Why isn't the Ampersand used routinely in internet conversations and texts?

I doubt theres a GQ answer, so IMHO seems appropriate for this question.

Electronic communication spawned a flood of acronyms. AFAIK, LMAO, PITA, MOS, and many more that I never use.

Seems like the ampersand would be the obvious choice. BFF & I are going to the movies.

I almost never see the & used in any messaging. I’ve experimented using it in my posts. It’s in a very awkward location. Above the 7 key (middle of the keyboard) and it requires holding down the shift key. :smack: A piss poor design choice in my opinion.

I recall in the early computer days special characters were reserved for the OS as special control codes. No special characters (any shift-number key character) in file names, subject headers etc. But that was 30 years ago.

Why no love for the handy ampersand? Shouldn’t it be moved to a convenient keyboard location that doesn’t require the shift key?

Asked and answered, your honor.

Honestly, I try to use the ampersand, if only because it looks “classier”, IMO. But, I don’t see it gaining much traction because as long as we use the QWERTY keyboard, I don’t see any redesign / re-positioning of keys in the near future.

The horrible font symbol doesn’t help either.

This list includes proper ampersands. Some stupid fonts make it look like a E.

The SDMB *changes *my font. I get a proper ampersand when I type my message. Afterward the posting turns it into a stupid E. like now &. That will look like an E on my pc after I post, PITA

Exactly. It’s not convenient, and keyboard redesign is a non-starter for most people.

You’re aware the symbol itself is a stylized representation of the Latin et (and), right? Some fonts simply display that more obviously, is all.

Aside from all the previously mentioned points (it looks like that because it’s the word “et”, it’s annoying to get to on most keyboards and especially phone keyboards), it’s not a part of standard written english as espoused by the rulebooks. You could never write a term paper with sentences such as, “Therefore, the fact that Brett & Mark went to the pond further illustrates the point that…” or, “The nuclear device was disarmed, & Anna was relieved.” so you will not find it commonly used that way by people even when they’re out of school.

If people are trying to go txt-speak on their phone it’s more likely that they would say “BFF n I” instead of navigating to another screen or long-pressing a button to get the ampersand.

Frankly I find typing “and” to be easiest everywhere. My hands know where “and” is, they have to poke around for “&”.

I didn’t know the Latin origin.

I have poor handwriting, but my ampersands always looked pretty good. Sort of an eight with the curly Q. For some reason those pen strokes were easy for me.

“Etc.” is often abbreviated &c.
If you read old documents by Ben Franklin and others of that era, you’ll see that & & &c were used quite regularly. It wasn’t necessary to use the shift key in those days.

I wonder if a lot of web sites might display & incorrectly. The & symbol has a very special-purpose use in HTML, and a special html code, &amp, must be use to actually display the & symbol. I wonder if there are many sites that get it wrong? vBulletin seems to get it right, though.

You’re right, that symbol sucks.

Here’s a few you could use, if you don’t mind setting the Font. Arial looks particularly nice.
& Arial
& Comic Sans MS
& Times New Roman
& System

I guess the default font is Trebuchet MS:
& Trebuchet MS

I just tried changing my default font in Firefox (under tools options) and restarting. SDMB still displays the same font. I guess they override the browser setting.

It was worth a try. :wink:

In Firefox, you need to go to the “Advanced” options in “Content”, right next to where you choose your default font, and uncheck “Allow pages to choose their own fonts, instead of my selection above” in order for it to override. Be aware that this might disrupt some website displays.

Ok thanks! I’ll experiment and see how it goes.

So far, the sdmb looks much better in New Times Roman. I’ll have to try quite a few sites before making the change permanent.

It’s just enough of a bother to not use it when typing, normally. I do use it when sending a txt or tweet, since it frees up more room.

I always use them when printing or writing, though. It’s so engrained that when I’ve tried not to, I end up with a short scratchout before every single ‘and’, so I don’t bother trying anymore. :smiley: I don’t write mine like the traditional style, though. I used to do a backwards-3 style E with a vertical line through it. But since my printing and writing is extremely small (seriously, really really tiny), it felt a bit too cluttered. Now my ampersand is a bit more stylistic - it floats in the middle of the line space and is more like a cursive lower case c with a dot above and below.

I hate it when people use a + sign instead of the &. When I read it I read it as “plus” instead of “and”. Gulf+Western always ticked me off. BTW, “ampersand” is a contraction of “and *per se *and”.

On Chromium, under Linux, this ampersand looks like an ampersand, not like Et. It, Comic Sans, and System look alike. I probably don’t have Trebuchet MS and Comic Sans, and the System font is being substitued. Still not as nice as the Arial one, though.
Anyone else using ampersands in their writing? I taught myself how to write it (like the Arial version, not the Et version) a year or two ago, and use it when I can now. Like when writing a check: “twelve & 33/100 dollars”. Prior to that, I used a single-stroke + .

i wish this were true, but I see it quite frequently. As Copy Director for a marketing agency, I’m forever changing the “&s” in print ads, brochures, etc. into "and"s.

The ampersand has a limited number of proper uses, the most common being in company or law firm names (e.g., Barnes & Noble; Dewey, Cheetum & Howe). I know I’m among the last holdouts on this, but I think having it serve as a general stand-in for “and” is terribly amateurish, and immediately makes me think less of whoever is using it.

This is still followed in the publishing world. “&” appears only in company names.

By the way, I like this board’s “&” just fine.

I like to use them but I am just weird. :smiley:

I think there is only one real explanation.

I often show people a technique they can learn in a few seconds that will save them fully five percent of all their time spent typing. I even have some practice exercises and software that I will give them to support this.

