#WhyIDidntReport

[Kimstu]

@rat_avatar

While I do take advantage of opportunities to let close friends [“know” ??] that any event, no matter if it was consensual or not, will [“not” ??] change my opinion of them or devalue them in any way

Inferred editorial inserts added and clarification requested.

@rat avatar

The complaints I have heard about fake feminist men with ulterior motives often as the “nice guy”, unrequited love, validation etc… tend to give me pause. Is there a fairly reliable way to communicate this and ensure that it is simply based on compassion, friendship, and respect?

Okay, I think I get what you’re saying. My first reaction is that if someone’s voluntarily confiding in you, they probably don’t really suspect you of being some kind of pseudo-ally with ulterior motives. Other than that, I’d say that if you just listen, be supportive, and don’t try to “solve” the problem by insisting on making the conversation all about “practical advice” and “things you could do to reduce your risk”, you’re most likely doing fine.

[nelliebly]

Who else watched Christine Blasey Ford’s testimony today, and how did you react? I watched with a friend. She pointed out I was wringing my hands. I couldn’t bear to watch Kavanaugh’s testimony. Did any of you?

[rat_avatar]

@Kimstu

Inferred editorial inserts added and clarification requested.

Sorry, I seriously screwed up the wording trying to fix the wording during the edit window.

Summery I have been blessed with a diverse group of friends family and I cherish that fact. Some even have been sex-workers and others have been abused and some suffer slut shaming from their life choices. I also don’t see any value in assigning any blame on someone for being victim.

Hopefully that is enough I hesitate to expand more because this is not about me.

@Kimstu

Okay, I think I get what you’re saying. My first reaction is that if someone’s voluntarily confiding in you, they probably don’t really suspect you of being some kind of pseudo-ally with ulterior motives. Other than that, I’d say that if you just listen, be supportive, and don’t try to “solve” the problem by insisting on making the conversation all about “practical advice” and “things you could do to reduce your risk”, you’re most likely doing fine.

The problem is that they only felt comfortable to confide in me after the event. They felt that they had to deal with these problems for an extended time alone. In one case our team lost a very valuable team member and she had an experience no one should.

Had I found a way to communicate this earlier it would have helped. Male fragility as an example is a hard barrier to get past, but it is much easier when both men and women feel free to communicate the same message.

The patriarchy sucks (unequally) for everyone and the bullshit reasons society tells to boys as to what gives them value in society is addressable through peer pressure and honest communication. Many of the bros in bro culture don’t particularly enjoy being a part of it and this problem is addressable within a group over time.

Both self justification by perpetrators and victim blaming by all members of society are highly correlated with rape myth acceptance as an example.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/15299732.2014.867573
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0886260515591975

By simply choosing to have lunches with another set of coworkers and commenting on poor behavior and dispelling these rape myths over time helps to short circuit this environment. The same bro culture which helps perpetrators self justify their actions also tends to extend protection to criminal actions due to the typical hyper-reaction to even approaching the subject.

This is an oversimplification and I don’t want to expand on this more for the fear that a particular “men’s rights” contingency will take over. While I am happy that these women did trust me enough to confide in me; I would much rather work with them and take an active role in preventing a story even happening in the first place.

[Nava]

@rat_avatar

What would be a good way to share that you are a true ally and non-judgmental without seeming disingenuous or accusatory.

By doing what you have been doing. Proclamations are likely to be met with mistrust; too often the guy who claims to be chivalrous is the one that’s a jerk or the one who claims to be “on your side” is the one who manages to follow up with a speech from a soapbox he carries along for that explicit purpose.

“I wish I’d known sooner” doesn’t necessarily equal “I wish you’d told me sooner”. Keep treating people as people, keep assisting people as and when you see that they need assistance (1), keep listening. The listening part is very important; sometimes all people need is a person who actually listens, who doesn’t just hear some sort of background noise while waiting for their turn to talk. If someone asks for your opinion or your advice, give it; if they don’t ask and you’d like to give it, ask if they want it and act accordingly. If there is something relevant in the news you can bring it up as part of general “news talk”, assuming it’s the kind of thing y’all talk about, but it shouldn’t be something you go out of your way to point out.

