I don’t know about the smallpox vaccine specifically, but for many vaccine-preventable diseases, you can get a blood titer test from your doctor. I did it myself when nobody could tell me if I was immune to chickenpox (I wasn’t, so I got that vaccine maybe 5 years ago). And later on, I found out that I wasn’t immune to mumps, either, in spite of having been vaccinated as a child, so I got that vaccine about 2 years ago.
The blood titer tests work as proof of immunity for immigration medical exams, too - I’ve had countless clients who didn’t have copies of their vaccination records (or who were from countries where records essentially weren’t kept).
Yes, and all those restrictions are very temporary, lasting about until we get to a situation where we squint and say “eh, herd immunity, close enough, right?” That will come extremely soon domestically in the USA (we’re well past the tipping point already, wisely or not), and in the other countries that have had a good rollout of the vaccines, and later in the countries that aren’t quite as lucky, but covid-19 as a social problem necessitating behavioral changes is a short-term problem. Like, you mention movie theaters, but they’re already on the honor system. Eventually the only places asking for covid-19 vaccination records will be the places that wanted records of MMR or malaria or flu vaccinations, and we don’t have Vaccine Passports for those.
To some extent its like voter id. Until we know that those easily forged vaccine passports are being forged and being used to commit illegal acts, there really isn’t a need to solve a problem that doesn’t exist.
When its important - for say international travel - a copy of your vaccine card along with a affidavit from your clinic can be used - with an audit process of calling the clinic for confirmation on X% - just like we randomly screen X% of bags and travellers. But its probably going to have to be pushed by the minority of places for which it is important enough to audit…which is likely to mean colleges and other countries. (Other countries may have some pull - if major first world countries say “the U.S. vaccination documentation if flawed, we will only let Americans in if these conditions are met” you’ll see a parallel system develop for people who need to travel - that probably involves a more complex visa system.)
I didn’t… Nor did by kids. But I’ll accept that it happens.
Back to the OP, my wife and I just spent two nights at a local resort. After showing our CDC vaccine cards, we were given a bracelet that allowed us to wander around maskless during our stay. I suppose someone could (easily) forge a card to obtain the hotel’s coveted bracelet, I didn’t worry about it.
This whole topic strikes me as a peculiarly US thing - the idea that people would want to forge a vaccination card just isn’t a topic of conversation here. The only reason we might really need a vaccine passport is to travel overseas (flashing ID isn’t part of British culture, and no venues are asking for proof of vaccination), and the digital record of my vaccination is already on my NHS app on my phone.
In California CAL/OSHA just announced a remarkable new rule:
All employers must keep track of their employees’ vaccination status. All employees must continue to wear masks until every employee at a location has been vaccinated.
I’d love it if my state did that. I’m dealing with our mask policy at work and there’s no way we’re going to keep everyone happy. Saying the policy was a state requirement would take a lot of pressure off us.
I think Washington is similar. We polled our employees and found we had 100% vaccination rates, and lifted our mask requirements for employees. Most still work from home, but come into the office from time to time.
My California employer has required COVID-19 vaccination with a limited exception process. We have to submit a picture of the completed card which, presumably, is entered into our file with HR.
California also just announced a COVID-19 vaccination lottery, where vaccinated people’s names are automatically entered for a chance to win $50K. The State already knows who has been vaccinated, so no need to show your card for that, at least.
When I traveled to South America in 2019, I had to get the Yellow Fever vaccination, which came with a vaccination card that I had to carry with me with my passport. It seems like the same thing with the COVID-19 vaccination card - flimsy and forgeable, but why would anyone bother. IIRC, the COVID-19 vaccination card was more for the person to keep track of when they got the 2nd vaccination to ensure they followed thru, than to be used as some sort of proof.
Not quite- I’m in California, so I’m paying close attention to the state’s regulations. Our company has locations in all the states, so they recently announced that vaccinated personnel could quit wearing masks and physically distancing, subject to local law and regulation. Unfortunately, that means that in California, we still have to do both.
The OSHA regulations allow vaccinated employees to be mask free and not distanced if all employees in the room are vaccinated, starting June 15. I also think that starting July 31st, vaccinated employees can be mask free and not distanced if all unvaccinated employees are wearing N95 masks provided by the company (but I’m not sure, I’m still trying to parse it out. I know that by July 31st all unvaccinated employees must be provided with N95s).
My company has already rolled out a central portal across the corporation for recording vaccination status. It’s a simple portal. You are presented with a pulldown menu of vaccines to pick from (including “none” and then you are asked to provide the date of your final vaccination. I don’t believe they provide for partially vaccinated status. You either are or aren’t fully vaccinated. Then you check a box that says you certify this information to be true.
