Why hasn’t the US converted to Gasohol? It would be less expensive and OPEC would have less control over the US. Also it would be safer for the environment and there would be greater demand for ethanol alcohol, which can be produced in the US, which would cause an economic boon for US farmers. Brazil has converted to gasohol, have there been any bad effects to Brazil or any other country that uses gasohol? What are the other advantages of gasohol? Also any pro-gasohol conversion websites or information would be appreciated.
For the same reason more people drink regular beer than light beer. If a product sucks, people won’t use it.
I used gasohol in my cars during the energy crunch of the late 70’s. It made my cars run like shit. Internal combustion engines run best on petrolium products.
In S.E. Wisconsin we have to use reformulated gas (10% ethonal) it makes one of my cars run terrible. Not sure what the difference is between reformulated gas and gasohol.
We could have cheaper gas by doing some very hard core things towards the arabs, like jacking up wheat prices, refusing to protect them against Sadam, etc. For the benefits they get out of us, there is no reason why super premium shouldn’t be 40 cents a gallon, tax included.
I work in the great world of agribusiness. I like gasohol. I fill my tank with it. But let’s remember our quest to fight ignorance.
First off, gasohol is not less expensive than straight gasoline. It’s more expensive, or it would be if there weren’t large federal and state subsidies to produce it. Perhaps the cost of production would go down with the economies of scale, but it hasn’t yet. Those subsidies, by the way, are the subject of intense debate and controversy every time either a tax bill or a farm bill comes before Congress.
Second, don’t forget there is an environmental cost (energy use) to produce ethanol from plants, which requires energy in addition to the energy used to refine petroleum.
Third, gasohol does not produce as much energy as straight gasoline. With the 10%-15% blend that most oil companies use, the difference is slight, but with a blend called E-85 (85% ethanol, 15% gasoline) the difference is signifcant and it shows in the vehicle’s mileage.
Fourth, ethanol does things to fittings and gaskets that straight gasoline doesn’t. Again, it makes little difference with a 10%-15% blend, but if you run E-85 or straight ethanol, automakers will need to install special fittings and gaskets or risk premature failure. In fact, that’s the reason there’s a price difference between so-called “all fuel” vehicles and the standard ones.
Higher cost of production, higher cost of operation, compatability issues. Together, they add up to a high “cost of entry” for gasohol into the market. I think those barriers will someday be overcome, but not immediately.
And, let’s see if I pasted this link to the Renwable Fuels Association correctly http://www.ethanolrfa.org/
Maybe the problems are in the engines? New engines are designed every year, why couldn’t they make an engine that will run well on gasohol. My original request for pro-gasohol information still stands.
A few questions:
[li] How long would it take to design an engine that would work on gasahol? [New car designs appear every year, but that is after months and years of design, not to mention the failures along the way.][/li]
[li] How long would it take to design an engine that would work on both regular gasoline AND gasahol? [Just because (theoretically) I live in an area that stocks gasahol and I purchase a gasahol-powered car, does not mean that every where stocks gasahol. Would I have to rent a gasoline -powered car to visits friends in an area that does not have gasahol at all?][/li]
[li] What is the cost of refurbishing service stations for gasahol pumps? [For example: diesel is used in many automobiles; however, diesel is not available at every service station.][/li]
[li] Moreso, trying to convince a station owner to relinquish an island or two for gasahol sales, with no guarantee of sales?[/li]
People are still arguing about the merits of seat belts and air bags. After the ‘gas crunch’ of the 70s (as pkbites mentioned), convincing people to switch to what was effectively seen as a failure is not going to be easy.
As far as the price being cheaper, I’m not too sure about that. About 1/3 of what I pay for a gallon of gas is state and federal taxes.
Okay, it’s real simple- Gasahol doesn’t work as well as “pure” gasoline. (Which is something of a misnomer since what we call gasoline has about forty distinctly different aromatic compounds.)
Ethanol and methanol have fewer BTU’s per pound- meaning less energy. Thus a typical car- more on this in a moment- has less power and poor mileage.
The alcohol is typically added not so much that it’s cheaper/more available/etc, but rather it’s an oxygen-bearing fuel. It helps add oxygen to the combustion, which in turn reduces emissions.
Because of this, racers use it, in specially modified carburetors, to make metric boatloads of power. Since it carries some of it’s own oxygen, the more you shove into the cylinder (turbocharging, supercharging, etc) the more power you make.
BUT, mileage goes down as well- significantly. No problem for a racer, big problem for a daily-driver.
Second, as kunilou mentioned, the alcohol fuels tend to attack otherwise-fuel-resistant seals. In snowbelt states, where drivers use HEET or other fuel system “dryers” (the alcohol absorbs the moisture and allows it to “mix” with the gasoline) the additive can attack things like the rubber diphragm in the older mechanical fuel pumps, accellerator-pump diaphragms in carburetors, rubber (flexible) fuel lines, the sender/pickup gasket in the tank, etc.
The absorption of water is also a major problem with Gasahol- the fuel can absorb water in the delivery trucks, in the service station’s tanks, and while sitting around in your car. The additional moisture- several percent is not unheard of- robs the engine of further power, and also tends to cause additional fuel system damage in the form of internal rust.
Now, to recap, everyone that wants a gasoline that gives your car less power and lower mileage, can cause internal fuel system damage that can be difficult and expensive to repair, and uses a hefty portion of your own tax dollars to artifically give it a lower street price…
… Raise your hand. 
The gas out there already is gasohol to use. Anytime you put a gasosine that has an ethanol percentage, it’s gasohol. Ethanol doesn’t give of as much energy per volume as 100% gasoline. Ethanol requires petroleum products be made into fertilizer, the crops planted, grown, harvested, and then shipped to an ethanol distillery.
A correction/clarification:
Racers use straight methanol, not a gasoline/alcohol mix.
BUT, to run it, the carburetor(s) have to be modified to flow at least two-and-a-half TIMES the fuel… If done well, the engine can make roughly 30% more horsepower than the same engine running a weel-tuned gasoline carburetor.
But, as you can imagine, mileage takes a knife to the heart.
(I recall an article in an old HOT ROD magazine, about a guy who skirted California emissions laws by running methanol in a street-driven supercharged-hemi powered 'Cuda… while driving around for the photo shoot, he averaged 1.4 GALLONS per MILE. )
Doc Nickel was eloquent in his correct statement of the problems with ethanol as a fuel for internal combustion engines. The truth is that, if it weren’t for the extensive lobbying efforts of Arhcer Daniels Midland (ADM), and their ex-senate cohort, Bob Dole, ethanol would have been dumped as a viable alternative to gasoline years ago. The only reason it’s still around is that ADM makes millions from corn products, including ethanol, and spends millions lobbying congress to ensure that they can continue to do so.
There one thing that most of the US has that Brazil doesn’t: cold weather. Because of ethanol’s lower energy yield, vehicles that use it are harder to start in the winter. You can notice this with the 10% stuff; I shudder to think of what an E-85-fueled vehicle would act like on a frigid December morning.
Yes, gasohol really REALLY sucks. Derleth is on the right track, but I’ll fill in some extra details by way of a lengthy anecdote.
Back in the late 1970s, I used to own a fully restored classic 1965 Mustang GT convertible. Man was it sweet, I had to buy 4 or 5 parts cars to restore it, but the engine was in perfect condition, and that was what made it a GT, the high-compression V8 engine, which was so rare as to be irreplaceable. The owner’s manual recommended something like 112 octane gas, I can’t believe they sold anything rated that high back in the 1960s, nowadays they call that stuff “aviation fuel.” So when I was driving the car, the best you could get was about 84 octane, and maybe 86 if you used gasohol. So I thought I’d give the car what it wanted, and bought gasohol for the extra octane.
So one wintry day, I’m driving my classic Mustang from Denver back to Iowa. I’m driving along and suddenly, BOOM, my engine blows. I limp along to the next exit and the gas station’s service guy checks out my engine. The head gasket is blown. The valves are screwed up. The engine block is cracked. The irreplaceable engine is destroyed. End of car.
What I later found out was that gasohol has one major distribution problem in cold weather. When filling the underground storage tanks, some cold moist air gets into the tank and water condenses in the tank. And if there is the LEAST little bit of water in a gasoline/alcohol mix, the liquids separate. This is even more prone to happening in your gas tank. So what happens is the alcohol settles to the bottom, and as you’re driving around and sloshing the liquids, at one moment you’re burning gasoline and the next moment you’re burning almost pure alcohol. This usually results in excessive compression which can blow out your gaskets, and the gaskets are probably already weakened by exposure to alcohol. And the excessive compression can do even worse things to an engine, as it did to mine.
So… Gasohol sucks. It REALLY sucks.