Why was my grandmother's suspected Mad Cow Disease not confirmed?

Seventeen years ago my grandmother died of what I’ve been told by my father, her neurologist suspected was Mad Cow Disease. From everything I’ve read about how the disease effects humans, it does not sound unlikely – she had been in Oxford, England a few years before she became ill and could have contracted it there, it took a year for her to die and she had all the symptoms.

My question is, if Mad Cow Disease was suspected, even back then, why did the hospital (a large University Hospital) not insist on confirming it after her death by an autopsy? Why was it not reported to the CDC? I understand that not as much was known then as now, but I wonder how many cases went unreported and whether or not doctors and hospitals are required to document individual cases of a disease like this?

What you are calling mad cow disease was probably Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease. The variation of the disease in cattle was first detected in 1986. At the time, no one suspected any link at all between the two. The first human case of vCJD was reported in 1996 (10 patients dying in 1994/1995).

So the neurologist di not suspect Mad Cow Disease. If he suspected CJD, it was not a notifiable disease.

Here is a good site on the subject.

Well, I can tell you this: 17 years ago, your grandmother was NOT suspected of Mad Cow Disease. It didn’t exist, as far as we know.

Personally, I strongly dislike the term “Mad Cow Disease” - unless, of course, you’re a cow. Cows can get a prion disease called Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy. Sheep can get a priion disease called scrapie. Humans can get a prion disease called Cruetzfield-Jacob.

This is not just a picky issue of terminology. People have always gotten Cruetzfield-Jacob. It’s just a unlucky refolding of an essential brain protein. Some peopl are more prone to it (e.g. they may have a variant of the protein that refolds slightly more easily), but it’s till just pure luck: one of the godzillion copies of the protein may refold itself, and it in turn may catalyze other copies to refold (that’s what is so special about this one refolding of this one protein) and those proteins can built up until the cell they’re in sickens and bursts…

…or dozens, maybe hundreds, of copies of the protein my refold themselves, but due to luck and circumstance, the refolding either doesn’t spread, or causes so little damage before you die that neither you nor an autopsy will ever spot it.

It’s hard to say exactly what the incidence of CJD is, because it can take decades to develop in the early stages, and the older you are, the longer you’ve had to get an unlucky refolding. The symptoms of CJD are similar to other age-related brain diseases so the diagnosis can be tricky or obscured by the co-existence of some more common brain disease, like Alzheimers. A rough guess might be one in a million. That would mean that there were 200-300 cases of CJD 17 years ago, and none of them came from cows (as far as we know) Even today, essentially none of the hundreds of cases every year has anything to do with cows, as far as we know

Your brain produces the susceptible protein. It can refold on its own. Even if you were ‘infected’ (a completely inaccurate word) by a cow, it would be your own self-manufactured proteins that cause and spread the disease. A cow prion just helps the first refolding.

It just so happens that I was doing lab research in aging and dementias (including what were then incorrectly called ‘slow virus diseases’) back in the 80s, and though the prion hypothesis was bouncing around, the evidence for transmission between species was fairly weak, and the hard evidence evidence of transmission from cow to man was not just anecdotes and guesswork, it was guesswork about anecdotes. We didn’t have a test. We didn’t know what we were looking for, and there was (is, and may always be) no way to know if the first refolding was accidental or induced.

So basically, at worst, they might have suspected CJD - one of hundreds of such cases every year. They would never have said it was caused by cows, and even if you got CJD today, it would probably be self-induced. The only test would have been an autopsy, which would have been more to rule out other disease, and even if a diagnosis were made - whhat would the CDC do with a report of a self-caused disease that’s almost always more analogous to a random mutation than a “Communicable Disease” (which is what the Center for Communicable Diseases studies)

Though I always like the information gained from autopsies, I really don’t know what I could have done with a confirmed diagnosis that my deceased patient had a nongenetic disease that spontaneously arises once in a million people.

Today, of course, we know it can be transmitted to man, but the bottom line is: even if I report a confirmed case of teh “new variant” [nvCJD] and the CDC sent a team to investigate, it wouldn’t help anyone. We could only guess if it was an exposure or spontaneous. We couldn’t trace it to a given hamburger or cow, and it’d be years too late for anyone who would have been exposed the same way.

I’ve glossed over a lot of molecular biology and new advances to try to cover the basic principles in simple language (and it’s not my field anymore, anyway). Corrections and additions are, as always, eagerly welcomed.

Thank you so much, Tapioca and KP! Lord, I love the Dope.

Between the website (which was fantastic) and your post, KP, you’ve answered my questions. I’ll pass the information along to my father, who’s been stewing about this for a very long time. Thanks again.

