Which part of what I wrote do you consider nonsense?
Unless of course, Jesus showed up and one of his first questions was “Have you been taking good care of the planet I loaned you?”
All of it. It’s a ludicrous misrepresentation of what conservatives and business owners think.
Businessmen they drink my wine, plowmen dig my earth, but none of them along the line know what at all it is worth. (©Bob Dylan ~ As rendered by Jimi Hendrix. Reproduction without prior written authorization void where prohibited. May be frowned upon in some states.)
Year after year I keep hearing this complaint about short-sighted business thinking. (I used to be married to an economist.) So haven’t any businesses tried rewarding long-term thinking? If so many people see quaterly-statement-based shortsightedness as wrong, has anyone tried alternative models?
I KNEW there was a flaw in their logic! 
So you contend the wealthy care about the common people ? Interesting alternate universe you live in.
In my opinion, conservatives tend to be religious fanatics who don’t worry about the real world; ignorant fools who have no idea of the consequences of their actions; profiteers who would pave the whole planet if it earned them a few bucks; or some combination of the three. They don’t care about much outside themselves.
An admitted hijack from the topic of this thread, but I’ve always thought drilling in Alaska was a poor idea for strategic reasons. We control Alaska and we know that oil will be there. It’s hardly inconceivable that at some point in the future we might lose access to foreign oil supplies (due to a political crisis in the Middle East or something equally unlikely). At that point, the Alaskan oil reserve will be a huge asset and may save the country. To use it up now just to bring gas prices down 25 cents would be a sell-out to short term political and business interests.
I forgot where I read this, but I’ve seen it reprinted. A Palestinian villager is planting an olive tree. The tree will not bear fruit until he’s old or dead and his children are grown. He plants it so his children will have the fruit, even though he won’t. Doesn’t that way of economic thinking exist among Americans too?
Great song quote. Sure, longer-term strategies are used and rewarded frequently. The statement about quarterly results and bonuses is true in some cases, but more frequently the short-sightedness is on the part of investors. Quarterly results have more impact on stock prices, which in turn impact the value of executives’ stock options, than on the actual bonuses. Lots of companies (utilities, drug companies, software firms, equipment manufacturers) engage in long-term strategies.
I think it does. Not as much as we might prefer, but it’s part of the mix.
OK, do you think I was wrong to think that
- Part of the American dream is to want to start your own biz?
- Part of the American dream is to get very rich from your business?
- Part of the American dream is to be ABLE to hang out on a tropical island, etc. (I mean, even if that isn’t your idea of paradise, something is, right?)
- OK, I may have been stretching the point about the poor and the middle class choking on whatever shit their business produces, but I don’t think protecting the environment is a BIG part of the typical entrepreneur’s dream …
Sorry, I think I have it down cold here.
How do Andrew Carnegie and Bill Gates fit into the “interesting alternative universe” that you apparently inhabit?
Well, it’s less a question of idealism than it is of precedent – and also of priorities.
As to the OP, I’ve often wondered about this myself. Conservation is, conceptually at least, an uber-conservative position: “Don’t change anything! You don’t know what will happen if you do!” And energy conservation also seems like it should be an arch-conservative position – reducing dependence on all those A-rabs, and whatnot.
Interestingly, there’s a burgeoning fundamentalist-Christian environmental movement, whose best-known proponent is Billy Graham.
Religious fundamentalism is also a factor. Fundy party line is that Jesus will come back and save us before any of this becomes a factor.
It’s worth noting that why environmentalism is seen as a largely liberal cause, it’s one with a lot of support from the general populace and members of congress from both parties. Consider that with a hefty majority in congress and rising oil prices and a lot of focus by the media on unrest in the Middle East, the gov’t has still not gone a head and allowed drilling in ANWAR.
I’m sure you do. Okay, point by point, using your original words. The traditional conservative American dream is
Most of the conservatives I know have no desire to own a business. They want to work and earn a living.
Same as above. The ones I know want to do well, but for various reasons have chosen paths that will provide for them, but have no chance of making them rich.
Cite? The US has tons of examples of conservatives who haven’t done anything of the sort. Are there examples of those who have, other than fugitives from the law?
Where are the examples? Most conservative business owners live in the same macro-environment as least some of their customers and workers. Many hugely successful businesses, regardless of the political philosophy of their founder, are neutral or beneficial for the environment
Many do. I’m one. There are others in this thread.
Do I have to say it? Everyone lives in the environment.
While that is true of some fundamentalists, it is not as prevalent as you may think, and is hardly a “party line.” My church, which most would consider fundamentalist, views environmentalism through the lens of stewardship, the idea that we are called by God to use all resources wisely.
Of course, his first question could also be “Why is it that when I told you I was coming back shortly, you didn’t help create jobs and relieve suffering of people with the resources I provided for you?”
Well, to be fair, I did say “at least part of it” in an attempt to indicate a relatively small part. About the only place I’ve heard the “God’s creation” reasoning put forth is in the connection between energy consumption and, say, global warming. Perhaps that’s changed recently.
I actually think that “business” does have more to do with it and I’ll gladly acknowledge that some conservatives (modify the “some” qualifier if you’d like it to be more inclusive) advocate for strong environmental protection. Nonetheless, I don’t think I’m wrong that at least a part of it is due to religious beliefs. However, I have no real feeling for the extent of that part, so if one would rather focus on the more predominant (and/or common) reasons, I have no objections.
Digital Stimulus- In my experience, those who have strong religious beliefs, including me, try to adopt political positions that are consistent with their understanding of God’s will. This can in practice become very selective and self-serving, of course. I have heard Christians use the dominion statement in Genesis to justify wanton exploitation, and as I said, my church and others understand the various stewardship messages in the bible to mean that we are instructed to use the earth wisely. I have also read opinion pieces whose goal was to refute cataclysmic environmental predictions by extolling the resiliency and indestructability of the environment, but I didn’t notice any religious justification in those.