Won't this year's election be impossible to rig?

I have friends who insist there’s no way Bush can be beaten this November, because the fix is already in. My thinking is, it will be impossible for either side to cheat in this election, because after what happened in 2000, and in light of the incredibly high stakes this year, this will be the most closely and carefully watched election in American history. How can anybody get away with any funny business?

One example: Governor Jeb Bush in Florida tried to issue another “felons list” to purge (predominantly black and predominantly Democratic) voters from the rolls, and he fell flat on his face. See the current GD thread: “It couldn’t happen again in Florida, could it?” – http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=265501

I won’t say it’s IMPOSSIBLE, because it isn’t. Is it likely that, if tried, it will be unnoticed by the public at large? I think it’s unlikely.

But that won’t stop this thread from being an explosion of despair-filled conspiracy theories.

Out-and-out vote fraud will be difficult, but we still haven’t solved the problems revealed in the last presidential election, so you can bet it won’t be smooth sailing. We’re still using a whole raft of voting methods that are subject to unintentional voting errors, miscounting, non-recountability, etc. We’ve still got problems with voter registration, careless purging of the roles, and so on.

What this means is that we might have several “Floridas” this time around, with party hacks from both sides trying to influence precisely how recounts are conducted, dragging election officials into friendly courts, state legislatures threatening to appoint electors, etc. Just guessing, but I’ll bet it ain’t gonna be pretty.

Okay – but all that means Bush does not have a lock on it, just because he’s president and his brother is governor of a swing state and most Supreme Court justices were appointed by Republican presidents. You’re talking about “unintentional voting errors” – which don’t necessarily benefit either party more than the other.

I agree - nobody’s got a “lock” on it. The messiness of our voting system stands ready and willing to bite either candidate on the butt. I think we’re going to see a lot of very close races, state by state, so the screw-ups can break either way.

In some elections, it hasn’t been too bad. People have thought, “Well, I don’t want this guy to win, but if he does win, it won’t be the end of the world.” This time around, there are a lot of folks who are convinced that it will be the end of the world if “the other guy” wins, so the closely-contested battles promise to be truly ugly.

No, but it means there could be a lot of jump balls, and most of the possession arrows seem to be pointed toward Bush.

Please pardon my ignorance – I take almost no interest in sports, which I presume is the field from which you’re drawing these metaphors. What are “jump balls” and “possession arrows”?

Don’t forget the post-Florida push towards electronic voting machines, which are as a whole (a) untraceable, (b) highly insecure, and © run by CEOs who donate big money to the GOP.

“[I am] committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year.”
–Walden O’Dell, Diebold CEO, 8/14/2003

Perhaps . . . but there is a dark and might force in the universe which even execs and hackers must fear: Lawyers! :smiley:

From the New York Times:

Now with all those Democratic lawyers, and Republican lawyers, and nonpartisan lawyers, watching the election process like hawks, how could anybody pull off any irregularity?

One other safeguard, which I haven’t heard discussed this year, might be considered: Revive exit polling, as a way of checking the official vote count against the exit poll results. Do enough exit polls, and they are statistically likely to show the same result as the vote count provided the votes are counted honestly.

Holy Christ, this is getting stupid. We’re virtually guaranteeing a system where any close state will be contested and decided by the SC, by necessity, because neither side will heel.

This is what worries me, the computerized, no-paper-trail voting machines. A moderately intelligent 8th-grader could hack them and get Britney Spears elected President.

Not that that wouldn’t be an improvement . . .

I just heard on the radio that Senator Bill Nelson (D-Fla.) is calling for an independent audit of the touchscreen voting machines – for one thing, because they seem to produce too many “blank ballots” compared with optical-scanner machines.

On a jump ball, which is when a player from both teams have their hands on the ball, a tie so to speak, the NBA uses possesion arrows. Like this < > towards each team.

He’s saying the arrow points to the pubbies.

The reality is, EVERY election, the people pull shit like the phone jamming scam they just convicted a guy for from New Hampshire. People always hand out cards telling African Americans that voting requires two forms of photo id (which most poor people don’t even have). You never hear about it except locally, and little ever comes into it because once the election happens, there’s nothing you can do. It just comes with the territory. It’ll happen this year like it happens every year.

:confused:

Where the heck is this happening and why isn’t it stopped?

I’m a poll-worker in the Bronx. Almost all of the people who train me, most of the election officials, and most of my co-workers are black. We all get the same training. We all have exactly the same posters to put on the wall, the same machines, the same pollworker’s manuals, all of which say you don’t need to show ANY ID to vote. Our cop periodically puts down his Daily News and lumbers outside to check to see nobody’s doing any electioneering within 150 feet of our entrance. And a few of our voters, usually the older Irish or Russian immigrants, occasionally try to show me an ID which I gently hand back to them and am not even supposed to look at. If somebody did insist that they’d been told they needed two kinds of ID, I’d call over a Coordinator and they’d ask the voter for more info, and the jerk outside would be caught pretty quickly.

I would think if some party hacks were outside handing out such cards, anywhere in the city, they’d be noticed. Granted, my neighborhood is predominently Irish, but none of my black neighbors or co-workers or a single black newspaper or crusading TV news reporter has reported these cards.

Usually smaller cities and towns, any place where things really matter.

Because it’s intermitant and disorganized. Occasionally you’ll get things like the Republican Party people officially getting caught organizing phone jamming schemes on election day in New Hampshire. But usually it’s here and there: hard to track, and hard to prosecute. Police are rarely willing to spend much time on it and under our system, even evidence of massive fraud is rarely enough to change anything: the election results are the election results. There aren’t any do overs. So there isn’t exactly much incentive to track it down: what’s done is done.

There you go. Your votes don’t matter to anything larger scale than a bunch of local razmataz, so why should anyone care?

But do you enough of this happens to seriously affect the election results at a state or national level? What you’re describing sounds too furtive and small-time to make much of a difference.