a) his mother was a member of the “Bible Students” under Russell - they didn’t become the ‘Jehovah’s Witnesses’ until Rutherford in 1931 - The organization, while still cult like, was very different prior to Rutherford
b) Since the ‘New World Translation’ was not avaiable until the mid 50’s, there was no such thing as a “Jehovah’s Witness” bible at the time he was sworn in - I have no cite for what bible was used, it would not surprise me if it was his mother’s, which may have been published by them (prior to the NWT, the Watchtower printed the NAS and the KJV versions for sale by the group)
what he calls ‘deeds of kindness’ - I call normal decent behaviour - something I don’t feel the need to brag on doing as a show of my ‘christian love’ - so, yeah - they don’t meet the requirements.
Don’t presume my goals - I stated in my very first post in this thread –
and again stated that my goal is fighting ignorance - the cult of JW breeds it - dougie_monty (if he is being honest) shows that he is ignorant of his own orgnaizations teachings - many people are not aware of the JW history and use of deception - so, yeah - when given the opportunity - I will expose it for what it is.
Sure - my ‘pathetic little man’ comment was certainly a directed comment - and an honest one - that is how I see him at this point - the rest of my posts have been directed at the organization he belongs to, that he (and the 2 or three others, and you apparently) is here ‘in defense of’ - so yeah - its expected that HE will be called out for the actions of the group he belongs to.
If he (or you) doesn’t like it - you’re free to go elsewhere - go back to the hall where you can go “those mean people on the internet called me names and accused the org of lying” - where the elders will then counsel you on bad associations and warn you of the dangers of reading ‘apostate’ material and how demons are out here to get ya.
So because I’m stepping in to suggest you stop this pointless pile-on, now I’m “one of them” and should slink away as well?
WTF are you going on about. I’m in defense of reasonable limitations to vitriol and suggesting that fighting ignorance should only be carried so far as the person to whom you’re speaking is in a position to have their mind changed. dougie_monty’s not. He’s been on the defense this whole time, already told you he can’t answer your questions, yet you continue to poke and prod, and call names, and cite more specifically his own literature more thoroughly than he’s probably ever seen.
You were saying, with the input of others in the thread, how Uber_The_Goober is making JW’s look terrible. Well you’re making whatever group you’re representing look a bit uncaring and hardhearted. More than a bit really…
Are you measuring your distaste in karma points or by what rule? Because somehow I feel certain that telling the two JWs here some of us find their tactics abhorrent and anti social pales in comparison to actually allowing kids to suffer and die, or actually driving members of one’s own family to near desolation. Your mileage may vary.
The language you used in your post to dougie_monty certainly looks like witness speak - if it is not (and you are not) - my apologies for assuming so .
I represent no ‘group’ - if I seem uncaring about an organization/cult - I can live with that - my attempt to educate them about their ‘organization’ actually shows that I care about them as individuals - something their organization doesn’t do.
I’ve made exactly one personally aimed comment - and it was more a description really - ‘poking and prodding’ - over the course of half dozen posts? In case you missed the point of a discussion board - its to have a discussion - you know, post stuff, ask questions, read a response, continue the discussion - trying to get someone to respond is part of the point - remember, I aksed him if he wanted to continue the conversation - he could have said ‘no’ or he could have simply not responded at all - since he said “sure, go ahead” - I assumed he would want to be part of the conversation. I offered to end that part of the discussion a couple of times and left it to dougie_monty if he wanted it to continue.
you keep saying he told me repeatedly ‘that he couldnt answer the questions’ - have you actually read the thread? your repetition of this belies your own ignorance (or bias) - he was asked once, asked if he’d like to re-answer once - then it was dropped - except by him - yeah, there were new, and different, questions - but thats not the same, now is it?
You call it a pile on - remember again - dougie_monty - started this thread with his own agenda - that it turned on him (or moreso the organization he belongs to) is not surprising in the least - but NONE of us are out starting ‘why we hate dougie_monty threads’ or ‘why we hate the JW’ threads - Its more interesting to note that other than the snark (to be expected) - the majority of the intiail posts in response to the OP were that the ‘gun slinger’ was wrong… guess dougie_monty missed that.
as to ‘limiting the fight’ to only the person in the threads interest level? nah - there are alot of lurkers that might need/want the information - if we limit the conversation on the ‘probability of changing the mind of the person being spoken to’ on the message board - we are doing a disservice to the rest of the community.
For his first inauguration, Eisenhower used two: his personal “West Point Bible” (given to him by his mother in 1915) and the one used by George Washington. For his second, just the “West Point Bible”. cite
I’m not exactly sure, Simster, but I sense that you rudely “blew off” BrickaBracka in a recent post. Am I right? Yes or No will do.
