Wikipedia editors help - Rockaway Peninsula Population

In My Humble Opinion
1

I know there are some Wiki editors on this site. Looking at the page for the Rockaway Peninsula in Queens, it has a population of almost 130k. But, this publication from NYC has it at under 50k.

That’s a huge difference. How are those kinds of differences sorted out? Can one of you editors take a look a fix it to whatever is correct? Could the difference be how many people live there in the summer (say, 130k) vs. year round (say, 47k)?

2

I assume they go with the source with a cited population survey (the one linked in the Wiki footnotes) rather than a pamphlet without any cited sources.

Edit: looks like the NYC pamphlet does cite the Census Bureau at the end. I wonder if the cited plots on that don’t encompass as much as the other.

3

The cite with the larger population is to the local paper, which is getting it from the electric company (I think), so that could be the peak summer population (it’s a beach community), since all of the summer homes would likely have electrical service all year.

4

As Munch noted, the article in the Wave does cite the Long Island Power Authority, but says the LIPA “derives” its data from the US Census as well as utility records. It’s not clear how that derivation was done.

The publication with the 47,500 number is published by the New York City Department of Small Business Services. I don’t know how reliable they are.

US Census data for Queens County is here, but I don’t see a way to restrict it to Rockaway Peninsula.

Regarding Wikipedia policies, if two equally reliable sources say different things, the article is supposed to report both statements and attribute them to the sources (Like “XXX says the population is 130K, but ZZZ says the population is 50K”). But in this case the discrepancy is probably due to reporting different things, maybe different boundaries or one counting visitors as RitterSport suggests. I wouldn’t change the article until we can figure out what’s really going on with the different numbers.

5

For what it’s worth, the Wiki page breaks down the Peninsula by neighborhood. Maybe that would be sufficient for the census bureau search (which I don’t know how to do).

Edit: Here’s the list of neighborhoods:

  • Far Rockaway, from the Nassau County line to Beach 32nd Street;
  • Bayswater, located to the northeast of Far Rockaway, along the southeastern shore of Jamaica Bay
  • Edgemere, from Beach 32nd Street to Beach 56th Street;
  • Arverne, from Beach 56th Street to Beach 77th Street;
  • Rockaway Beach, from 77th Street to Beach 97th Street;
  • Rockaway Park, from Beach 98th Street to Beach 126th Street;
  • Belle Harbor, from Beach 126th Street to Beach 141st Street;
  • Neponsit, Beach 141st Street to Beach 149th Street;
  • Riis Park, Beach 149th Street to Beach 169th Street;
  • Breezy Point, from Beach 169th to the western tip. This includes the smaller areas of Roxbury and Rockaway Point, as well as *Fort Tilden[2]
6

Yeah, that’s it.

Here’s a PDF from 2020:

The resident population of the Rockaway Peninsula in the months between October and May
is estimated at 36,000 persons.

7

I think that was in 1917?

8

This pdf seems to indicate 124k residents.

9

That’s what I get for skimming. :man_facepalming:

10

Here’s a PDF from 2017 which states that the peak summer population has been just shy of a quarter million.

11

True, but then you get into an issue of whether they are equally reliable. The newspaper article is from 2008, and says it got data from the electric company, but not much more than that.

The business pamphlet doesn’t give much detail either, on how it sourced the numbers.

Personally, I think the statement from the New York State Comptroller may be the best source, because it does cite to US Census data, both in the footnote and in the sources listed at the end. It looks at the US Census data for 2020 and 2010, which is more current than the other sources. Plus, I assume that the Comptroller, as a state official charged with keeping track of this data, would be a good source.

I wouldn’t have any trouble changing the first cite, currently to the local paper, to the number given in the Comptroller’s document. The local paper is cited later in support of community reaction to population changes, and I think it makes sense to keep it there.

12

I’d be careful about using that, because no date is given for that peak population:

At its peak, the Rockaway Peninsula as a whole
drew 48 million summer visitors and had a summer population of 225,000.

That pamphlet is quoting the history of the area, starting in the 19th century, so we’ve got no idea when that peak population occurred, plus it’s counting summer population, which is not permanent residents.

13

But there’s still the huge difference between the NYC SBS services pamphlet (47,500) and the State Comptroller (124,185). The only explanation I can see is that they’re defining the “Rockaways” differently.

14

Wasn’t planning to; it’s just a data point for @RitterSport’s argument that the higher number includes summer residents.

15

I’m just thinking out loud, so to speak, about which sources to use.

16

I think it’s pretty funny to use these terms on a message board.

17

On page 12 of the SBS pamphlet , there is a map and the Rockaway Peninsula Context Area does not include Far Rockaway , Belle Harbor or anything west of Belle Harbor such as Neponsit or Breezy Point while Wikipedia seems to include those neighborhoods. Also, the Wikipedia figure is a 2007 estimate while the pamphlet refers to the US Census American Community Survey of 2016 , so those numbers are more recent.

And there are Nassau County communities that are actually on the Rockaway Peninsula , so that may account for some of the discrepancy.

18

Technically, you don’t know that @Northern_Piper isn’t saying those things out loud as they type them.

19

I assume he’s playing bagpipes all the time.

20

I would need a third hand to type.