The other night, SO and I went to a bar for happy hour w/my colleagues. This bar cards everyone, but my SO noticed that they had some sort of device for scanning IDs that collected info (the device had a small screen that then displayed the name and DOB from your card).
She got quite pissed over the idea of having her name collected and logged, and went over to the manager. They agreed to delete her record from the system.
So why would a bar collect names in the first place? It’s quite a large place, so maybe they have problems with people skipping out on bills?
It may or may not have kept records, but if it didn’t, the scanner is to read the embedded electronic thing-a-ma-jig that has your name and DOB embedded.
They do it around here for alcohol and cigarette purchases now.
One of our local grocery stores does this now with alcohol purchases - they don’t just eyeball your ID if you appear to be under 60, they scan ALL IDs with a dedicated scanner device. It seemed intrusive enough that I emailed the manager to ask about it - here was his response:
“In response to your question regarding our ID scanners at the XXXXXXX locations: this is a new policy that we enacted recently in response to problems that have happened here locally. There is not any information captured at the point of sale. It is purely an accept or reject system that does not gather information. The system is also completely self-contained and is not connected to our network or outside networks. The system will tell us if the date of birth on the identification is legally able to purchase and it will also tell us if the ID is valid. Most of the information gathered can be gained from a visually inspection, except knowing whether an ID is valid or fake. All of the XXXXXX locations locally have taken this policy and we do understand that some customers will be upset, however, we also know the liabilities in selling alcohol. We have taken the responsibility of saying no out of our checkers hands and put in into the hands of a computer. We hope that this is the safest and most effective way to curb underage purchase of alcohol, but we also need the feedback that we have gotten.”
I have no reason to believe that the manager is lying, but I don’t buy alcohol there anymore.
It’s possible too that the bar was not actually collecting the names, but they just showed up on screen. The manager might have thought it was easier to say “Sure, I’ll delete it” than to explain what was already happening.
Here in Alberta they were doing this so they could screen out undesirables on a black list. People who had been caught selling drugs, carrying weapons, starting fights in the bars etc. were put on a blacklist and not re-admitted. Then the privacy commissioner stepped in and said it was a violation of their privacy rights :rolleyes:, so all the gang-bangers can get back to partying again.
How is this acceptable to a populace that is so afraid of teh ‘socialism’ they think health care will somehow end up with everyone standing in line for bread and goosestepping in the streets?
I don’t understand why people get paranoid or upset about these sorts of things. It’s not like the info is sensitive. Do these people use credit cards or debit cards?
I don’t need a cite. Names and DOBs are on everything, including your driver’s license. You are asking me to prove a negative. Please tell me what exactly is sensitive about your name and DOB, both of which are available in all kinds of places and neither of which are going to give someone access to something they shouldn’t.
ETA: BTW as a matter of course both bits of information are usually in court pleadings, which are public information, and no court system that I am aware of asks that information to be redacted or left off. They do, however, ask you to leave off Social Security numbers.
In theory, such a system could be used keep a record of when and how many times you go to the bar, as well as a list of people who were there at about the same time as you. Suppose you were attending a Federalist Society function at the bar, and didn’t want your employer or your neighbors to know you were a member.
My UAE drivers license does not have my DOB on it (none of them do). I don’t drink, but I suppose I would not be able to buy alcohol in a place like this even though I am well over 21.
Everyone who watches Law and Order knows you should pay with cash.
Actually, I’m not envisioning a cloak and dagger scenario or a slippery slope here. If I understand you correctly, I think you’re saying that the bar is a public place where one has no legal expectation of privacy. I have no problem accepting that the bar owner is legally within his or her rights to record who is entering the bar if he wishes to do so. But if I don’t pay with a credit card, and I don’t otherwise give my name to the staff, my own personal expectation of privacy is that the bar is not going to keep a record of when I enter and with whom.
In the UK there was a recent storm about these machines, but it got worse. The local police were party to the license renewal process, and were demanding that certain bars retained these records, for possible later purusal. In the EU this is very likey illegal, and certainly comes under various acts about data protection.
Anyone who thinks this sort of data collection is harmless is living a very sheltered life. As pointed out above, the data can be mined to indicate people you associate with. The example in the UK was that one of the bars held a well known annual function where the sexual prolictivities of the attendants might be somewhat, well, unusual. Nothing illegal, but probably not something attendees would like to be known by their employers and workmates. Now, you are handing this data to some of the less reputable members of society. Security staff working the front of house at a bar? Now maybe you personally are a fine upstanding member of society, who only drinks in moderation in the most fashionable of bars. But you don’t get to dismiss the fears of others who have other choices in life. Once data like this gets collected it gains a life of its own. What stops the bar owner selling it to advertisers? It isn’t as if it will be hard to cross match the name and DOB with other information on file about you. What if the local police want to do some profiling, maybe run a few general name checks through their computer? Maybe you attend a political meeting for the comittee to nuke the whales. The secuity guy decides to sell the names to the psychopathic green alliance.
If you were stopped at the door by security, and ask to tell them you name and dob, and they then wrote it down in a little notebook, would you feel comfortable? What if you were randomly stopped in the street by a policeman and asked the same thing?
No, these guys do not have any right at all to track where you have been.