The tenor of the replies from you, CLee, and others may not be as bad as the attitude of the gunman in the OP, but it is repulsive enough to me, even though I started this thread in The BBQ Pit; and, from past threads about the Witnesses, I even expected it, to some extent. But not to THIS extent!! I know baiting when I see/hear/read it. The person who originally gave me the lion’s share of invective was my former stepfather (“I hate Jehovah’s witnesses with a passion!”), whom I did not take seriously because he was a drunkard (we eventually moved out on him and my Mom divorced him; he was fired from his job for being drunk). Your discussion tactics are such that I conbsider you no more consequential than him. And your brush-off of Brickabracka rates you a great big Zero too.
As for the blood issue: You/CLee…One, or both, of you, has presumed that failure to transfuse blood automatically results in death. Under California law (Penal Code Section 187), that is the only way it could meet the criterion of homicide ("…defined…the unlawful killing of a human being with malice aforethought.")
Some Witness children have been transfused against their parents’ wishes, and brought back dead. ) Oh–and consider Arthur Ashe.
I will take rude over fucking scum who brainwash children into rejecting lifesaving medical treatment. When that thought process is a basic tenet of your religion, your religion sucks. Jeez. Even Orthodox Jews break religious laws when it comes to saving a life.
You;re wrong - I wasn’t rude - dismissive? yes - rude? no - I also re-butted his arguments - he was the rude one - as you are now.
and now, you’ve equated Clee to ‘nothing better than a drunkard’ - who’s throwing the insults here?
as for blood transfusions - no, we haven’t equated ‘all refusal’ with ‘instant death’ - it’s another dodge by you to avoid the point that ‘refusing’ may end up causing the senseless death of the patient or child - or prolong the suffering/recovery/treatment of an illness which is un-neccesary and cruel.
even your own publications admit that some children ‘gave thier lives’ by refusing the blood transfusion. That ‘death’ was better than that ‘utlimate sin’ - do you deny that?
And I do wish that legislation would be enacted that would equate ‘religous quackery especially in regards to medical treatment of minor children’ would be illegal - it goes beyond just you and your little cult - but that would just be another feather in your imaginary ‘persecution’ cap, now wouldn’t it?
a cogent point - if the child is in need of a transfusion - things have already gone horribly wrong - no one has advocated that a transfusion is a ‘cure all’ - having it done ‘against the parents wishes’ only adds additional stress to the entire situation which is also un-neccesary and cruel - but I guess the parents can blame the doctors instead of jehovah -
idiots - all of them - and yeah - you’re one too - i’m tired of your little game and i’m tired of trying to have a ‘civil’ discourse with you - you are clearly not interested and I now fully believe you are simply trolling to get this reaction.
No one said that. But if you think that gambling on a child’s life is somehow better than giving a doctor the go ahead to save her life you have blood all over your hands. Your own child, if she survives the denial of a transfusion, might forgive you for gambling on her. But I wouldn’t forgive it regardless of the outcome. In fact, I’d feel comfortable stating that you are willing to sacrifice children to your God rather than save their lives, and that’s a primitive and brutal act.
As far as what you think of me, I may be intolerant with regards to your two most antisocial practices and I certainly have some cruel words for you and your kind. But I’d never let a child suffer or die who could be helped with a transfusion. I’d never turn my back on a family member or abandon them in a fit of self-righteous fury. But you admittedly would, as would every JW as prescribed by the elders. I think rather less of the lot of you for your cruel actions. I would no more welcome an active JW into my home than I would a Klansman.
oddly enough - uber_the_goober has also been banned - oddly enough…
discontinue discussing with ‘you’ in this specific thread? If you stop posting nonsense, sure - I’ll be happy to stop responding to it - stop discussing the idocracy that is the JW cult? never.
Haven’t bothered to read the thread as the OP was imbecilic enough to deter me from going further.
At any rate, what do you propose that Jehova’s Witnesses are bullet-proof? I’m basically am anti-gun person though I admit to owning a couple in my late 20’s/early 30’s. A 38mm S&W and a 9mm Glock. Let me aim and fire at that bunch and I can assure you it’d be a different story even given half the shots.
Not that I am glad it turned-out that way, because I am, asshole ignorant fucks JWs that they are, be forgotten. Trying to sell me shit on a Sunday morning while I am otherwise quite gladly occupied.
Why, glad I am not armed because if that doesn’t want you to cap someone, well…
And I am willing to discontinue it if you, CLee and Simster, are. How about it?