I never once said I didn’t intend to watch BfC. If you assert otherwise, provide a cite.
The first statement of mine on the subject was, paraphrasing : I’ll probably see it eventually, it’s just not a priority.
So… yeah.
Are you insane?
There is only one picture on that page, the quotes are incorrect, and there are no facts!
Yes, there’s only one picture on that page, but it is a factual point of data. In this case, an irrelevant one… but in the case of the Little-Girl-Picture confrontation, an extremely relevant point of data.
You assert that the quotes are incorrect. Then this sequence :
Is incorrectly transcribed?
Because he’s a filmmaker?
*You don’t think FAKING a scene involving an unsuspecting and elderly but nevertheless powerful man – not recreating or using tricky editing or something, but actually STAGING a scene that NEVER HAPPENED – would be a career risk for someone in Moore’s profession? You’re willing to dismiss his entire body of work on the mere suspicion that he’s done such a thing. If it were proven, who would be willing to back his future films? Who would be willing to see them? And I’m sure there wouldn’t be a lot left of whatever wealth he may have accumulated (I doubt he’s that well-off) once the inevitable lawsuits had run their course.
Giving the picture to Heston serves no plausible ‘thesis’ of Moore’s film. Fear culture in America? Not relevant to that. Media overhype? Nope. Gun control? Well, Moore himself said it wasn’t a film about gun control… but the picture would serve no purpose of the thesis even if it were.
What would Heston sue for? No, seriously. I’m unaware of the intricacies of civil law… this isn’t libel as far as I can tell, because it’s not clear that it’s to defame Heston.
I am afraid this must be my last post on the subject for now, as I am leaving town for several days.
Why on earth would he want to fake giving the picture to Heston, then? By Moore’s own account the visit to Heston’s place was spontaneous and largely unplanned, so if he’s telling the truth then he might have also made a quick and less-than-well-thought-out decision to try to give Heston the photo. But why would he fake a scene that serves no purpose in his film, and how can you be so willing to believe he did fake it if you cannot come up with a single sane reason why he would want to do such a thing? I’m sure Moore is as capable as anyone of telling a lie, but people rarely engage in large-scale, elaborate, and risky deception unless they have some compelling reason to. Or unless they’re completely barking mad, and even at his worst Moore doesn’t strike me as an actual lunatic.
*Didn’t you just suggest a few posts ago that making Heston look bad was the only possible purpose for the scene? Sounds like defamation to me. And Moore would likely be in trouble not merely with Heston but with his financial backers and the film’s distributors if he attempted to pass off staged, fictional footage as a filmed account of a real event.
Why fake it? Or why include it if it’s real? To be inflammatory, or to insult Heston. Honestly, those are the only plausible explanations I’ve come up with.
It is one of two possible purposes of the scene… when I say it’s not clear that the scene is to defame Heston, I mean that in the court-of-law, burden-of-proof sense. I can’t think of any other logical explanation, but maybe Moore was just being illogical.
It is a still from the film, but it doesn’t say anything about the scene, other than heston is in it. It is pointless.
How would you know? you haven’t seen the movie!
As it happens, it is correctly transcribed, but what is wrong with the discussion? How do you know what was said before it, or after it? You are relying on the interpretation of Bowling For Truth, which is incorrect.
for example, it leaves out the sentence
“I’m excercising the right passed on down to me by those wise old dead white guys who founded that country”.
Now, taking this sentence out of context, and using other sentences Heston says in the interview, I could make a page on the internet saying that Heston is a racist. It wouldn’t make it true, but it would be as accurate and as honest as what Bowling for Truth does with BfC. and you would know that if you had seen the movie.
Guess what? I’m not using that picture or those comments for my argument (Which centers around the Little Girl’s Photo bit which is in another section) … but nonetheless, they are facts, and they’re sitting right there on the page you claimed had no facts.
I bring them up only as a specific refutation of your claim.
how do those words taken from the movie make Michael Moore a liar?
Jeebus, you can’t possibly be this thick. You must be purposefully obtuse.
Those words above aren’t the part that makes me doubt Michael Moore’s word. Let’s run through the overview.
I say I’m using the facts from the site. You want me to point out where the facts are, on a page you chose. I point out the facts on the page you chose. Then you ask how the facts on the page you chose make Moore a liar? Short answer : They don’t, since that wasn’t the page I was using to make my conclusion.
You’re not secretly a dozen chimpanzees at a keyboard, are you? :dubious:
CandidGamera, why not carry on this discussion after you’ve seen the film, and then you can then put it in context with everything that has been said here and elsewhere and form your own opinion, then everyone can have a discussion on whether MM is a liar or could be percieved as one, and not get side tracked with all this verbal diarrhea on what bit of what page is quoting what may or may not have been in the film.
It’s supposed to be arriving this weekend right?
Netflix shipped it yesterday… I usually get things from them at the two-day mark, which would mean Saturday. It occasionally takes three days… is Memorial Day a mail holiday? In that case, it’d be Monday or Tuesday.
You’re gonna love.
I wish I was looking at it for the first time 
love it that is.
Have a good wkend.
Ok. Shiow me where else on the site he links to an actual study, and not some rightwing blogger diatribe.
http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/heston_confront_staged.htm
This is seriously the last time I want to do that. The pictures posted on that page, coupled with the CHUD inverview to which the page links. They, together, paint a bleak portrait of Moore’s integrity for me. If the pictures and the interview don’t convince you, I can’t help you.
I’m not the one who needs help here.
Candid Gamera, This is just so much haze.
That which compels about the Charlton Heston segment in BfC is Charleton Heston himself. It is a stark scene with two men talking honestly. Heston is an indictment without editorial.Of course you haven’t even seen it but If you are a filmmaker worth your salt, you will notice the lack of embellishment- Michael Moore doesn’t look for the irony nor coax it…it simply exist and flows freely from the NRA’s mouthpiece. I believe if you look at the scene honestly, you will see Michael Moore as a man affected by Passion, not zealotry, I think you will see how much Michael feels for the People that his movies feature…Real Americans and Real America. Some people may see Michael Moore’s genuine emotion as he pleads with Mr. Heston to recognize a single victim of a single Gun and ostensibly American Gun Culture, others may be so repulsed by this emotion that they will repress this shameful and embarassing moment as simply too vulgar for a grown man.
BfT is a hatemongering site and I question your motive and sanity,
MoFo.
Mark My Words. Fahrenheit 911 will will show an honesty that Americans fear, an Honesty that cannot be denied. It will wake America from its nationalist coma and expose the consequences of the path we have been lead down by a dangerous corporate regime with an incompetent and criminal President in the lead. Wartime propaganda and censorship will be exposed and developed with the truth. The real Big Picture.
Fahrenheit 911 will define the war in Iraq.