In Ireland we use the day/month/year method of writing or saying the date . I work for IBM here in Ireland so a lot of the paperwork I see has the American month/day/year way of writing dates. This can be very confusing when the day is the 12th of under. I would think d/m/y makes more sense . Does anybody know where the difference stems from?
WAG: The habit of saying (for example) ‘April 8th, 2000’ rather than ‘The 8th of April, 2000’, perhaps.
Eschew Obfuscation
When I worked at an air force base, it was common to see YYYYMMDD format.
I typically use DD-MM-YY if the day > 12, and DD-mon-YY if the day < 13.
“I must leave this planet, if only for an hour.” – Antoine de St. Exupéry
Are you a turtle?
Now that could be veryconfusing if people didn’t know you did that.
–What I’ve run across on this subject suggests that the American way of doing dates goes back to one single document that was dated “July 4, 1776.”
Why? Today is 09-Apr-00. In four days it will be 13-4-00. Since there’s no 13th month, it shouldn’t be confusing. If the day = the month, then it doesn’t matter and people who don’t know I put the day first still wouldn’t be confused. (e.g., 4-4-00)
“I must leave this planet, if only for an hour.” – Antoine de St. Exupéry
Are you a turtle?
'one single document that was dated “July 4, 1776.” ’ That’s interesting concept, Doug. But then how come we say “Fourth of July” instead of “July Fourth?” Seems that there would be earlier documents, not as important, granted, that would be dated Month day, year, rather than the more " formal sounding" " the Xth day of Month, the year of something ( our lord) XXXX" even in Britain.Seems like the DDMMYYYY folks say the 3rd of March, 1836 where we say March 3rd,1836. But I don’t know why we do that either, cept we save having to say one sylable, and as any British subject will tell you we americans are a lazy bunch when it comes to language, I never heard an Irish Citizen say that though… The day month year style makes more sense starting at the mor specific and going to the more general. But we do time the opposite. Hour: minutes, seconds.fraction. Like Johnny’s military date style. You could get a rather complicated looking number, Maybe Ike was less concerned with the weather than the possible confusion if he had sent a memo to British headquarters with the time and date of 0600/6/5/41. And if that invasion FROM Normandy had been sixtysome years and a few days day earlier Bill or his dad, would have sent out a memo with his D Day as somethin like 1010/10/10/1010.or 1009/10/09/1009. None of that answeres the when ,why,or where of the difference, but, then that isn’t why I posted.
“Pardon me while I have a strange interlude.”-Marx
I have a friend who uses Roman numerals for the month (he uses DD-MM-YY format), so it is almost always clear that 2-IV means 2-Apr and not Feb-4.
It’s a neat idea of handling the problem, but I think it’s a one-man crusade at the moment.
The ISO (International Organization for Standardization, don’t ask me why it’s not IOS) has a standard for dates. It’s dd.mm.yyyy, so today (April 9, 2000) is 09.04.2000. This arranges the data from most to least specific. There is only one other logical choice using only Arabic numerals, 2000.04.09. I really like the idea about Roman numerals. Personally, I call today 09Apr2000. The first three letters of each are the same across the majority of European languages, all derived from Latin. English May is the only exception. The months are Jan, Feb, Mar, Apr, Mai, Jun, Jul, Aug, Sep, Oct, Nov, and Dec in my system.
To my recollection, the only instance the US military and the PHS and NOAA use that format for dates is in the DEERS/RAPIDS system. This system is for verifying eligibility to certain benefits and also for issuing identification cards to members and their family members (formerly termed “dependents”).
Thus for a DD2 or DD1173 issued today the issue date would be 2000APR09.
What the hey, might as well mention this, too. If you really want to confuse someone, do dates in correspondence the way the US Navy does (assuming today’s date):
Standard Naval Letter:
-Date of letter itself: 9 Apr 00
-Body of letter: 9 April 2000
Naval Business Letter (used for recipients outside the Department of Defense or when a more familiar approach is desired):
-Date of letter and in body of letter: April 9, 2000
If you’re really interested in this stuff, check out the instruction available at http://www.bupers.navy.mil for the Correspondence Manual. Said Manual also has the advice to not use the term “it is requested” and certain other “traditional” jargons.
I use either YYYY MM DD or the Roman-for-month format. I hate MM DD YY/YY, and would like to keelhaul whoever invented it. It causes no end of trouble for me when I’m doing archival research (was this letter written on April 3, 1942, or March 4, 1942?)
I’ve seen YYYYMMDD used EXTENSIVELY in military documents of the computer era here in Canada. Some of these were Murrican even.
Dee da dee da dee dee do do / Dee ba ditty doh / Deedle dooby doo ba dee um bee ooby / Be doodle oodle doodle dee doh http://members.xoom.com/labradorian/
bibliophage, the ISO style I’m most familiar with is ISO 8601, which is the YYYY-MM-DD format (also YYYYMMDD is acceptable: see http://hydracen.com/dx/y2k/iso8601.htm among other web sites). I and my co-workers use this format for file extensions for web pages (i.e. events20000409.html) and other file identifiers, because it is logical and allows quick sorting and look-up.
For personal usage, I use DD MMM YYYY, where MMM is the abbreviated month name. Being in New York, this is obviously different from the prevailing custom of MMM DD YYYY. I first starting using it in college during the 80’s, as to me it seems very simple and logical. At first those who saw it thought it odd, but as the decades progressed most people began accepting it and even doing it themselves (e.g. when updating a report that I originally wrote). Step by step the revolution proceeds.
Of course, when faced with an official form that insists on MM/DD/YY I have no choice but to cave.
I think it’s actually the International Standards Organization. (And it’s probably in French too.)
I use YYMMDD, but I’ve been programming since the '70s.
Oh yeah, sorry about that Y2K thing…
“Sometimes I think the web is just a big plot to keep people like me away from normal society.” — Dilbert
I was confused. You are right, of course. Sorry about that.
In French, it’s “Organisation Internationale de Normalisation.” Notice how all the confusion just melts away? Me neither.
Nope…ISO is greek (?) for “Same”. It’s a word, not an abbreviation.
Truth does not change because it is, or is not, beleived by a majority of the people.
-Giordano Bruno
Johnny L.A.
I think you miss the point Johnny.
Forget about obvious dates such as 13-04-00.
What day is 03-04-00 or 12-12-00.
Assuming that you don’t attach an explanation to every written communication you send out.
I, too, have a slightly odd date convention.
I put the day first, but only if it is an even number, or an eleven - in which case I put the month first, unless the sum of the day and the month is greater than the last two digits of the year, in which case I use yy-mm-dd.
Johnny Does this seem reasonable, or do you think I should stick to one convention throughout?
Russell
RussellM
I think you miss the point. If the dates may be ambiguous, I always abbreviate the month. The dates you posted would be March 4th, 2000 and December 12th, 2000. I would write them 4-Mar-00 and 12-12-00.
There is no explanation needed. I cannot see how 4-Mar-00 can possibly be mistaken for something else, nor can I see how 12-12-00 can possibly be mistaken.
“I must leave this planet, if only for an hour.” – Antoine de St. Exupéry
Are you a turtle?
Correction: March 3rd, 2000.
“I must leave this planet, if only for an hour.” – Antoine de St. Exupéry
Are you a turtle?