words, phrases......HELP!

Hey all… newbie to the messageboard, but been a teeming million for several years.

2 questions to start.

  1. Where did the phrase “state of the art” come from?

  2. We have all been taught that a pronoun is always used in place of a noun. (at least, that’s what I was always taught…) So, they should be interchangeable, right? i.e…Steve is running vs. He is running etc. So when you say “It is raining”, or “It’s a nice day today”… What does the “it” refer to?

(If this is not testament that I am a complete loser with too much time on my hands, I have plenty more examples for you… just ask.)

In “It is a nice day today”, “it” refers to the day.

“It is raining” is a more interesting question, since “it” could mean the sky, the weather, or perhaps the universe at large. I think this is an unconscious throughback to a time when we didn’t really know what caused rain. “It is calm and still” is even more ambiguous, since really everything has to be calm and still.


Nothing I write about any person or group should be applied to a larger group.

  • Boris Badenov

Mouthbreather asks:
<QUOTE>

  1. Where did the phrase “state of the art” come from?
    <ENDQUOTE>

According to my handy-dandy American Heritage Dictionary, one of the meanings of “art” is “A system of principles and methods employed in the performance of a set of activities”. Thus, since “state” in this phrase means “condition”, the phrase means the currently accepted means of doing something. In other words, the latest and greatest in one particular field.

<QUOTE>
2. We have all been taught that a pronoun is always used in place of a noun. (at least, that’s what I was always taught…) So, they should be interchangeable, right? i.e…Steve is running vs. He is running etc. So when you say “It is raining”, or “It’s a nice day today”… What does the “it” refer to?
<ENDQUOTE>

It in this case is “the general state of affairs”.

Though pronouns are noun substitutes, a pronoun doesn’t have to substitute for a particular noun in each case. Some are indefinate (e.g., They say that falling in love is wonderful).

Though pronouns are noun substitutes, a pronoun doesn’t have to substitute for a particular noun in each case. Some are indefinate (e.g., They say that falling in love is wonderful). That’s what’s happening with “It is raining.”

Other languages have the same construction.

C’est vrai.


Back off, man. I’m a scientist.

“It’s”

is a reflexive pronoun that includes the verb. you could as easily said, the day is nice.

just a guess

We’re all here, because we’re not all there!

I’ll have to second Mr. Hobson on “it” meaning “the general state of affairs”, or perhaps more specifically “the condition of the weather”.

I have to admit, for a second or two I thought that somehow “raining” was acting as a noun and “it” referred to it. A little research showed me I was wrong. I hate it when that happens.


“I’m not conceited. Conceit is a fault, and I don’t have any faults.”

Verb is a noun.

But nouns are not verbs.

Yes, it would be nice to know what ‘it’ in this sentence refers to, wouldn’t it?

Yes, the correlate word showed up in French in a previous post here, and the German is ‘Es regnet,’ and maybe you can count Spanish in, because, although ‘Llueve’ suffices, Spanish leaves out even subject pronouns that do have explicit referents most of the time.

One the linguistic types here, though, ought to tell us whether this construction goes back to proto-Indoeuropean. If ‘it’ refers to the supernatural, you’d figure we’d say ‘he’ or ‘she’, in line with all those gods and goddesses formed in our image.

metroshane:

‘It’s’ is, of course, a contraction of the pronoun ‘it’ with the verb ‘is’. I don’t think anybody would use the term ‘reflexive’ for this construction. A reflexive verb phrase is ‘[He] hit himself,’ because what hit (the subject) and what was hit are the same but are separately expressed here.

MrKnowItAll:

As to your acting-as-a-noun thesis, it doesn’t really sound all that bad. The English ‘-ing’ verb form is considered a gerund when not part of a compound verb form (a progressive tense). Gerunds or verbals act as either nouns or adjectives, as in ‘Raining is mostly what it does around here,’ or ‘The working man is tired.’ In a progressive-tense verbal construction, as ‘I am working,’ it would seem the ‘-ing’ verb form could be considered an adjective modifying ‘I’. Then, in ‘It is raining,’ ‘raining’ could be considered an predicate adjective modifying the indefinite ‘it’. Then, in English, adjectives can stand for whatever nouns or pronouns they can modify, so ‘raining’ can stand in for whatever ‘it’ is. . .in which case, we don’t have to worry about what ‘it’ is, right? You mean you can’t get with it, just because you don’t know what ‘it’ is?

Ray (It’ll never be the same.)

handy:

Obviously, you have not had anyone gift you, lately.


Tom~

I always thought a pronoun was one that lost its amateur status :o


Best!
Byz