How many times do you have to hear that Trump would have gone ahead with his plans no matter what Biden decided to do? Biden wasn’t the reason-Biden was merely one excuse among hundreds…most of which are totally imaginary.
One has abso-fucking-lutely nothing to do with the other.
Testify in what trial? Who is going to be indicted in anything Hunter Biden-related other than Hunter Biden, who is now off limits?
They could just call him to testify about argle bargle in front of the House and the Senate.
This. I have to wonder about the amount of common sense possessed by the ‘Biden has now emboldened Trump’ arguers. Trump was always going to do what he wanted, and if there was no real-world excuse “justifying” his action, no way to blame it on something done by a Democrat, Trump would simply make up a lie about something he claimed had been done by a Democrat. If he couldn’t use Biden, he’d claim that Obama did it. Or whoever.
Indeed. And there’s no necessity for the ‘you made us’ part being based in any kind of reality.
I don’t disagree, except maybe about the bipartisan part. Once Joe is gone, Congressional Republicans won’t be interested in publicly backing anything that could act as a constraint on Trump.
But in general, limits on the pardon power would be a good idea.
There’s an unexamined false equivalency here. Biden’s action was prompted by knowledge that viciously unscrupulous people with no interest in upholding the rule of law would be following him, leaving the person he pardoned vulnerable.
But any pardons Trump issues will NOT be made in an atmosphere in which an unprincipled opponent is following him. Either no one will follow him, or his own kind will follow him—or in the case of Americans making the effort needed to throw out an autocrat* he would be followed by principled people who would respect the rule of law.
So the conditions of Biden issuing a pardon differ so radically from the conditions of Trump issuing a Term 2 pardon, as not to be comparable.
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*This would be a massive and all-encompassing effort, of course—something we cannot count on happening.
Agree.
Though I fear this will be politically net negative for the democratic party.
The Democratic Party was already in trouble after the election results.
It seems to be a longstanding Democratic obsession, the idea that if they refrain from doing something, the Republicans will follow “gentleman’s rules” and also refrain from it. But the Republicans aren’t gentlemen and follow no rules. So it never works, but the Democrats refuse to learn better.
I was listening to the Podcast of Rachel Maddow’s show last night and, as usual, she puts this whole thing in an interesting context and perspective. I won’t try to summarize what she said, but just that it is worth listening to.
I meant testimony in front of whatever congressional investigation targets the supposed Biden Crime Family. They may continue this one.
If Trump gets a loyal AG, Joe Biden has to be targeted. GOP House members will also will call Hunter back, and then go over every word in Hunter’s new testimony searching for supposed perjury. The pardon only covers what Hunter did prior to December 1, 2024, not what he later said about what he did before that date.
Now, it could be that I’m paranoid to think that Trump truly wants revenge for 2020. Or it could be that Mike Johnson and company will have too much integrity to go after Trump’s enemies list. I doubt that but admit to congenital pessimism.
Besides the congressional testimony route, Pam Bondi, if confirmed, could try the grand jury perjury trap technique described in this Wikipedia article.
And then Hunter gets to take the Fifth despite your “He won’t be able to take the fifth”.
James Biden to start with. Possibly Joe Biden too
This is briefly discussed here:
Per the link above, the answer can be yes only if Hunter claims himself to be at jeopardy for a state law violation. I am going to go out on a limb and predict that if Hunter tries that, he will be jailed for contempt of Congress (or contempt of court if before a grand jury).
However, I do believe that Hunter’s pardon greatly reduced the probability of his ever being incarcerated. My objection to the pardon is NOT that it is sure to fail. And my objection is not that it gives Trump license to go after innocent enemies. He already has that license. My objection is that it politically assists the authoritarian regime that will be in place, in my country, in 47 days.
And that wouldn’t have possibly happened but for this pardon, correct? No way Trump and his congressional allies would do anything like that, except for the pardon?
For what?
I was wondering about what Joe Biden’s brother is supposedly guilty of.
And I’m wondering about that magical invisible hoop that Joe Biden was supposed to jump through to avoid all this from happening.
Could Joe Biden have let Hunter be sentenced, then commute the sentence, then pardon him from anything further?
Not that it’d really matter of course. The same self-righteous indignation would rain down from both right and left. But it would at least have let him retain a modicum of consistency with his past statements, and protect his son at the same time. Not to mention show everyone the old codger’s still got a trick or two up his sleeve.
He might not have been President then, the timing is tight.
June 24, 2024:
Nothing came of the referral because the Biden Justice Department was run fairly.
Maybe Joe Biden will give a Hunter-style pardon to James. But then all the GOP has to do is to call them back to testify. During long congressional testimony (7 hours for Hunter early this year) it is hard to impossible to avoid saying something that ungenerous listeners can paint as inconsistent with either that person’s own testimony, or that of others.
Perhaps if Hunter had not been pardoned, they would have pulled him out of prison to testify before Congress. Do they have no limits? We will find out.
Would have happened even without the pardon imo.
Now in the republican viewpoint the sweeping pardon from 2014 is an indication of some wrong-doing by the Biden family/Hunter when Joe was VP.
Otherwise why specifically mention in the pardon the period from 2014 unless there are as yet undiscovered crimes committed in that period…that is the republican pov.
So even more of a reason now to possibly go after James and Joe.