so and it didn’t work.
Care to offer a speculation on how long the democratic process would have taken to end racism in America? Another hundred years? Two hundred? Five hundred? Maybe you’d have been willing to wait that long. But then again, it wasn’t your problem, was it?
What’s the point in talking to somebody who thinks there was no racism in this country until 1961? That person is either an idiot or a liar.
Nothing personal, of course. Because as you pointed out, this is the kind of stupid lies that racists use to justify their racism. And you’re not a racist, right?
The majority of people eligible for Aff Am aren’t black. Full stop.
Hispanics, Native Americans, Pacific Islanders. Women, in STEM fields.
If you would like to debate the causes of modern day misogyny you should ask someone else about that. I said AA caused racism not misogyny.
Yes, but has been noted a few times in this thread, other groups, most notably women are more often the beneficiaries of AA than black people. Why are you focusing solely on black people and not the other groups? It seemed to me, the OP is poisoned fruit and all discussions stemming from his flawed premise are doomed to tread on issues discussed in previous threads.
Would you be o.k. with Affirmative Action if it didn’t cover African Americans?
You seem to think the Civil War was fought because of racial inequality in the Southern states. Maybe you’re not aware of the Illinois Black Codes and the butcher Abraham Lincoln’s support of them. Sorry to discredit your comic book version of Civil War history.
No ideology has been conquered by force.
Further, If you’re against AA, then I am assuming you’re against it for all groups. How about making your arguments using those other groups instead of the black people or is your issue solely race based?
Why do conservatives generally hate black people?
There are a lot more factors than just intelligence that contribute to effective education. I think AA was a great idea. That said, while schools should keep an eye on demographics, I think they should transition away from strictly race and towards something more like class / region or other factors that are more to the point. And they need to not just admit at risk students but also give them more resources like counseling and health care.
I’m against AA because I’m against any kind of discrimination. It just so happens that AA results in shitty outcomes as well as bein morally bankrupt so ill use whatever argument I feel like using. Who the hell are you?
To what extent are AA programs in place other than school admissions and other educational programs?
You saw Lincoln too, huh? How bout that Tommy Lee Jones,.
Do you have a citation that it results in “shitty” outcomes?
Have you considered that perhaps the black guy got the job because you can’t spell?