Hardly. I was okay with it when I was a teenager who was affected by race-conscious admissions criteria, too.
This is a really bad analogy.
Yes, that’s what I said. :rolleyes:
Are you OK with a cap on Asian admissions?
why? I see how it’s a clumsy analogy, but how is it really bad.
“There are far more pressing concerns for Asians with regard to race, such as representation in the arts and politics.”
Its a bit hyperbolic but yes, that’s what you said.
Sorry I missed this. I only noticed it when Velocity responded to it.
I’m pretty sure it does, what it doesn’t have is a race ONLY affirmative action [policy that sets QUOTAS on how many blacks it is trying to admit. But it has racial preferences, that are affirmative action whether those are diversity related or not, they are affirmative action. My point is that Affirmative Actin is not inconsistent with ending discrimination against Asians. The discrimination against Asians is not some by product of AA in favor of blacks. They are almost totally unrelated.
Lets say I am a baseball tem in the 1950s and I want to limit the number of black players on my team to 3 players and as a result the average talent level of my black players are noticeably higher than the talent level of my white players. Lets say i decide to get more left handed pitchers because having that diversity helps my bullpen, that will not affect how many black players are on my roster. The cap makes my average players so much better than my white players that the black players are never on the bubble when I implement a preference. That’s what’s going on with AA and the Asian cap at schools.
So you are OK with discrimination against Asians if it will help ANY other group (except whites)? Wow!
And since when has any 4 year college or University (never mind a top school) been representative of real life? Unless the school admits people by lottery, any selection criteria is going to change the profile of the student population from everyday life.
Like Lucy Liu’s career?
“Similarly situated” is again subjective. They may very well not have that chance now but you haven’t shown that to be the case.
“Probably”, only if there is in fact a cap as a percent of the entire student body.
What this misses is that without the cap on Asians there would be more pressure end AA. Harvard is 45% white, 16% Asian, 8% Black, 11% Hispanic, and 12% foreign. If they got rid of the asian cap then they would have to have fewer of the others. Fewer foreign students mean less money because most of them are paying full price. Fewer white students means less legacy admissions which means less alumni donations. So the alternatives are either to accept less money or end AA.
The level of proof people require to show discrimination against Asians is about two orders of magnitude higher than the level of proof that people on this board seem to require to show discrimination against other minority groups.
We have a constant Asian population at these schools despite a quadrupling of the Asian population in the general population.
We have gaps in objective qualifications between Asians and whites that go way beyond statistical significance.
We have former admissions deans stating that there is a bias against Asians (but apparently its not racism).
We have institutions with a proven history or discrimination against high performing minorities like Jews and now Asians.
There is in fact a de facto cap. If you can’t see it, it is because you are requiring conclusive proof, which NOONE can provide because Harvard is not providing anyone with its admissions data. That is what the lawsuit by the DOJ is about. The fact that they have asked for their admissions data and Harvard has given them nothing.
I think asking for more proof is a bit like asking for proof that cigarettes cause cancer. You can only deny the evidence if you have made up your mind before looking at the evidence.
A couple of points.
Yes getting rid of the cap puts pressure on other applicants but considering the fact that these schools are already comfortable with a 450 point SAT advantage for blacks, I don’t know that 10% more Asians (and that’s just a wild guess on how much higher the Asian population would be) will put any sort of squeeze on black admissions under their current AA policy. So removing the cap would really only affect whites unless they decided that AA isn’t really all that important to them.
MIT dropped its legacy preference and its alumni donations didn’t suffer at all. Why would we think that it would suffer elsewhere.
If the reason for a legacy preference is alumni donations, it calls into question whether those donations are charitable donations or pay for play.