So, wait, what is the current incidence of CJD(spontaneous) vs. nvCJD(from cows if my understanding is correct)?

I should probably wait for someone with the hard data to post, but I’ll put in my vague understandings anyway, in case Tapioca and KP aren’t handy :slight_smile:

CJD has, at least according to KP’s post, hundreds of cases each year.

As far as I know, we’re not even 100% certain that anyone has ever technically contracted nvCJD–people have died of CJD, and it’s been assumed that they might have contracted it by injesting prion-infected meat. However, one of the news reports the other day about the US mad cow said “dozens” of people are believed to have contracted nvCJD. Ever. I’m pretty sure (but again, can’t find any definite info in my quick search) that more people have died of Kuru (CJD from ritual cannibalism of CJD-infected brains) than nvCJD.

UK figures from the UK CJD Surveillance Unit

No one knows the exact incidence of CJD, for the reasons I noted originally. Also, since it with have increased incidence in the older population (for the reasons I noted) and can take years or decades to develop substantial neuological symptoms, many victims die of other causes before displaying any noticeable symptoms that stand out from “normal aging”. The “one in a million” figure I gave was a very rough estimate from one paper. In one year in the 1990s (sorry can’t recall which one) there were 231 known cases in the US.

The numbers fluctuate by 20% or more between consecutive years, but frankly, all figures are limited by our ability to diagnose it. I would not be surprised if the actual incidence pr prions was 10 ppm or more, but simply didn’t progress to CJD in most cases

This raises a philosophical issue: if you have a few misfolded PrPP molecules in your brain, you don’t necessarily have CJD. You may develop CJD in months, years or centuries (in which case, it hardly matters) or not at all (those molecules may degrade in time).

It’s like the difference between HIV infection and AIDS: though the progression is far more likely in HIV, and is generally treated as certain, but in a few cases, it hasn’t progressed in 20 years, and may never - not to minimize the seriousness of HIV infection.

So when does a person have CJD? Today’s standard is “when they display symptoms and findings”. Some people without definitive CLD symptoms may have detectable lab/MRI findings (the brain is quite adaptable). Do they have CJD? Others may have symptoms before they have definitive findings, depending on, e.g., what region of the brain is affected. Many people with CJD will also have far more common conditions (“Common thengs are common” - medical axion) that produce similar symptoms - how do we know if the CJD is producing any or all of the symptoms in those cases? We probably won’t - until we have very effective treatments. [If the treatment helps, it was CJD. Even then, it can be an iffy call]

One problem with determining the origin of a particular case is that almost all your prions will come from your own brain proteins. Foreign prions are just catalysts to start the cascade. Even if we could count and sort every single prion in the brain, a foreign prion could be long gone by the time the CJD begins, and a single forein prion doesn’t truly prove it wasn’t a spontaneous case.

That reminds me of an issue I want to emphasize: prions degrade. This complicates all the processes I’ve mentioned above. Any foreign prions you find advanced CJD didn’t cause cause the CJD. The molecules that caused it probably broke down months or years ago

Basically, the best move is to try to avoid any exposure or limit the “prion load” of any exposures you have. But remember, even if you eat a burger that happens to contain some prions from an infected cow, most of those prions will be denatured by digestion or gut bacteria, broken down by the body, or will end up somewhere other than your nervous system. If any manage to cross your blood brain barrier, CJD may not develop, or something else may get to you first

As before, these are generalizations. Some boving subtypes seem more virulent or have a characteristic presentations: they may fold your PrPP slightly differently to create more efficient self-prions, or may be more efficent to crossing the Blood Brain Barrier, or may prefer certain locations in the nervous system. They may affect people with specific subtypes of native PrPP. However, such findings are at best suggestive: if a prion can do it to your native PrPP, you PrPP could also do it to itself by random bad luck.

Also, it’s important to know that the estimates of the total deaths from the exposure in Britain has been dramatically downgraded, in 1997, they were estimating 15 million by the year 2080, but an analysis of the numbers up through 2002 suggests the total deaths may be 122 (as of Dec 2002) plus another 80 by 2080. The entire outbreak may not equal one plane crash - in a century!
http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993440

ERRATA: “PrPP” is a wrong term in current usage. It was an abrreviation for a term from the early days of prion theory.

Today, PRPP has several distinct and significant meanings, including “5-phospho–D-ribosyl-1-pyrophosphate” an important RNA precursor

The preferred term today is PrP (Prion Protein). I should have known better. Blame it on my traitorous typing fingers.

Well then why the f*** can’t I give blood?

Because, of course, I lived in the UK from 1982 to 1996, and thus the CDC is pretty sure I’ve eaten BSE-carrying meat.

I’m pretty sure I’m not going to die, but dammit, I want the free t-shirt.