Why the fuck won't anyone leave me feedback on Ebay?

The BBQ Pit
21

Well, you see here- the Sellers are influenced by a few disgruntled Sellers that give bad advice on the eBay boards. In fact- some of their advice is SO bad that it seems like they deliberately give bad advice to cut down on the competition. Since they all user “posting IDs” you can’t tell what their FB really is or if they follow their own advice, but they all assure everyone that they are Powersellers with 100% good FB- except when they are complaining about bad buyers who gave them a NEG. :dubious: Anyway, the advice Sellers are given is to withold FB until the buyer gives it first- this is so the Seller can retaliate with a NEG if he is NEGed. :rolleyes: Of course, retaliating with a NEG *just because * the other guy gave you a NEG usually makes you look like a psychotic hosebeast (to steal a term from a interesting thread here in the PIT a while ago).

While as the *Buyers * wait to get their FB 1st as they feel that the Buyer has performed his end of the transaction 1st, thus the *Seller * should send out a POS as soon as payment clears. However, the Sellers contend that until the *Buyer * says he’s happy with the deal, the deal isn’t done, so they claim they are waiting to hear from the Buyer. Incidentally, I have been testing this- I now wait for the Seller to send FB 1st, but as soon as I get the item I send a message back saying I got it, and everything is peachy-keen. So far, all the big time Sellers have ignored this, and I am getting almost no FB. But- my FB rating is already as high as I need, so I don’t care.

So, we have a paradox, sort of. The Buyers wait for the Sellers to give FB 1st, and the Sellers are waiting for the Buyers to give FB 1st.
However, witholding FB hurts the new Seller a LOT- which may be one reason why disgruntled old-time Sellers recommend it. See, a buyer with a low FB rating really isn’t hurt much. Sure a few sellers won’t sell to you if your rating is very low or if you’re brand new, but other than that, it doesn’t matter too much.

On the other hand, a Sellers low FB rating will cause lower sales. If I was a Seller with a somewhat low FB score, I’d send out that POS within minutes of getting that payment!

There are a few Sellers who give a POS as soon as they get payment- maybe 20% or so. It’s easy to see them, if you check the FB the Seller GAVE, not recieved (well, you might have to check that to see when the buyer left FB, but you know what I mean). If you want FB; either give FB 1st, or eschew Sellers who withhold FB.

I really suggest everyone avoid Sellers who have a moderate # of NEGs- but who always retaliate- even to those buyers who seem to have a legit complaint. You might also want to avoid those few Sellers that never give FB.

22

I’d have to disagree. A buyer could make immediate payment, recieve the item a week later and claim not to have recieved it. To me, the auction isn’t complete until the buyer has acknowledged receipt of the item.

23

I totally agree, and as someone who sells more than I buy, I get really pissed off when I hear these buyers saying “Wah wah wah, I paid, gimme feedback NOW!” The transaction ain’t over until you confirm you got the item you paid for and are content with it. When I hear that, I politely ask for positive feedback, and I do the same IMMEDIATELY. I’m happy to comply, since feedback ought to be a two-way street. I don’t play games, I just want the buyer to put my mind at ease.

Otherwise, the seller becomes vulnerable to all sorts of blackmail from the buyer – buyers can claim to have not received the item, or gotten the wrong item, or demand refunds, or claim some small ridiculous problem and automatically leave me a negative without giving me a chance to put things right. You’d be surprised how many crazy, irrational buyers with minimal social skills are out there. Essentially, if I leave buyers feedback as soon as they pay, I enable them to hold my feedback hostage. I’ll be damned if I open myself up for some dishonest or unconsolable pissant to leave me a negative after I’ve done my part, so that’s why I wait. I just want to make everyone happy on eBay, but I won’t be a pushover or an idiot. And if I get what I deem to be an unfair negative, you’re damn right I’ll leave a retaliatory negative so fast your head will spin.

24

I use no feedback as a rating between ‘Positive’ and ‘Neutral’. Nothing so bad as to influence their ratings, but I just don’t think it qualifies as ‘positive’.

25

Eep, thanks for reminding me, I bought some leather hair slides last week, just recieved em yesterday, and forgot about leaving feedback! runs over to Ebay

26

Now I gotta wonder if cmkeller ever got that Royals yearbook.