1: I don’t have anything against people opening doors for me when it’s done as simply the thing to do for another person; what pisses me off is someone cutting me off in order to be ‘chivalrous’, or someone refusing to go through a door I’ve opened because ‘ladies first’. Yeah, this lady was first to the door therefore she opened the door, you… you… dickhead.

[Nava]

Stoopid slow brain, only cos it’s 0124, and stoopit five minutes. Anyway, ETAing, which is too a word.

… If there is something relevant in the news you can bring it up as part of general “news talk”, assuming it’s the kind of thing y’all talk about, but it shouldn’t be something you go out of your way to point out. Also, since there has been a specific incident at work, you can bring it up when someone new joins the team, “we had a bad case where this happened, I would like you to know that I personally consider that kind of situation unacceptable etc.”; do this whether the new person is male, female, intersex or none of the above.

Are you one of the quiet ones? Those are harder to classify, but it works in both directions. I had a coworker that I didn’t know for five months he was the kind of guy who, and this is literal, did not believe a woman’s life could be put at risk by pregnancy (the other female coworker and I described ectopic pregnancies in loving detail, then we sent him multiple links on the subject); most jerks show their colors earlier simply because they talk more than that guy. So yeah, I’ve just told you to listen… and now I’m telling you to talk. If someone makes a joke about rape - I know he’s not much of “an ally”, to use your own term. If someone says “that was bad, no, it was horrible” and the response of the first one or of other people in the group is mockery, I know the second someone is at least a possible ally and the ones who mocked are asses. People show our colors when we open our mouth, and it shows in remarks about exes and currents, in jokes, or even in what we say when someone passes the salt (seriously, the jerks are a lot less likely to have the “thank you” reflex).

[rat_avatar]

Thank you for the feedback and the check on my assumptions.

I am not quiet but rather an ambivert who’s job is to mentor and foster cooperation in a field full of introverts.

Through an random trend in the tech world it is actually my job to be a cheerleader for empathy due to a concept called DevOps. It is a fairly unique position of being a technical subject matter expert while also being tasked with directly addressing culture issues. As HR typically has to be focused minimizing legal exposure, taking on the role of being a mediator, educator and counselor just comes with the job.

Thanks for allowing me to jump in on this thread and I will return to reading and learning.

[Aspenglow]

@nelliebly

Who else watched Christine Blasey Ford’s testimony today, and how did you react? I watched with a friend. She pointed out I was wringing my hands. I couldn’t bear to watch Kavanaugh’s testimony. Did any of you?

I watched most of it. I received a business call that took me away from part of Kavanaugh’s opening… diatribe, and I did mute out some of the fatuous partisan statements offered by Republicans in lieu of their questioning of Kavanaugh.

Blasey Ford was truly a one-in-a-lifetime witness. Forthright, likeable, smart yet humble, respectful and genuine in every way. Her testimony was powerful and based in fact.

Republicans were not happy with their “female assistant,” Rachel Mitchell, and took over the questioning with Kavanaugh after about 3 rounds. She was allowed to handle all the questioning of Blasey Ford and conducted it as I would expect a seasoned prosecutor of sex crimes to: She was easy on the victim. She was kind of naive to have taken the job, IMHO.

Republicans (predictably) took the low road, attacking the Democrats on false bases, especially Diane Feinstein. They scored points with their base but few others, I suspect.

Lindsey Graham rallied the troops with a hugely disingenuous attack on how Dems were trying to “destroy” Kavanaugh, but word is he’s angling for the appointment to replace Jeff Sessions as AG after the mid-terms. I think that’s an accurate assessment.

Flake will probably vote to let it out of committee. I think the confirmation vote is more uncertain.

[nelliebly]

Thanks, Aspenglow. I’m really glad I didn’t try to subject myself to that. I agree that Ford was phenomenal. In fact, I have to wonder if all the ranting by Graham, et al was due to her being such an incredible witness. Maybe ranting was all they had to fall back on.

[Cub_Mistress]

@rat_avatar

Thank you for the feedback and the check on my assumptions.

