Why is "The Searchers" Such a Great Movie?

So, you like the passive-aggressive, I’m-trying-to-avoid-a-life-of-violence-until-I-can-justify-it-by-protecting-the-underdog type of cowboy movie? Shane, frankly, is a bit of a jerk.

When it comes to Eastwood, although Unforgiven is a great one, I’d have to pick High Plains Drifter as his best at undermining any of the nonsense about heroic vigilantism. The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly and Once Upon A Time In The West each have iconic scenes (especially the extended opening scene in the latter, which is one of the best openings in the history of cinema), but I think the best Western ever made is still Sam Peckinpah’s The Wild Bunch.

As for John Ford, I’ll have to join “the book club” and take The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence over The Searchers any day. But then, I never cared much for Wayne in any role (though he is at least somewhat more suited to Westerns than cop movies or historical films about Mongol leaders) and enjoy the fact that the movie totally undermines his image.

Stranger

As an aside, not only is Taxi Driver not the greatest movie ever, but it’s not even Scorsese’s greatest movie, which would be Raging Bull. Mind you, I think it’s a very good movie, but it definitely has its rough spots, and it takes several viewings to really appreciate it, and even then, it has a limited appeal. The narrative voiceover is a bit jarring, and shouldn’t really be necessary. Raging Bull is definitely a more polished, more assured, but still very personal movie.

Stranger

I suppose he is. A great movie doesn’t need a nice hero… after all, if it did, we wouldn’t even be talking about The Searchers.

That would also be a very good choice.

I can’t think of a Western, off the top of my head, that doesn’t have at least one flaw, and so I find it a really tough exercise to decide which one is best. “Unforgiven” really should have ended a few minutes earlier than it did, for instance.

Don’t take your guns to town, boy.

If we believe the premise of the movie – lawlessness and land disputes – there was a use for people like Shane.

What was he gonna do – let Joe go after Wilson and Stryker’s boys? He might have considered it for a second, since that’d leave the lovely Marian a widow, but the man knew what he was good at, and he knew his days were numbered, and he knew he could help.

And he didn’t die at the end either. It was just a flesh wound. :stuck_out_tongue:

It’s been said before; you’re just as likely to have insulted me for repeating myself as you have for ridiculously overrating the movie as a DVD nerd engaged in a refusal to admit that at least forty minutes of the movie is awful. (If you want to call me a liar for *pretending *to like a movie that you so clearly are *right *about, please open a pit thread. Thanks.)

Back to a CS tone, I hope: the forty minutes that you declare, absolutely, are “awful,” are probably the parts of the film that were stylized in a that the contemporary audiences had come to expect from a Hollywood epic. Our tastes have changed over the years, and thus our aesthetic context for such stylization. But if you make an effort to take that different context into consideration, or if you watch enough movies of that style so that it no longer sticks out like a sore thumb, it’s possible that the stylization wouldn’t be as jarring–scuse me, awful–to you. Possible, I say; unlike you, I’ll leave room for an honest difference of opinion.

John Ford is America’s Shakespeare. And, like Shakespeare, he recognized that he was creating art for a mass audience. Shakespeare had his bawdy asides tossed to the “penny public”; Ford had his comic relief characters, his dances, his romantic hyperbole. But, also like Shakespeare, the universal scope and breathtaking impact of the stories he told–at least in the masterpieces–is there for anyone who’s willing to meet these works on their own terms, instead of imposing your own expectations and ignoring the very important concept of historical context.

I’m not saying that everyone *must *do this. I’m also not saying, like you are, that anyone who doesn’t is a liar. I’m only saying that the context from which you judge these works is not the context in which they were created, so there will necessarily be a disconnect in your judgment.

Anyway, yes, I agree with most of the posters in this thread, that if you judge The Searchers without any effort to understand its context, you probably won’t like it. (There is, of course, as I acknowledged above, the possibility that even if you do fully understand its context you won’t like it; it’s certainly not the single movie ever made that deserves 100% approval. Personal taste will still out, no matter the individual knowledge base.) Even with customers in my video store, it’s not the first Western I recommend when someone wants to “try some old Westerns.” I consider it a difficult film, and I understand that most “newbies” won’t *necessarily *appreciate it. (I don’t know if he remembers it, but the first time I saw it was when **Cervaise lent me his copy. I didn’t get it, I didn’t like it. Then a couple years later, after I’d gone on a John Ford kick after really enjoying My Darling Clementine, I watched it again and it blew me away.) For newbies, I recommend Rio Bravo, Red River, or My Darling Clementine first. Those movies are far and away more entertaining than The Searchers. But The Searchers is, for want of a better term, a *deeper *film, and once my newbie customers have acquired the “vocabulary” to appreciate The Searchers, I recommend that.

*The Searchers *is not about getting the cattle to market, or winning a woman, or defending your honor. It’s about the irreconcilable contradictions of the settling of the American West: the men who couldn’t live in a community, and so kept looking for wilder lands further west, and in doing so inevitably blazed a trail for the community that would follow them, keeping them pushing further and further. It’s about the irreconcilable contradictions of the American character; at least of the American character as Ford saw it in his time.

Sorry, meant to include this link:

Okay, I’ll speak up for the defense. I think The Searchers is a great movie and arguably the best western ever made.

