I’ve been driving for 40+ years now.
I have never had a new vehicle.
I don’t want or need most of the bells and whistles that are becoming standard on todays trucks and cars.
I could care less about power windows.
I don’t want power door locks.
I dont want a cd player.
I don’t even use the air conditioner.
I don’t even need power brakes.
I don’t trust abs brakes.
Power steering is nice.
I just want a vehicle (really a small truck) that is reliable and not a gas guzzler.
So why doesn’t detroit make a real economy vehicle that isn’t cheaply constructed of inferior materials?
Because they can sell a jillion of the ones with all the trimmings and only four of the ones that suit you to a T. You might be able to special-order one to your taste, however.
Aside from power brakes you can easily get all those but you may have to special order. I can think of no benefit in not having power brakes as vacuum assisted brakes are pretty trouble free. I doubt if you could even order a mini truck without power brakes. I am in favor of ABS but I have taken the time to test them on a wet parking lot and become familiar with them. Consider getting some of the other options though for trade in value, at least the ones you can turn off and ignore like AC and the CD player.
I think if I could add to or interpret the OP, he is asking: why can you buy a stripped down Civic for 13K but there is no American made car of comparable price and quality?
A Chevy or a Ford pick-up in Work Trim. The dealer will fight you tooth and nail to get you to ask for any option not available on the Contractor Special. Stick to your guns.
I’d like to see a vechicle with manual windows, brakes, and steering marketed as a “weight loss” car - because of all the extra calories it would cause you to burn.
So, you want Detroit to make a new car that you won’t buy until it is used?
But seriously, there are almost certainly economies of scale at work here. The percentage of folks who want power steering is probably damn near everyone, so it would be a considerable expense (and/or hassle) for a carmaker to have one of their suppliers start building standardized, non-power steering components to appeal to a very small fraction of the market. That’s logical, isn’t it?
Same thing goes for things like power windows and power brakes. The number of people who expect that such things would be standard on their car is rapidly approaching everyone, so it makes sense that carmakers wouldn’t want to put themselves through the trouble of finding suppliers who will make the hand cranks to lower windows for a very few number of potential customers when it is far easier to find a number of suppliers who will compete for a contract for Ford to sell them large numbers of power window sets.
As for why American automakers lag behind in quality of their cars, or why they put little effort in making economy vehicles, I can’t answer for sure, but I’m betting that automakers feel that they are reading the market to their best advantage. The same way they felt that they were producing cars that Americans wanted right up until the gas shocks of the 1970s, at which time people started buying Hondas.
I have a 1991 Mazda pickup. 4-cylinder, 5-speed manual, manual locks and windows, power brakes (I mean, hell, what car doesn’t have power brakes these days?). But no power steering.
Let me tell you, there is no way in frickin’ hell I am ever buying another car without power steering. I love my little truck, we’ve been 181,000 miles down the road together, but even that little Matchbox toy is a sonovabitch to parallel park. Sometimes just getting out of a parking space is a chore.
I can get behind the OP almost all the way, but no power steering? I’d rather have square tires.
Well… one man’s economy vehicle is another one’s luxury. I remember an army buddy once commenting on how super lucky I was to have my awesome 1986 Escort GL. :dubious:
And Detroit does make economy vehicles, and reliable ones at that. Look at the Ranger. Look at the Focus. They both have “import style” reliability records. You can get both of them without power brakes, but this will be a special order, because no dealer will stock these – no one buys enough of them to justify one on every lot (and it will be the wrong color!). So they exist, but they’re certainly not standard.
I like to feel my vehicle.
when power steering first came out you couldn’t feel the car.I’ve gotten used to that.
Same with power brakes.
ABS brakes take all the feel out of driving.
I know how to stop in wet conditions. Unfortunately many using abs don’t use the common sence god gave a piss ant.
I also have a CDL. Have for many years. So I really ain’t no amateur.
I’m just looking for the stripped down version. No frills.
I’m guessing that the contractor version trucks are not sold individually. You have to order several.???
First off while a shorter stopping distance is not a design criteria for ABS, they will in fact out stop standard brakes on all surfaces except sand, snow or gravel.*
Since the ABS system can maintain the wheels right on the edge of lockup (point of max braking efficiency) and modulate the wheels individually the ABS system can truly out brake you.
On the cars I teach on the system can modulate the 4 wheels individually up to 10X per second. There is no way in hell you can even approach that rate and there is no way you can do each wheel individually.
With that said, there are some crappy ABS systems out there. Not all ABS systems are created equal. But even the worst system can out brake about 98% of the people, on a good day, and 100% if the driver isn’t concentrating or the forces on the wheels is not exactly the same for all four (a patch of sand, spilled oil, a low tire, an over inflated tire, you get the idea)
As far as your comment about ABS taking the feeling out of the brakes, you do understand that ABS doesn’t do a damn thing until a wheel is in danger of lock up don’t you? So the feel of the brake is exactly the same until a wheel is in danger, and then and only then the system operates.
Blaming the ABS system for stupid drivers is like blaming the Dell computers because somebody posted a stupid website. It is not the technology’s fault the operator is an idiot.
Getting back to the OP, I don’t know if you can get them any longer, but we used to have people special order cars with manual crank windows. Besides not being able to find a car on the lot that had this, and therefore having to wait while the factory made one special, if the window regulator ever broke, it would be a sure bet the parts would not be on the shelf at any dealer to fix it.
*On sand, snow, and gravel the shortest stopping distance is when you lock the wheels and a small pile of stuff is mounded up in front of each wheel. However and this is a big however you have zero directional control when the wheels are locked. With ABS in these conditions you can still steer around the problem.
My comments about driving come from observations over many years.
My own 2 kids took drivers ed. IMHO they are not good drivers. Neither are their friends.
BTW two different school systems.
Most that I have seen in the last many years are not good drivers either.
When technology takes the thinking and the cautiousness away from something as important and life threatening as driving its time to rethink technology.
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Getting back to the OP, I don?t know if you can get them any longer, but we used to have people special order cars with manual crank windows. Besides not being able to find a car on the lot that had this, and therefore having to wait while the factory made one special, if the window regulator ever broke, it would be a sure bet the parts would not be on the shelf at any dealer to fix it.
Funny you should mention window cranks
I work at a factory that employs just about anyone walking in off the street.
In other words low pay.
The other day one guy was commenting on his car.
It has power windows. Except for the drivers window. It doesn’t work.
This is an old Grand Am.
He drives 60 miles to work one way.
He will drive this vehicle til it completely craps out.
Do you think this guy wants or needs power windows? What he really needs is a car he can count on day after day that isn’t a piece of crap.
He needs something that is not falling apart and guzzling gas because it is worn out.
Again I ask “Why doesn’t Detroit make vehicles for folks like me?”
If you take all the plush gadgets off a vehicle , including those that detroit calls standard, how much does it really cost?
The really happening parts of a car are only the frame. the engine,and the braking system. I’m thinking really stripped down. Just the basics.
For instance, think race cars. They are as stripped down as they can be. Add seats, upolstery,windows, trunk lid and spare tire.
How much more is really needed?
But even the worst system can out brake about 98% of the people, on a good day, and 100% if the driver isn’t concentrating or the forces on the wheels is not exactly the same for all four (a patch of sand, spilled oil, a low tire, an over inflated tire, you get the idea)