I am not quiet but rather an ambivert who’s job is to mentor and foster cooperation in a field full of introverts.

Through an random trend in the tech world it is actually my job to be a cheerleader for empathy due to a concept called DevOps. It is a fairly unique position of being a technical subject matter expert while also being tasked with directly addressing culture issues. As HR typically has to be focused minimizing legal exposure, taking on the role of being a mediator, educator and counselor just comes with the job.

Thanks for allowing me to jump in on this thread and I will return to reading and learning.

so efffing cool!

I did not report for these reasons, among others:

1. I did not know his name and my skirt was really short, so it was my fault he grabbed my ass
2. I developed big breasts in the 6th grade, so how could men resist me? boys will be boys
   3 I was 6 months pregnant, the neighbor had a thing for pregnant lady breasts. men have needs
3. the professor who said no girls get A’s in his class without sex and asked for my phone number. I needed the A

that’s not all just all I am willing to share tonight

[Stranger_On_A_Train]

Kavanaugh came off as an entitled, whiny jackass who openly pandered to Trump at every opportunity. If he seemed even remotely qualified as a Supreme Court justice before he certainly does not now, not that this will prevent most Republican senators from voting for him. Lindsay Graham’s histrionics—there is no other word for it—illustrate just what a shill he is regardless of his ostensible defiance of Trump. I guess we’ll see what comes of a vote; I’m sure someone is offering Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski thirty pieces of silver to vote for confirmation, but I can’t see a single Democrat, even in contentious ‘Red’ states voting to confirm.

It is entirely within the realm of possibilty that Ford is misremembering or intentionally lying, but I can’t think of a single benefit to her in doing so other than getting some kind of long-belated vengence against Kavanaugh, which begs the question of what he did to deserve such treatment if not attempted sexual assault. She will almost certainly suffer personal, and possibly professional repercussions for her testimony even of no one accused her of being a “scorned woman”, and Kavanaugh’s belligerent denial looked less like innocent indigence than aggressive defense by a cornered animal. And regardless of this particular testimony, his previous lies inder oath should have already disqualified him from being confirmed.

Bart O’Kavanaugh can eat my shorts, man!

Stranger

[elbows]

I’m confused, why all the Kavanaugh reporting in a thread entitled, ‘why I didn’t report’?

They seem terribly out of place, especially as there are other threads covering that very topic.

Maybe people are just getting them mixed up? What’s going on? The title seems quite clear.

[TroutMan]

Just here to say I appreciate everyone who has shared, and I’m listening to every one of you. Thank you.

[nearwildheaven]

@mistymage

The time I did report it: I was 9 and at the Fair. My 14 year year old sister had ditched me to go party with a guy. It was Midnight madness so the Rides band my parents bought for me and the $10 I had for food (there were water fountains) kept me entertained until Midnight when the rides shut down. So I was the Front gate waiting for my sister and my parents when a guy came up, chatted with me, grabbed my crotch and ran off. I spent the next 2 hours in the First Aid tent while the cops tried to find my parents who had “Went to a bar, no, I don’t know which one.” My youngest older brother finally got home from his job and he came and picked me up. The older sister came home Sunday night.

2 years later my “buds” started. Women know what I mean but I will explain. Before a girl has breasts you get “buds” where once was flat starts to rise up as the ducts that one day will provide milk to your child(ren) and your nipples start to grow and push out a bit. They are painful (at least for me, they were) and meant not only no more running around shirtless but the total end of me sleeping on my stomach.

My step-father started pinching them. I complained to my mom but she said he was just teasing. The same man who just did court ordered family counseling sessions due to molesting the above 14… now 16… year old sister. He also got a vasectomy. She (14 now 16 sister) ended up running away often enough that she ended up in foster care and the rest of her life makes my heart hurt and my stomach heave. Not for her but for her kids.

I told my oldest siblings and from that time forward I spent all summers, all long vacations and most week-ends with the 2 adult siblings and their families.

But I didn’t bother reporting it at school or the police because they already had left me to live with him.

