Wow, I’ve heard a lot of young people say they wished old people would hurry up and die, but I didn’t know they’d started taking action on that. :eek:
Right, because young people are entitled to jobs and shouldn’t have to compete with people who have experience and seniority.
A few years ago my friend’s wife was advised by a coworker that she should quit; he told her that by working, she was keeping a job out of the hands of a family man.
Is your assertion really all that different?
And a knife wound in their back?
One former employer was strongly rumored to have a policy of rushing anyone with a medical problem right out the plant gates to the hospital, no matter what, even omitting primary care steps if necessary, out of fear of liability consequences if the death occurred on company property. There was also surreptitiously-circulated chart showing life expectancy vs. retirement age for that company - the longer you stayed, the sooner you died.
Who is to say that the old guy doesn’t need that job as much as or more than the young guy? This sounds like straight up age discrimination.
No.
Now forgive me but I am coming from the perspective of a small town which might only have a few jobs available and we had these people working in some of the few jobs there were - working for the city, who were working well past their retirement age. These jobs could easily be filled by a younger worker but these old guys sat on them and the young people had to move elsewhere to find work.
I’ll be eligible to retire when I’m about 54. I won’t retire then, for two reasons. First, I think I’ll still want to be earning money instead of spending my savings. Second, my wife won’t be able to retire for at least 10 years after I can…and I don’t want to putter around the house by myself while she’s at work.
What’s the difference between having a job and sitting on a job?
What gives the younger guy a greater right to it?
Why shouldn’t younger people—who are les burdened by responsibilities and can move more easily—have to move to find work?
I have trouble believing that a 70 year old who can retire on a pension and social security who works because he cant stand his spouse, can need a job as much as a 26 year old single mother or some other young person struggling to start a career. I’m sorry but like what was mentioned above, many older workers work well into retirement for reasons NOT associated with needing the money.
And look at the company. Lets say their is a position where the pay scale starts at $30k and goes up to $75k. A new worker starts out with 1 week vacation and sick while the older worker gets 4 weeks vacation and sick. Is it always good for the company to keep the older worker? And you cannot tell me every older worker is more productive than the younger ones.
How may of those folks would you estimate have jobs with deadlines and accountability and actually produce meaningful work? Verses folks that just like to go to meetings and provide [sarcasm]support [/sarcasm]. Not that I’m bitter or anything. 
I don’t hire based upon the candidates need, I hire them based on their experience, talents, etc. “Need” has nothing to do with it.
On the charity issue, boy do we need more retirees.
My story - my son with autism is part of a local organization that up till a few years ago was run by parents. Who even the best of us have limited time to devote to the cause. Well about 6 years ago a retired couple took over (grandparents to one child) and the group took off. Why? They had the time and energy, not to mention connections from their years of working, to devote to the cause. The group expanded by several degrees because of them.
Its the plain simple fact that retirees have more time to work for charities.
We need you!
Well lets see - sitting on a job is doing the minimal amount to keep from getting fired but nothing more. And it can be darn hard to fire an older worker with seniority.
And that same job can be done by someone for half the pay who takes less time off.
Sure, the younger crowd can move. Then why do the older ones get mad when their towns die away?
But isnt that only part of it? Will a worker get along with the current workforce? Do they expect a higher salary because of their age? Can they handle someone 20 years younger than them telling them what to do? What if the have health concerns which might require more sick leave or more accommodations?
Sounds like even more age discrimination
I sometimes wonder. We had a guy pass away a while back who was 70. Discovered he’d done 20+ years in the military, retired, and worked 25+ years full-time at our place and somewhere else. He’d been living on his pension and using his income to buy several apartment buildings. His job at the bank was entry-level - a drop in the bucket for him, a life-changer for some kid, especially with the tuition assistance program.
We had a husband-wife team in different departments doing the same - two full-time jobs for 25+ years, always saying they needed the money to help their kids. Okay, but their daughter was a nurse, one son a bank vp, so what sort of help did these 20-something professionals need? They stopped working because the wife was laid off from both jobs, the husband took ill. They’re drawing four pensions though, plus ss.
