Very few national elections in my adult life have “gone my way.” If you don’t see a fundamental difference this time, you’re not being honest with yourself. In the words of our Secretary of State, (or was it Defense?) Trump is a fucking moron. But he’s worse than stupid, he’s also corrupt, obnoxious and incompetent.
Because they tell me what I am thinking. Now, I don’t actually have telepathic powers, so my remark that they “think” that they have them is obviously tongue in cheek.
But, I am constantly told by conservatives, what I am thinking, why I am doing what I am doing, what the real motives are, and so on.
I do know that they do not actually posses these powers, as they are always very very far off base, but they continue to act as though they do.
Why do you think that is?
Seems perfectly reasonable to me. Political disagreements are one thing. But if your core values are so wildly different, why bother being friends? I lean conservative on many issues (although these days I’m basically apolitical) and I have friends on both sides, but I do try to avoid those on the extremes.
+1. I have several conservative friends and family members I get along with - in fact literally everyone I know is conservative in some way. And this is, generally, okay. (There are non-okay moments, but they pass.)
If any of these folks started lauding Trump, though, I’d seriously consider backing away, slowly, keeping my hands visible. That would reveal a whole 'nother level of reprehensible.
I will defend my decision to foolishly waste my money on Legos to the death.
Actually, research shows that it is true. As a group, liberals (as a group, there will always be differences at the individual level*) tend to think those who don’t agree are bad people.
Conservatives and liberals work off of different moral foundations. Conservatives*(see above) use more moral foundations than liberals. The foundations are Care, Fairness, Liberty, Loyalty, Authority and Sanctity. The research shows that liberals care heavily about Care and Fairness and the rest don’t matter very much. Libertarians care about Liberty and the conservatives care about all six roughly equally.
This leads to liberals believing that conservatives are bad people because conservatives main concern isn’t Care or Fairness centered. Liberals do not understand what the conservatives are thinking and, therefore, assume that the conservatives don’t care. Since they don’t care, they must be horrid people.
So the very liberal, as a group, believe that conservatives are fine with hurting a defenseless animal. Really. Think about that for a second. The same group also thinks that conservatives don’t think justice is important.
Note, there are conservatives who fall into the ‘liberals are bad people’ camp as well. My guess is that those types of conservatives are high on Loyalty and Authority and see the liberals* focus on Care/Fairness as a dismissal of Loyalty and Authority.
As an added problem, there are a bunch of politicians, on both sides, who are happy to use these divisions to increase their own personal power. These folks tend not be called out by people on the same political side because it would hurt that sides chances of gaining power.
Slee
Actually what this tells me is that liberals have reading comprehension. Nobody thinks that "one of the worst things a person could do is hurt a defenseless animal” - there’s about seventy forms of human murder and torture that anybody with even the slightest morality would consider far worse. And even a cursory examination of republican political policy shows that they value security and safety and stability more than justice. This doesn’t mean they don’t care at all about justice - but they have other priorities too, including ensuring that they and their families are cared for.
(For myself, I think “people aren’t dying left and right” is a pretty important thing to have in a society.)
So I’m not convinced that your “research” shows what you think it does.
These groups are so big that they both include people with all kinds of different ideas, so that no generalization is accurate. Having said that, in some countries, at some times, a difference between the right and the left has been that
The left believes that as individuals we would each be better off if we could make things better for identifiable groups of people.
The right believes that as a group, we would be better off if we could make things better for individuals.
Both sides want to make the world better for everyone. There is a tendency to differ about the means to achieve that.
Regarding the original question: to the extent that this analysis is true: some people on the right think that it is wrong to make decisions about people based on their group affiliation. Some people of the left think that it is correct to make decisions about people based on their group affiliation.
Nice false equivalency you’re posting there. Neither right nor left have exclusivity on racism.
And so both sides are the same? Both sides are equally tolerant and supportive of racial minorities, women, gays, and LGBT folks? Neither side’s political stances are more or less favorable to minorities than the other?
You’re either not an American, or in an alternate dimension.
I’m not disagreeing with your assessment of President Trump. I do disagree with the mischaracterization of those who voted for him. I don’t think who one voted for is an accurate proxy for overall character.
Hardly; the Right wants to make the world worse for the great majority of humanity. If you aren’t a right wing, straight white Christian American male they want to make your life hell; even at the cost of hurting themselves too.
When the person voted for is an blatantly awful as Trump, it is a self-condemnation of a person to have voted for him. Nobody who voted for him deserves any kind of respect.
That’s a truly ignorant statement. No, right-wing politicians want to make the world better for everyone. They really do. They just have a different perspective on how to achieve it. And, of course, just like the Left, they want themselves at the top of the pile. I’m discounting the racists, of course.
He’s not an American. His dimensional orientation is a separate issue.
I love that you believe that.
The right (or, more specifically, the sort of right-wingers who have aspired to power in recent decades) have had a tendency to work to rig the system in their favour, often at the expense of others. Tax cuts for the rich, benefit cuts for the poor. Privatisation of public goods and services, often offered to cronies of and donors to the people in power at below market value, while leaving the people who rely on those goods and services far worse off. Tell me again how that is “wanting to make the world better for everyone”.
Certainly the left have their share of “eat the rich” types yet we virtually never see them implement policies that result in people dying of hardship.
Every politician wants to be at the top of the pile. But only some want that in order to be able to shit on the people lower down.
The racists ye shall always have with ye, alas.
Imagine all the dissent that would disappear if the Republican Party and the President would do the same.
I honestly would love for this to be true. I’m not at all comfortable with my conclusions about Trump voters (and worse, those who continue to support him). I just can’t understand how it is possible for a decent human of any political persuasion to get behind such a degenerate asshole. The stakes are too high, and I love my country too much, to try to excuse behavior like this. If someone votes for Trump knowing what he is, that’s inexcusable. I can understand overlooking a few flaws (none of us are perfect) to elect a person who will support your agenda, but electing someone with no actual agenda and *nothing but *character flaws makes no sense whatsoever. I can only conclude the voter is doing so as an endorsement of incompetence and immorality.
You can’t be friends with someone from the Other Party, because it (and by extension, them) is evil.
Other forms of evil cannot be tolerated either, although I remain outwardly friendly with a cow-orker who is a devout Notre Dame fan.
I have friends who have different views on plenty of subjects; economic policy, governmental structure, foreign policy, defense, etc. If someone opposes equal rights and opportunities for everyone in this country, however, we’re going to have a problem being anything more than “acquaintances.”
Yes, we know. That’s the point of the study sleestak and others have linked to - liberals literally cannot understand the motives of conservatives. It’s not just disagreement - one side does not comprehend the motives of the other.
Regards,
Shodan
I understand conservatives, until they abandon their principles and support Trump.