Years later I found out about the court order vasectomy and also why my next, next older sister who had ran away at 14 was for the same reason.

My mother condoned it to have a place to raise the large family she had after my father divorced her and then died.

I felt a bit of relief as they both passed.

Which leads me to this last bit.

I was a teen aged slut. I was very promiscuous. Very sexual. I am still the last (only with hubby… coming on 26 years of marriage and almost 30 years together). A party where a girl had tons of sex with different guys was a summer fun time. But at least it was my choice. Even if the “why” might not have been.

In my crowd, those who did… wanted to participate. Those who didn’t just didn’t. We didn’t have those kinds of drugs available to us nor were they needed by our crowd. Buying weed and booze was our financial limits.

I’m probably going to regret posting this all.

It sounds like your family has some horrible problems besides sexual abuse; the tipoff to me was the statement “my [14-year-old] sister didn’t come home until Sunday night.” Hugs to you and yours.

“Buds” is actually the correct term for early breast development, and adolescent boys often have some degree of it as well before their own hormones straighten out. I don’t remember mine being painful, but for those of you men who haven’t raised daughters, this is when girls start wearing “training bras” - to get used to the feel of a bra and also to cover up those buds (these bras are usually slightly padded) before the tissue underneath begins to expand.

[nearwildheaven]

@elbows

This is a very heartening thread, on a currently very disheartening board. I find myself moved to post in this thread by the men who have remarked. It helps to hear your voices. Even in the face of not much changing. It still helps.

I want you to be aware of the silent, unspoken side, in the age of #metoo. I believe there is something you’re not seeing. I can promise you there are women reading this board, right now, who have never reported or told anyone about their assault. They will NEVER post in such a thread. Or join #metoo. They have NEVER spoken of it. And I can promise you there are a couple of silent ‘metoo’er’s in your life as well.

Their assault was such a complete betrayal, it left them too robbed of their own sense of personal safety in the world, to ever consider speaking. Shattered, walking through the ensuing days feigning normalcy for those around them. Hanging by a thread. They cannot risk the second betrayal, being dismissed, not believed, blamed, shamed, facing police interrogations, the rapist in court. For some it’s taking everything they have, just to face each day. Their silent struggle is Herculean in is magnitude. They are NOT weak.

And in the time that has passed since their assault, decades for many, they have NEVER been able to find a safe enough space, feel safe enough with anyone, to tell it. That’s how profoundly their sense of safety was taken from them.

I want us to remember they are part of this too. I want them to know we see you there. We understand, it’s alright. We can hear you too.

I just wanted the gentlemen among us to understand, that silence is sometimes screaming.

When #metoo first showed up on Facebook, one of my FBFs said she was a member of the club, and added that she needed to have a conversation with her husband of 29 years that she’d never been able to have. She did not divulge further details.

[nelliebly]

@elbows

I’m confused, why all the Kavanaugh reporting in a thread entitled, ‘why I didn’t report’?

They seem terribly out of place, especially as there are other threads covering that very topic.

Maybe people are just getting them mixed up? What’s going on? The title seems quite clear.

#WhyIDidntReport began as a response to those questioning why Ford didn’t report the Kavanaugh assault sooner, so I assumed watching the testimony today would be difficult for those who, like Ford, also didn’t report. And this is the only place on the SDMB where we’ve been able to tell our stories without attack by the rape apologists. Why they’re leaving us alone here I don’t know, but they’ve been active in the Kavanaugh thread in Elections, the only other logical place to ask.

Sorry if I messed up.

[Isamu]

@elbows

This is a very heartening thread, on a currently very disheartening board. I find myself moved to post in this thread by the men who have remarked. It helps to hear your voices. Even in the face of not much changing. It still helps.

I want you to be aware of the silent, unspoken side, in the age of #metoo. I believe there is something you’re not seeing. I can promise you there are women reading this board, right now, who have never reported or told anyone about their assault. They will NEVER post in such a thread. Or join #metoo. They have NEVER spoken of it. And I can promise you there are a couple of silent ‘metoo’er’s in your life as well.