The thing that distinguishs it is the character of Ethan Edwards. Up until this movie, the heroes of western movies were people you could admire unreservedly. Edwards was clearly a flawed man. He might have followed a code of honor but he was not inherently honorable. So when his family was killed and he felt he had to track down their killers and rescue his niece he did it only because he felt it was his duty not because it was the right thing to do. But as the quest went on for years, the pattern of doing the right thing became ingrained into Edwards - he might have been forced to do the right thing but he was doing the right thing - and it slowly began to change him into a genuinely moral man. In the climax, Edwards had to make a choice between following his duty and doing what was actually right and he is able to do what is right. Edwards has been redeemed and has become a moral man. And now that he is capable of seeing morality, he realizes that his presense among normal society will cause problems. So he makes the self-sacrifice and rides away in the final scene.

Nowadays, of course, most heroes are anti-heroes and we expect them to need redemption. But back in 1956 this was still an original theme.

Hombre is the best Western.
“How you going to get down that hill?” :slight_smile:

I find it absolutely baffling that you got “liar” out of my comment. I characterized your post as useless, not dishonest. It’s as if you were replying to a completely different post, or confused this thread with another. I didn’t even begin to imply you were lying about something. It’s really quite confusing.

It’s such a bizarre tangent, I’m not really sure if responding to anything else you wrote is worthwhile, because you might just continue responding to things I didn’t say.

But at least you did provide some interesting commentary on the movie this time.

If it’s great one-liners that make a Western, there’s always “Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms.”

What’s the Searchers got? “That which we are about to receive, we thank thee, O Lord.”

The Searchers is a great film.

When Laurie tells Martin that Martha would want Ethan to kill Debbie, that is a moment of truth you just don’t see in movies very often.

My favortie western is Sunset Blvd.

That was a good one. How about “That’ll be the day”? I’m trying to think of an earlier line from a western that made it into pop culture, but I can’t.

That might be the misqouted “smile when you call me that”

I agree 100%. Like in many Ford films it is easy to be put out by the antics of Ford’s usual suspects. The acting of people such as Hank Wordan can be very jarring to contemporary audiences. Taken in context I think it is a great movie. I won’t go so far as saying it is the greatest western but it is up there.

With one glaring exception: Patrick Wayne was horrible.

Right back at you.
When I read the opinion of an art critic that makes a definitive statement that such and such is the great american movie, despite ample dissent, my ‘‘critic wank’’ alarm goes off. Despite your very minor attempt at a disclaimer, you lived up to my expectations with your speech on how the educated palette will see it your way, but the rest just don’t get it.

You are, of course, welcome to your opinion, but many don’t share it, doesn’t make them provincial.

> TWEEET!! < ::: Moderator blows whistle for attention :::

OK, gang, I want to quote from the Forum Rules, noting Post #3 in that thread:

The personal insults will stop, NOW. On all sides. It is certainly possible for someone to dislike HAMLET and for someone else to think HAMLET is the greatest work of theatre ever, and for both to have valid opinions. It would be a boring world if we all felt the same. One of the purposes of this board is to exchange ideas and learn from each other. There is no “right” answer when it comes to art/entertainment.[sup]*[/sup]

We all on the same page here? Then carry on the discussion.

    • [sub]Talking about taste, rather than factual questions, obviously: there is a “right” answer to “Was Cary Grant the original choice for the Ward Bond role in THE SEARCHERS?” But you knew what I meant.[/sub]

Just for the record, I was directing the term ‘‘critic wank’’ at the writer of the review linked to in post #13, I’m sorry if that was unclear

I thought “The Searchers” was a beautiful film because of the incredible cinematography, and I thought it was an interesting film because of the changes that John Wayne’s character went through, but it’s not a great film, it moves way too slowly had has way too much lard on it. Lard being stuff that doesn’t advance the plot, characterization or setting in any way.

I’m not sure I have a Western I’d call “great” – I guess my favorite would be “The Magnificent Seven” but I dunno that it’s great.

I don’t agree with you. I have had a problem with some of the things lissener has said in the past (or more accurately how it was said) but I don’t see it here. Fact is some people can not get past things such as contemporary acting styles in movies to take them on their own merits. You can not judge a 50 year old movie by today’s standards (like or dislike: yes, bad or good: no). Some people do it out of ignorance “The acting was so unrealistic!” Some people understand that acting styles have changed but still can’t get past it. In every John Ford movie he has his cast of buddies, Ward Bond, Harry Carey, Hank Wordan… Not exactly method actors. If you want Deniro and Pacino don’t watch a John Ford movie. The Searchers is a great movie if taken in context. Look at all the westerns done before it. It stands out in theme and story line. Add to that Ford’s signature directing and you get a great movie. It’s like dismissing Citizen Kane because it’s nothing new. It was when it came out. Context matters.

Helpful discussion here. Thanks, guys.

It’s helped me understand why I haven’t warmed to the newer westerns. The ones I’ve seen don’t have the warm fuzzies that relieved the harshness of the older westerns. As much as I hated the romantic subplot in The Searchers, and the “comic” scenes with Martin’s Indian wife, they were a momentary relief from the hard stuff. I could relax for a few minutes.

I think Shane did a better job with this though. The warm fuzzies in Shane were brief and believable. In The Searchers, they went on too long.

The spaghetti westerns had no warm fuzzies, and I’ve never been able to appreciate them as westerns. Maybe I should view them as noir.