27

Here’s what I said ". However, the Sellers contend that until the Buyer says he’s happy with the deal, the deal isn’t done, so they claim they are waiting to hear from the Buyer. Incidentally, I have been testing this- I now wait for the Seller to send FB 1st, but as soon as I get the item I send a message back saying I got it, and everything is peachy-keen. So far, all the big time Sellers have ignored this, and I am getting almost no FB. "- now, if I send the Seller that email- why would you wait for me to send FB 1st? Why not you send FB 1st? :confused:

28

This is another thing that pisses me off. Isn’t that what the whole point of “Neutral” feedback? Why do sellers get all pissy when I give them neutral feedback when they took forever to ship the item?

Personaly I don’t have a problem. I almost always get feedback and always leave feedback. I don’t khow why my experience is so much different from all of yours.

29

Because buyers are whiny and crazy and hard to please, and I won’t allow someone to sabotage my feedback.

30

And I should have added, in the time it takes to send the seller that confirmation, you can take an extra few seconds (all it takes, really) to leave positive feedback for the seller and put his mind at ease. Talk is cheap, when it comes down to it, and feedback is the only defense an honest seller has once he mails the item. If you, the buyer, are happy, why not just leave the feedback saying you’re happy, getting the seller off the hook and effectively letting him relax and do the same for you?

31

I buy a bit of stuff on ebay. Most of “my” sellers do this. I heard, on another thread, that it’s because they fear retaliatory feedback. As in, they leave good feedback as soon as the buyer pays, and then the buyer gets his package late or something (sometimes the post office messes up), so the buyer gets snitty and posts a nasty feedback.

So the sellers often will wait until the buyer has received the item and left a positive feedback. Perhaps you should try it? And also the asking for feedback thing?

I don’t think my sellers care all that much as they generally have thousands of good feedbacks, but I can see where someone with only 30 would want a nice feedback number. I’m certainly wary of low feedback numbers. I’ll bet other buyers are too.

32

Because it’s tedious to go find the corresponding auction on the eBay site and leave feedback. As a seller, it’s much easier to me to go to “My eBay” -> Feedback, and see the list of items for which I’ve received feedback but haven’t given it.

So why would you send an e-mail, instead of using the feedback to tell them the item arrived and you’re happy with it?

33

No, for us it’s; “Because Sellers are whiny and crazy and hard to please, and I won’t allow someone to sabotage my feedback.”

34

No- you can take an extra few seconds (all it takes, I agree!) to leave positive feedback for the *buyer *and put *his *mind at ease. Talk is cheap, when it comes down to it, and feedback is the only defense an honest buyer has once he sends the payment. If you, the seller, are happy, why not just leave the feedback saying you’re happy, getting the buyer off the hook and effectively letting him relax and do the same for you?

Face it, if a buyer sends you an email that says “I got it, all is great” then having him claim “I never got the merchandise” will be a bit hard.

See, both sides can use the exact same argument. Both sides think they should get FB first. Both sides have their reasons. But here’s the crux of it- you say "I won’t allow someone to sabotage my feedback"- but how does witholding FB stop them from sabotaging your Feedback? ** It doesn’t. If you leave a POS first- the buyer can leave a NEG. If you hold off on that feedback- the buyer can STILL leave that Neg. The only thing witholding FB gets you is the implied threat “you NEG me and I’l NEG you back”. Well, buyers don’t like that threat. Remember- eBay is based upon trust- especiallythe trust a buyer places on the seller. It’s the buyer who sends his money first and has to trust the seller to send the merchandise. We buyers feel that if WE can trust you with hard cold cash- you should be able to trust *us *with a little feedback. And, not threaten us- because that’s what witholding FB really is- a threat. So- witholding FB makes us think maybe there’s a reason not to trust you. And the implied threat isn’t very nice. So- you lose a few sales to canny buyers.