Their assault was such a complete betrayal, it left them too robbed of their own sense of personal safety in the world, to ever consider speaking. Shattered, walking through the ensuing days feigning normalcy for those around them. Hanging by a thread. They cannot risk the second betrayal, being dismissed, not believed, blamed, shamed, facing police interrogations, the rapist in court. For some it’s taking everything they have, just to face each day. Their silent struggle is Herculean in is magnitude. They are NOT weak.

And in the time that has passed since their assault, decades for many, they have NEVER been able to find a safe enough space, feel safe enough with anyone, to tell it. That’s how profoundly their sense of safety was taken from them.

I want us to remember they are part of this too. I want them to know we see you there. We understand, it’s alright. We can hear you too.

I just wanted the gentlemen among us to understand, that silence is sometimes screaming.

Well said.

[Smapti]

This thread makes me sad.

If I gained anything out of the “stranger danger” lectures I got when I was in elementary school in the late '80s and early '90s, and the “social health” classes I got later on, it was that you don’t touch anyone in any way that they don’t want you to.

And I don’t. I never would and never could, and I don’t understand how anyone could.

It’s depressing to learn that so many other men never learned this or took it to heart, and have gotten away with it for so long, and that so many people have let them get away with it, both by giving women reasons not to report, and by ignoring and/or justifying it when they do.

Women, I’m sorry that our society has failed you.

Men, I expect better of you.

[elbows]

@nelliebly

#WhyIDidntReport began as a response to those questioning why Ford didn’t report the Kavanaugh assault sooner, so I assumed watching the testimony today would be difficult for those who, like Ford, also didn’t report. And this is the only place on the SDMB where we’ve been able to tell our stories without attack by the rape apologists. Why they’re leaving us alone here I don’t know, but they’ve been active in the Kavanaugh thread in Elections, the only other logical place to ask.

Sorry if I messed up.

Not slamming anyone I was just confused. I never considered that this thread could be safe harbour from those more on topic to the hearing. Thanks for pointing that out, it’s a very fair point. I retract my confusion and hope others won’t be discouraged by my previous post.

[Jane_Elliot]

I have wanted to share my stories here, but as an older woman I’ve been realizing just how many times I’ve been assaulted and let it go because “that’s just the way men are”. I grew up with 3 brothers so the assaults started early. In high school, I was the ‘school slut’ while still a virgin because I had big boobs. I’ve worked in both the comic book and waste disposal industries which didn’t change my mind about men at all. What I’ve learned over the years is that men are not to be trusted. Ever. Not the ‘nice guys’ or the strong guys. Even the gay guys have been jerks sometimes. I’m on team #BurnItAllDown.

[Modesty_Blaise]

I have to get this out:

I watched every minute of that hearing. When Dr. Blasey Ford started talking and her voice broke… I had what can only be described as a PTSD moment. I burst out crying and continued crying uncontrollably for over an hour. I had flashbacks to things I haven’t thought about in decades, like testifying, ugh. I felt like I was trying to crawl out of my own skin. I paced, I sobbed, I almost threw up. I had no idea it was going to hit me like that.

The self-entitled fuckass, Kavanaugh, that whiny, lying, shitty, fucking coward, piece of shit, typical douchebag of the sort we all knew in high school made me shake with rage.

My GAWD, when she described the LAUGHTER, I just sat shivering as I remembered my brother and his friend grabbing me, taking off my underwear and groping me and holding me so I couldn’t get away. AND THEY LAUGHED THE WHOLE TIME I WAS SCREAMING.

I didn’t read any other news or watch any commentary, not even the boards. But I knew, as I was going through all of that, that there were millions of women who were going through the same thing. I KNEW IT. I FELT IT.

I watched the vote this morning and I swear, if I had the power right now, I would take each and every one of those eleven pieces of human waste and strike them dead. And I don’t give a fuck what anyone thinks of that. NOT. ONE. SINGLE. FUCK.

It was a little satisfying to see Flake get his ass reamed by some women, “don’t you look away from me!” this morning. This is only the beginning. Conservatives have no fucking idea what they have unleashed.

I haven’t read this thread since yesterday morning - I’m going to do that now. I just had to vent first.