But a few days or weeks later, when I see them and ask how it’s going, the look at me rather sheepishly and say, "Oh, I started to use that technique. But eventually I stopped it because it was just too much trouble to switch over when I wanted to use it.

Well, it only takes a split second to “switch over”. So we both know that’s not the real reason.

The **real **reason IMHO is that people just don’t like change and they will not change unless it presents a finacial advantage or someone forces them to change.

Want to know the techniqe that will save anyone 5 percent of all the time they spend typing? Here it is:

If you examine any English document (including and piece of English text people have typed over the internet, you will notice one very interesting phenomena.

There is one word that is used more than any other. In fact, this word is used so often that if you just replace it (like you want to replace the word “and” with “&”, it wlll enable you to type 5 percent less keystrokes. It’s a little diffrent however.

The word is “the” and if you consider a sentence llike the following,

“Hit the ball over the fence.”

You would type it as follows:

“Hit/ball over/fence.”

I recommend you use the forward slash (for many reasons). But you can use any key you prefer.

The important difference is that when you type the forward slash, that actually types 5 chars for you - not just 3. It types the leading and traiilng blank.

So, what happens when the word comes at the beginning of a sentence or you want to send a capitalized version? You can just use the char “?” instead of “/”. It’s easy because “?” is just the upper case of “/”.

Note that when you type the “?”, that will actually type 6 strokes, i.e. ". The ". If you like to end each sentence with two spaces, you can arrange for the question mark to send the 7 strokes - ". The ", where there are two spaces after the period.

Of course there is more to discuss. Like for example, supose you want to use the forward slash or the question mark. What do you do? Well, it turns out there are a few alternatives but it’s not really appropriate to get into that discussion here.

The software I use to do these translations is quite simpe. It only takes one quick keystroke to turn it on or off. Hence whenever someone tells me, “I just got to be too much troulbe”, I know that is not the real reason. The real reason is that most people just don’t like change. Or they are afraid of change. Oh well.

I know when there is a financial advantage, it’s a completely different story. Many people work as transcriptionists and are paid by the keystroke - not the number of keystrokes they type. But the number they produce - big difference.

If they type a word using 5 keystrokes but use the wrong word, they have to delete that word and then type the correct word. Obviously, they don’t get paid for the original (wrong) word they typed.

These people love using my technique because they make 5 percent of their money “for free” (as it were). They only type one stroke. But they get paid for the 5 strokes their employer sees in the document they produce. Neat, huh?

Of course, when I give this technique to a professional transcriptionist, the first thing they want to know is if they can add more words and increase the amount that are produced “for free” as it were.

Of course they can. But it opens up a whole new way of using the keyboard.

As for the use of the ampersand to shorthand the word “and”, the strongest reason why it’s never used is that it won’t save the average person any strokes or any time. Want to see why?

If you accept that every time you type the single character “/”, you can produce the 5 characters " the ", then how many chars does the average person save by shorthanding the word “and” with the ampersand.

Well, the average person does not have my software and hardly any software can handle a replacement word coming at the beginning of a sentence.

So to type the following sentence:

“Hit the big ball and the small one.”

You would type the following:

“Hit the big ball & the small one.”

How many keystrokes have you saved?

You might say that you have saved 2 strokes because you typed the single stroke for the ampersand and that produced the 3 strokes “and”. Note the leading and trailing blank don’t count this time because the average person does not have any software that will accurately handle leading and trailing blanks both in the middle and at the beginning of a sentence.

But the savings is actually less than 2 strokes because in order to produce the ampersand you have to strike the uppercase “7”. Some people count the shift stroke (such as shift-7) as 1.5 strokes. Other people count them as 2 strokes.

Either way, the savings are either 1 stroke or 1.5 stroke and that is just not enough to get the average person very excited about this technique.

By the way, if you are interested, I use the “z” key to produce the word “and” which is a savings of 4 strokes (but the percentage saved is much more important than the number saved). My software adds leading and trailing blanks and it also capitalizes the word if it occurs at the beginning of the sentence.

Again, this raises the question, "What if you really want to produce the letter “z”?

Heh Heh. Although it’s very simple to do that, it’s a bit of a discussion and not appropriate to discuss here.

But I’m glad to see there is another kindred spirit who realizes there is a wonderful world of savings available in using the keyboard. Much, much more if you realize how good it would be to get rid of the keyboard eventually and use a much faster device. It’s been a dream for many people for a long time. But one day, I hope it will happen.

There are several ways that you can redesign the entire QWERTY keyboard if you like.

You can easily switch all the keys around so that you can produce the & by pressing any single key you like. You can also switch around the shift keys (the SHIFT, CTL, ALT and WIN keys)

It may sound awkward. But you can specify any key at all to be used in exactly the same way as the SHIFT key is currently used.

I wouldn’t do it because there are several important differences between keys like the SHIFT key and the TAB key. Most existing software recognizes certain things about the SHIFT key (like whether it is currently up or down) but it may not recognize the same things about the TAB key. In addition, some keys are supported by hardware so that they can be recognized as currently having a “LOCKED” state. The “CAPS LOCK” key (for example) can be recognized as being in the “on” or “off” state. So it can be a real problem to reorganize the keys such that some other key should take the place of the “CAPS LOCK” key because it may not have the required hardware support.

However, it is certainly possible to rearrange the keyboard logically so that most every key can be assigned to perform the functon of most any other key.

If you ever decide to try this, be sure to do a good job of researching the available software packages because some of them are much better than others.

Good Luck!