I have done a lot of posting on the eBay boards. 99% of the time a seller has pointed to a “whiney & crazy” buyer who left them an undeserved NEG- it’s been by a newbie buyer. They don’t care or even fucking know about the “implied threat” of withheld FB. They just leave a NEG for a stupid-ass reason (and god yes, I have seen some stupid reasons). They could care less you are witholding FB so as to retaliate. Thus, witholding FB doesn’t protect you at all from these “whiney & crazy” buyers. And, what good does leaving a NEG for a bad buyer do anyway? If they are new, they’ll just get a new ID anyway. And if they aren’t new- do you think that one NEG will make some seller refuse their bid? :dubious:

But here’s what giving that crazy person back a NEG does do- loses you sales. Savvy buyers look for what FB the seller leaves, as well as gets. Face it- every seller on eBay is a human. Humans make mistakes- and once in a while you’re not going to be forgiven for that mistake. Having a FB history that shows that every time anyone leaves you bad FB you retaliate means that* you’re* the “whiney & crazy” one here. A few NEGs doesn’t hurt an otherwise good sales record- every one makes mistakes, and us experienced buyers know full well there are crazy newbie buyers out there. Thus, a NEG from some dude with a rating of “1” doesn’t hurt you as much as your NEG right back. Let it go- sometimes.

scr4- as i said- I send the email as I am testing the standard line that Sellers give- “The transaction isn’t over until I know you have received the item and are happy”. Well, you now know that- so where the FB? If it ain’t forthcoming then- then you’re only witholding FB so as to threaten me with retaliation.

Both sides can argue that* they* should get FB FIRST. I have done a little selling and I can see both sides. Frankly, they both have a point. But- Sellers make more sales with a high FB rating- buyers don’t lose “buys” with a “eh” rating. Thus, as Sellers- don’t play the “witholding FB” game. Unless the buyer has sent weird emails (a danger sign) or unless they are Newbies- send off that POS as soon as the check clears- because that way you’re “buying” more Positive Feedbacks, which gets you more sales. Buyers have nothing to lose by saying “Ok, I won’t leave FB first. So there”- but when a Seller does that, he loses sales.

35

I have always felt that eBay should institute some sort of program that will collect feedback from buyer and seller, but not show that feedback until both have left the feedback. For instance, I recently bought a set of three small leather pouches. If this system had been in place, I could have left feedback for the seller when I got my merchandise, but it wouldn’t show until he also left feedback (whether positive or negative). Neither of us would have known what sort of feedback we received until after we had left our own feedback. I think that this would be a much fairer way for both buyer AND seller.

As it happens, in this instance, the seller left me feedback when he shipped my items, and it was positive. I left him positive feedback when I received the goods, and also sent him a nice little email telling him that the items had arrived in good condition.

36

You make a valid enough argument, but I still stand by my comments, and won’t back down from them. If I buy, I’ll always leave feedback first once I get my item, and politely ask the seller to then do the same for me. I just think the ball is in the happy buyer’s court to go first. Bear in mind – something that nobody has done yet in this thread – if a buyer complains, statistically, Paypal is more likely to take the buyer’s side and force sellers to refund their money (or go into a seller’s actual bank account to remove the money without the seller’s approval). This situation would be unacceptable and unthinkable to me, so I’ll do anything I can to avoid it coming down to that stage.

37

Actually, eBay usually takes the Sellers side in complaints. Paypal usually takes the buyers side, but only if he claims he didn’t get the merchandise. And, not sending FB won’t stop, slow down or help if someone does a Paypal chargeback.

Lynn, you have a good idea. The way Amazon does it works too- Feedback is* only *left to the Seller.
Most sellers here would think that the Amazon system would lead to lots of bad FB, but it doesn’t.

Really Sellers- unless your buyer is new, has a history of leaving bad FB, or has sent you strange emails already- you are perfectly safe in sending out that FB as soon as you get payment. Several of my eBay sellers do so, and they have wonderfully high FB ratings. You have nothing to lose and a lot to gain. The chance of a ebay buyer with a rating of say 100 and who has maybe sent one NEG- sending you an undeserved NEG out of the blue is 1 in 1000. And, until you- as a Seller- get to somewhere around 1000 FB, every POS FB you get brings you that many more sales.

38

This was a reminder to me also! Bought something last month, just haven’t gone back to eBay since.
Maybe eBay ought to set up some kind of optional email reminder to be sent to your address on record, something to the tune of, “Just a heads-up to leave feedback.” It’s too easy to find and buy what you want, pay, and then forget all about it. For me, eBay is not the first place I look in the search for something, and checking my account just doesn’t top my priority list.

I do think that feedback should be left by sellers once payment is received, since that is all they’re really waiting for, and by buyers once product is recieved and verified to be all they thought it would be. Common courtesy, IMO.

39

Well then, let me be the first to call you an inconsiderate bastard.

In Conceivable, you are an inconsiderate bastard.

Pash

40

Well, he’s had over 3 years to change his ways…