Why don’t Tom Steyer or George Soros move black Mississippians to Pensacola or Atlanta?

[CarnalK]

@SlackerInc

I almost let septimus get by with cherrypicking Trump’s win in Florida by over 113,000 votes. But earlier this month, Rick Scott won by only 10,000; and of course Dubya won (if he did at all) by only a few hundred votes. So his inflated figure of 300,000 is far more than would be needed for those elections. If we accept his ratio (which is frankly a little tilted, but w/e), that’s more like 25,000 new African American residents to shift the balance. That’s about two percent of the black population of Mississippi.

And you think moving 2% of the black population of Mississippi is remotely doable. It’s a dumb fucking idea. It’s not reaistic logistically or politically. You seem to be under the delusion that everyone disagrees for some politically correct reasons.

[CarnalK]

Look at the Great Migration of blacks to the North. In the early phases, there was probably 20-30 thousand a year leaving from random Southern states to Northern, impulsed by massive economic hardship and extreme racism. You think Soros can just buy that kind of movement from a specific state to another.

Great Migration (African American)

[foolsguinea]

@k9bfriender

Since when do states have laws preventing people from moving into them or businesses opening?

Everything like that, as far as zoning and economic development, is done at county or municipal level. You only look to the states if you are wanting them to give you tax breaks for moving in.

[snip]

You ask if the state govts would have something to say about this, I turn the question around to you, what can the state governments say about this?

Well, you may be right. I still think they could find some way to sabotage you. Aren’t highways planned at the state level?

[k9bfriender]

@foolsguinea

Well, you may be right. I still think they could find some way to sabotage you. Aren’t highways planned at the state level?

Some are. You have interstates, which are a partnership of the federal govt, states, and local. Then you have state highways, but you also have county highways.

I am sure that if they knew what you were doing, they would probably try to mess with you, but at the same time, greasing a few palms in North Dakota’s state house wouldn’t be all that hard either. I don’t know who would win in a fight between North Dakota and Amazon, but I don’t think that Amazon would be defenseless.

In any case, I think it’s a fun idea, but I don’t really think it is practical. I mean, if nothing else, if there was a good reason for people to live in these places, then they already would be living there.

On balance though, it is far more practical than the OP’s idea.

[CarnalK]

@k9bfriender

On balance though, it is far more practical than the OP’s idea.

No, it’s equally stupid.

[FlikTheBlue]

@Wesley_Clark

I mean this with all sincerity, thank you for your service. Registering voters is important.

Moving people around is expensive, plus there aren’t always jobs there. Plus people don’t want to move away from family and community.

Libertarians had a plan to all move to New Hampshire and start a libertarian state there, but they couldn’t get enough people. Its just way too much trouble for people to move around like that.

The vote margin in GA in 2016 was about 200k voters, it was 300k voters in 2012. So I’m hoping that it’ll turn purple (along with Texas) in 2024 or so.

I’m not sure what is moving some states leftward. I assume it is immigration from other states, the death of older white conservatives and younger non-white voters entering the political sphere.

Conversely I think that the reason Florida has stayed reddish purple is due to old white conservatives moving down from places like New York.

[Railer13]

@foolsguinea

Cute. And would the state governments of ND, SD, and MT have anything to say about this? Even GOP governments actually have some state control over economic development.

Yes, those state governments would have something to say about this. If Amazon or anybody else wants to build a business that would bring in a large number of employees (and a large bump in tax revenue), the state government would welcome them with open arms.

But it’s not gonna happen anytime soon in those 3 states.

[ITR_champion]

@k9bfriender

If you are going to move them anywhere, move them into a low populated state like North Dakota.

Personally, I am a fan of Amazon or Microsoft or one of thems opening a corporate headquarters with hundreds of thousands of jobs to be had to right about here.

Would it surprise you to learn that Microsoft already has a large campus in Fargo, ND? It hasn’t done much to change the state’s political leanings.

The main problems with having a software company launch a liberal invasion of the Dakotas and Montana would be:

1. They don’t have enough employees. Microsoft has about 135,000 total scattered all over the world. Amazon’s recent competition for new locations involved an estimated 50,000 in two places.