Interesting thoughts here on old vs young in jobs. Personally I think it should go to the most qualified, however the company management sees it (I assume they can weigh experience against salaray/time off too).
But on to my story. My parents are retired, with a variety of pension checks (BigCorp, State employee, teacher retirement, Military retirement, 2 SS checks, and both 401Ks). In short, money’s no problem for them.
My Dad is a staunch conservative, and believes much like I do about jobs, but… while buying electrical equipment for a building project (he does that when he’s bored) the company owner offered him a job delivering and installing electrical stuff. Dad considered it (boredom again) but declined when he noticed the large stack of applications on the owner’s desk. They were all for that same job, but the owner told him none of the younger men were qualified*. Dad turned it down, figuring these were young families who needed it more than he. He posed the same question to me that continually bewilders him. Why aren’t the young kids learning anything useful? He’s perplexed, because to him there seem to be plenty of jobs with no takers.
*BS Mechanical Engineering, MS Electrical Engineering, MBA, Licensed Electrician, etc. etc.
Comment - being old doesn’t mean you are past your use by date, it also doesn’t mean you have useful experience. Both apply.
If you’ve been doing the same job for 20 years you don’t necessarily have 20 years experience. Depending on how long it took to master the job it’s not unlikely that you actually only have 1 years experience, 20 times.
If there are X jobs in town and X+1 employable adults, then one person (that unemployed kid) has to leave town to find work. There will still be X people there, i.e. the town won’t die.
When the old guy finally does retire or die, the job is up for grabs, and there’s probably going to be someone around to take it.
Will a worker get along? A valid consideration, whether young or old. However, an employer cannot just let someone go because they’re old and therefore probably can’t get along. If you tell a senior employee “we’re letting you go because you’re old,” you should brace yourself for an expensive lawsuit.
Higher salary shouldn’t be expected with age, it should be expected with experience. Especially if someone has been working for that particular employer for a long time; they know exactly how to do their job, who to contact to get X task done, what form to fill out for this process, what the correct procedure is for that, where this piece of equipment is stored, where to buy spare parts for it, and so on. These are the kinds of things that make them more efficient, more productive, than someone with far less experience.
It’s entirely possible an older employee may not be able to handle a pup being their supervisor; there are plenty of pups who can’t handle being told what to do, either. Again, you discipline or terminate because of that issue, not simply because the employee is old.
Health concerns are health concerns, regardless of age. The Americans With Disabilities Act requires an employer to make “reasonable accomodations.” Maybe the old lady has carpal tunnel syndrome. Guess what, you can’t just say “you’re fired;” you need to buy her a split keyboard and an ergo mouse (or speech-recognition software) so she can do her job. Older folks may have hidden health issues that require more sick leave than others, but you’re not allowed to terminate them for that (unless they’re gone so much that their job really isn’t getting done). It would be like discriminating against young women because they might become pregnant and require a big chunk of maternity leave. Neither one is allowed.
I don’t retire because I like the job and I like the people I work with. If either of those were to change I would leave tomorrow. We have no debt, a healthy and well performing 401K, and several other investment accounts so I could leave at any time.
I am quite fortunate to have a pretty good job. We get to travel and I am well compensated. The functions I do - earth science & engineering for a large O&G company - have remained understaffed in the industry for some time now and there are not enough university students that are getting the degrees required to work in this field. This is true many of the other energy companies, so the completion for suitable potential candidates is quite fierce. For us old timers, this means the company works quite hard to ensure we are happy and stick around for a while. If someone does retire, they can put themselves on a list and after a 6 month wait, be rehired by the company at the same salary.
Sometimes the old-timers are there because no one has the heart to kick them out. We had a cafeteria lady that was loathed by the women at work. She was in her 90s and had very subjective portion sizes - men got more, women got less, and women she thought could lose a few pounds really got slighted. The most mgmt did was move her to a station she couldn’t do this at, like handing out pre-made sandwiches and bags of chips. She still offered suggestions, though. :rolleyes: