Is it really easy to learn how to hot wire any car you jump into, or just some poorly made ones? If so, why? I’m not looking to pick up on criminal lessons (I think that’s against the Rules around about these parts), but just wondering if the “wires” used are really as readily available as entertainment and joy riding crime in the city makes it seem.
Of course there are still a surprising number of idiots who leave the key in the ignition, making hot-wiring completely unnecessary.
My father-in-law (a mechanic) taught me how to hot-wire my 1970s-era Mercury with only a pair of pliers. Things have gotten a little more difficult since then, but it’s still relatively easy to do.
The key to defeating a car thief is not to make it impossible to hot wire, but to make it difficult and time-consuming to defeat the steering wheel lock, so the thief gives up and moves on to another car.
It’s no longer the easy crime of opportunity that it used to be.
Steering wheel locks (eg: when you remove the ignition key, as opposed to “the club”) cut down on the usefulness of hotwiring. Engine may be running, but you can’t steer.
Some cars also need to see a pre-determined “tag” in addition to the ignition key to activate the ignition circuits - my car appears to use an RFID-style tag buried under the plastic head on the key as there are no external contacts. There’s a fairly elaborate process to add a key - you can’t just have the hardware store cut a copy and have it work.
Above and beyond that, the remote entry (part and parcel to the “alarm” system) is also required - if I use the key in the exterior door lock to open the door, the ignition will remain disabled.
Not saying this all can’t be disabled or bypassed, but it’s certainly going to be challenging.
Anecdote to that fact: About four years ago, halloween, someone broke into my car, and even apparently got the motor running, but couldn’t defeat the steering lock, so they powered it down and left it.
Next morning, I get the mechanic to tow it, he says, “Huh. They had no idea what they were doing.”
“Really?”
He nods, reaches into the mess that’s the steering column, pushes down one little piece of metal, and click, the lock is released.
Well, it’s not so much that it’s easy to hotwire a car as that it’s difficult to make it hard to hotwire a car.
Consider that all that turning the ignition switch does (in an older car without a lot of electronics) is apply power to a relay. That’s a pretty basic on/off switch, and there’s a lot of motivation for keeping it basic. Simpler is cheaper and more foolproof. So, like most things, simple works until evil-intentioned people start taking advantage of it, and then you have to get increasingly sophisticated to defeat increasingly well-informed thieves.
True hotwiring is quite obsolete (only works on pretty old cars). Nowadays stealing of cars without electronic theft-deterence is typically done by breaking the steering lock, which works mostly on somewhat old cars. That technique is becoming obsolete, but there are still a lot of oldish cars on the road.
Actual hotwiring was fairly easy on most older cars with carburetors and point-type ignition systems. If the electrical terminals on the ignition switch were accessible, it could all be done inside under the dash. If they weren’t, there was still access to the necessary circuits under the hood.
A number of changes came along in the 70’s, including steering locks. While hotwiring was generally still easy, driving the car wasn’t unless one went further and did some mechanical damage to said lock.
With more changes in the 80’s to fuel and ignition systems, it wasn’t always a sure bet that the circuits accessible under the hood would allow one to get the car running. Hotwiring generally got replaced with breaking the steering lock and nearby parts so that one could actuate the ignition switch without a key.
In the 90’s technology was developed that kept the fuel and/or ignition systems from working unless certain electronic signals were present, as mentioned above. Cars with those designs are essentially unstartable to ordinary thieves.
Or is it?
Well on my current ride when you go to get in and start the car here is what happens:
[ul]
[li]Remote receiver gets a radio signal from remote. Signal is a rolling code, and is programmed with both a 16 digit and 8 digit security code (both are alpha numeric and case sensitive)[/li][li]Alarm is deactivated, and car unlocks[/li][li]Insert key into keyhole, if the physical cut is incorrect, key will not turn, and car will not start[/li][li]ID tag in key is queried by central computer, key must match what has been programmed or a message “start prevented try again” is displayed, and no start*[/li][li]Assuming all is OK so far then when key is turned, Central computer asks Engine control module for password, if that goes OK, then Engine control module asks central control module for its password. If both of those passwords agree then and only then will the car start**[/li][/ul]
So good luck hotwiring my car. 
*There are hundreds if not thousands of chips available for a given car. The parts depot has maybe a thousand keys in a bin, when you order one they grab the one on top and cut it to your car. Selection is random. Programming a new key requires access to our central computer server to get the PIN that unlocks this program, and then programming the new key. ot a DIY job.
** On the new S40/V50 after those two passwords are exchanged, then the serial number of the ABS control module queried, and if it agrees with what has been stored, then and only then will the car crank and start. (Of course the “key” on this model does not have a cut on it, so you trade on level of physical security for one more level of electronic security.
Now compare that to Johnny LA’s (or my) MGB The car could be started and driven away with all electrical circuits functional by using a nickel. Yup, 0.05 got you a free car. No, I won’t tell you how.
A bit of a hijack, but related.
I always felt smug and secure with my “high tech” key, without which, allegedly, my car will refuse to start. Apparently the car’s computer needs to see a very specific resistor inside the key, and, if it doesn’t, refuses to turn on the fuel pump. I bought into the notion that cars like mine are pretty much unstealable, short of towing.
Then, the other day I was getting a house key duplicated at one of those little “huts” you find in strip malls. The guy had signs prominently displayed, advertising that he can “make copies of the latest keys - transponders, resistors, while you wait.” :eek:
If he can do it, I’m sure the thieves can too. Of course, they wouldn’t have the original in order to make a copy, but before this I was convinced that only the dealer could do such things. It was a wake-up call. I guess it comes back to the old adage - if a thief wants your car bad enough, he’ll get it.
(On another sign at the same hut, it also said “if you don’t have 3, you don’t have a spare” - it then went on to explain that to make a duplicate of the newer keys, you actually need to have two existing ones. I have no idea why, unless it’s some kind of “cross check”.)
… and boy, I bet the mods are watching this thread closely
If you have both keys, it’s more likely that it’s acutally your car (or that you’re allowed to have dups made. Less of a chance or your kid/cow-orker/valet/parking lot attendent etc… will grab your keys and make a copy before you notice they’re gone. Certainly not fool proof, but kind of a CYA thing. OTOH, they’ll lose a lot of impulse buys.
I had a Citroen BX that had the ignition lock break, jamming the steering lock. I had to dismantle the steering column plasticware, and disable the steering lock with a cold chisel and a big hammer. Shorting together key wires from the ignition switch enabled all the car electrics, while momentarily shorting the last 2 wires cranked the starter motor.
I didn’t bother replacing the trashed steering lock or ignition switch. Instead, I replaced the ignition switch with a bunch of heavy duty relays operated from a small switch, and a microswitch hidden under the driver’s seat operated a relay to switch the starter motor solenoid.
Not a very secure system, but the car wasn’t really worth stealing, and anyone stupid enough to try wouldn’t be smart enough to work it out.
But the odd thing was, replacing the ignition switch with relays improved the engine performance! It was smoother at low revs, and had more horsepower in the power band. I put this down to better contacts on my relays compared to the old ignition switch, so more energy gets to the ignition coil and hence the spark plugs.
DarrenS When I was moving into a new office recently, I spent a lot of time with the local locksmith. While they can program some keys for some cars, they cannot program a key for all cars. The system I described in post above yours cannot be duplicated at the local locksmith.
Does this mean that you think the power for the spark plugs is routed through the steering column? Is it? That seems like a pretty lame design…
The high voltage (secondary) that goes to the plugs come from the ignition coil. The coil is energized by a 12-volt (primary) circuit that goes through the ignition switch. This is standard on all cars. If there’s a problem with the primary, there’s likely to be a problem with the secondary.
Transponder keys:
Depending on make and model, different ways are used to program/duplicate keys.
A few transponders can be “cloned” where a special machine will read the transponder signal then install a duplicate signal on the duplicate blank.
Most transponders can be programed via On Board programming (some require two current keys to add additional keys such as Ford products)
All can be programed with the proper computer device.
At the locksmith shop I work at, duplicating and programming can be done on on all vehicles, (excluding European imports).
Any more details and I would have to ask one of the technicians at work who does the automotive service calls.
Osip
Ok I have a question well simply because I don’t know as far as what to do next I have a Chevy 2003 Impala I had switched the ignition switch and then I gave out on me so I bought one from ebay and it came with the switch and the keys so I called up locksmith that programs keys transponder keys and him himself couldn’t even program the key so I don’t know what to do next my car is not drivable without programming the key so what would wear would be the next step
1965 Chevy Pick-up … attach the four foot of wire between the [deleted] and the [deleted] … slid underneath with a big screwdriver and briefly short out the starter solenoid … ran fine. When the clutch gave out I had to finally cut the wires to the broken ignition switch and used toggle switches dangling down at my feet, kinda need that driving a manual … and the cops got on my ass about brake lights …
The three-on-the-tree was frozen with rust, I figured all the baling wire from the cab to the transmission was enough to scare off any thief …
I’ve been kind of wondering something related to this: Is it possible to hotwire a Tesla? The car wakes up when its master approaches with the key fob in his pocket, then the car turns itself on when the master fastens his seat belt. No buttons, no readily-accessible relays to jam with a screwdriver or anything like that, as near as I can tell.
To Krupp my 1985 Mazda RX7 from being stolen I rewired the 12v to the fuel pump. It’s now activated by a switch on the dash. Good luck figuring that out if you don’t know about it.
Has anyone posting after Benzo noticed that this is a zombie besides me?