2. The location you have chosen in extremely remote and lacks necessary amounts of: electricity, drinking water, plumbing, cell phone towers, roads, airports, shopping, schools, hospitals, and pretty much everything else. I’ve been in that area. It is literally hours to the nearest town of 10,000. One could imagine Amazon or Microsoft paying to create all these things, but the cost would be extreme and no corporation would want to spend that amount of money for no reason.

3. It’s a bit cold up there in the winter, so finding enough employees willing to go might be difficult.

[SlackerInc]

@foolsguinea

As someone who still lives in Missouri, I don’t want to see it turned even whiter. It seems like your proposals would be as follows:

1. To take Mississippi, the state with the highest proportion of blacks, 5 points higher than Louisiana, and bleed some of them to concede it completely to Jim Crow.
2. To completely concede Missouri, a former bellwether state turned heavily GOP through years of work by the right wing, and give the likes of Rusty Limbaugh and Roy Blunt a bigger cushion against the large minority of voters who turn out for Democrats every election.

If we could manage the scale, these would be brilliant political power plays, yes—for the Conservative Movement, not for progressives, Democrats, nor moderates.

:mad:

You either don’t understand how gerrymandering works (in which case you should look up “packing and cracking”), or you have a delusion about these states’ potential to once again become purple that is in no way supported by the data.

@k9bfriender

If you are going to move them anywhere, move them into a low populated state like North Dakota.

Black Mississippians are not going to be able to handle living in ND. I live right next to the ND border, so trust me on this.

@k9bfriender

Personally, I am a fan of Amazon or Microsoft or one of thems opening a corporate headquarters with hundreds of thousands of jobs to be had to right about here.

Moving a million people into that spot would flip 3 states pretty solidly, as there are less than 3 million total people living in those three states combined. Maybe even pick up a representative or two.

Just paying people to move is stupid, expensive, and is unlikely to get anything like what the OP wants. Moving people into an already highly populated state even less.

OTOH, creating economic incentives for people to move is much cheaper and far less patronizing. Advertise jobs with good pay and benefits, as well as paying for relocation expenses. You may end up paying more than en employee is worth, but in the OP’s scenario, you are just straight up supporting an individual for the purpose of them voting in your favor.

(1) Do you know that Microsoft already has a campus in Fargo? It definitely enriches the local culture, but the politics are still fucked.

(2) Seems like you didn’t really read the OP, a common pattern ITT:

@SlackerInc

My first impulse was to simply pay for a moving truck and their first six months’ rent. But then it occurred to me that they could get a lot more bang for their buck, and put these people on more solid ground, by establishing businesses in those cities (maybe even negotiating tax breaks!) that provide housing (like the old “company towns”). Recruit lots of Mississippians (but still hire locals too) and even if the enterprise loses money, you might only have to subsidize ten or twenty percent the cost of simply paying their rent without getting anything back. It would also look like less of a nakedly political move, and it would be much harder to demonize without looking anti-jobs and racist to boot.

Did you stop reading after the first sentence of that paragraph? :dubious:

@k9bfriender

It seems you could really just go out and buy votes for far, far less.

:eek: Okay, first off I’m not out to advocate something illegal (because unethical). Where do you get the idea that votes can just easily be “bought” on a massive scale? If what you really mean is spending tons of money on blanketing people with ads, that is clearly getting less and less efficacious as people harden into their ideological camps.

@CarnalK

You seem to be under the delusion that everyone disagrees for some politically correct reasons.

Izzat right? :dubious: Then I’m sure you can cite the post where I expressed this idea you say I “seem” (weasel word) to have. In reality, that in no way resembles anything I think: I am, to be sure, no fan of political correctness—but I don’t even know what the PC angle would be in this case.

[CarnalK]

Hey, they’re called weasel words for a reason. You certainly haven’t addressed some of the reality based questions your proposal would require answering. Like how many people you hope to move, how you avoid the legal hurdles of race based hiring, etc. You utterly avoided my request for some examples of this strategy being planned let alone executed.

[SlackerInc]

You’re changing the subject. What did I say that indicated I was laying disagreement at the feet of “political correctness”?

[CarnalK]

I apologize for incorrect impression.

You may now lay out some specifics for your plan. If that proves difficult, you may have answered your own OP as to why Soros doesn’t do this.