It isn’t stated anywhere, but I expect that if it is found that you lied, you’d be subject to immediate dismissal and probably be unemployable in the defense industry (the folks who determine clearances look very dimly on proven liars). I’m guessing there aren’t many that are willing to roll the dice on this and the number will shrink even more the first time someone is walked out the door by security for providing false vaccination information (probably dimed out by a co-worker).
It will be interesting to see if they start providing badge hangers to vaccinated employees, similar to the ones we have for laser safety or ESD training so when you are in the lab, you can immediately see that everyone in the lab is “safe” to be there. It would make sense, so vaccinated employees can easily return to a “normal” mode of working.
My company hasn’t required vaccinations or entering data in the portal, but all their communications seem to contain phrases like “while not currently required, we strongly encourage”, which seems to imply that they are quite ready to start requiring if it looks like they need to.
I wish my employer would do something like that. But they have so far announced that because they know some people aren’t going to be able to get vaccinated for medical reasons, it’s an awkward balance for anything in the workplace relating to a specific person’s vaccination status to be public. My employer is a law firm with a significant employment law practice, and they are concerned about overlap with ADA issues. So far their approach has been to require everyone in the office to wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, unless they are alone in a room with the door closed. None of that bothered me - it was totally theoretical, because I started my new job there in September and have literally never set foot in the office.
But yesterday they announced that nonlawyers will be required to come to the office at least 3 days a week starting July 25th. I am Not Happy - I have been doing fine remotely, and the lawyers I work with are fine with my continuing to work remotely. It’s a new practice group, and I created all the remote workflow processes, and they work fine. Our clients mostly aren’t local, and I spend my working hours drafting things and assembling filings electronically - the lawyers need to go to the office now and again to file petitions because they need to review and sign them physically in ink anyway, so why would we both need to be there? Also, lawyers are “encouraged” to go in 2x a week, but nonlawyers are “required” to go in 3x a week, because the practice of law is collaborative? That’s some mighty fine BS - last I checked, I am not practicing law, so why do I need to be there more than the lawyers, which presumably means I will be there on days none of the lawyers I work with are there at all? It’s a load of hierarchical crap.
While my company consistently makes the lists of top companies for diversity and accommodation. If an employee has a disability, they will make changes: ergonomics in there workspace, special software, location of their workspace, etc. But they do this for proven medical issues, not just because the employee requests it. And some jobs are not available for employees whose disabilities prevent them from doing the job (an extreme example is that we have no blind test pilots. A more mundane one is that jobs on the manufacturing line that require physically crawling around on the fuselage of a plane being built aren’t available to wheelchair bound employees).
Of course, as a Fortune 150 company, they have the resources to set up a database and enforce a policy with multiple aspects. And we’re in a business that just passes the cost on to the customer without much consequence.
As I said, I think the company is proceeding slowly. Entering your status in the portal is not required. Vaccination is not required. I think they want to gauge compliance and create policies that deal specifically with the non-compliant population.
I think they are more concerned that they would be accused of taking adverse action against employees who are unable to be vaccinated for medical reasons. But it’s just a guess. They are behaving very conservatively. We’ll see how it shakes out.
One of my coworkers is a mom to triplets with respiratory problems, so she is obviously going to have a hard time finding safe childcare alternatives for them on relatively short notice - they are too young to be vaccinated yet. I hope they accommodate her.
Update: Cal/OSHA changed its mind, following pressure from governor Newsom. Now the rule is that vaccinated workers do not need masks in general.
Newsom says “he expected verification of vaccination status to be a matter of self-attestation, adding that he hoped people would be honest”, according to reports.
I think this approach is OK. Falsely claiming vaccination to get into a concert or a business is a one time thing. Easy to do, hard to create consequences.
On the other hand, lying to your employer is a great reason for termination for cause. And in my industry (defense), it would end any potential career for an engineer. How many would be willing to lie in their attestation, with the possibility of eventually losing their job?
I am not sure what the problem with this is. It is pretty much settled that vaccination is not all that effective at preventing one from contracting the virus nor prevent one from transmitting the virus to others. It’s effectiveness is in preventing and/or reducing the severity of Covid-19 in the person who has been vaccinated.
IMO, we should simply concede to the wingnuts that masking and lockdowns are not going to be effective, particularly with the Delta variant, and move more towards increased vaccination. With Delta, the viral load is so much higher, even 0.1% non compliance with masking and the like will defeat such measures.
Just make the vaccination card an official government form so that falsifying a card is punishable and require it for admission to places where people will be in close contact. Airplanes, buses, restaurants, bars, concerts, admission to hospitals, etc… Sure, people will cheat, but if they get sick, they won’t be able to verify their card and will face potential fines. Under such a system, most of the hold-outs will likely decide that it isn’t worth what they think they are saving.