Would Jesus be a Liberal or a Conservative?

The study underlying your citation was superseded. Wonkblog at WAPO: [INDENT]http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2012/10/21/study-conservatives-and-liberals-are-equally-charitable-but-they-give-to-different-charities/

Michele Margolis and Michael Sances note that Brooks’ conclusion comes from a dataset that doesn’t really ask how conservative people are politically so much as how conservative they are socially. Using a dataset which uses more traditional questions to test political beliefs - the General Social Survey - they found no statistically significant relationship between peoples’ political beliefs, or their partisan affiliation, and their charitable giving level. And this held at the state level too. There was no significant relationship between a state’s level of giving and the vote share that Bush received in that state in 2004. [/INDENT] Emphasis added. They go on to say though that the type of charity varies by political beliefs: conservatives give more to churches, while liberals gave more to secular organizations and 2005 tsunami relief.

According to this article churches give 10-25% of donations to social welfare programs.
As for the OP, Jesus was clearly an ultra-liberal and I have a full set of cherry picked quotes to prove it. Coincidentally so am I. Huh.

Save the whales!
ETA: I see that the MIT studies equated total charitable giving between conservatives and liberals by looking at shares of income going to charity. In the LA Times article, they note that conservatives have higher incomes in their sample, so that the aggregate amount given to charity overall by conservatives is apparently higher.

On the first point, you can raise a whole big debate on what the bible says or doesn’t say about abortion. To your second point, I agree Jesus would not have based his own beliefs on what John Calvin or anyone else thought.

Well, no, generally speaking, that would make him a revolutionary. “Revolutionary” is a thing with no definite content other than that, it applies regardless of the kind of radical change you want to make. So does “reformer.” Liberalism, OTOH, does have definite content; it is an Enlightenment-and-later thing with no analogue in the ancient world. See here.

There’s really no mapping any of that onto the Beatitudes, etc.

As others have said, it’s pretty pointless trying to shoe-horn a historical(ish) figure into any modern political category. That said, the idea that he might be a Conservative baffles me. Certainly, in the broadest sense you’d have to consider him ‘left-wing’.

‘It’s easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven.’ He wasn’t speaking in riddles there, the message is about as unambiguous as it’s possible to be. ‘it’s f@#king impossible for a rich man to enter heaven.’

Also, it’s clear from several verses that Jesus expected the world to end very soon. If so, political/social issues as such would be of trivial importance compared to preparing every soul to meet God’s judgment.

Against that is the view of Reza Aslan in Zealot that Jesus’ agenda was political first and foremost: He wanted to overthrow the priests because the priests were hand in glove with the Romans (who always preferred to rule through local elites when they could), and were sucking the pious people dry with their Temple fees and such (that’s why his first target in the Temple was the money changers, who facilitated the whole business by exchanging unclean Greek and Roman coins for clean shekels that could be spent to buy sacrificial animals).

My guess is he’d advocate for a redistribution of wealth which would put him solidly to the left. I always saw Jesus as a socialist.

Perhaps you could show how the quotes were selective or cherry-picked by providing a few counter-examples. That is, a few direct quotes from early church fathers that abortion was OK. Got anything like that?

And BTW, this -

isn’t what I mean. Because the same Wiki article says quite clearly

So, direct quotes that show some basis for this alleged scholarly disagreement. I have already presented the quotes that back up what I have said. Let’s see yours, if any.

Regards,
Shodan

Indeed, it’s hard to imagine him championing the capitalist model, though he might favor the attendant freedoms that come along with it. OTOH, it’s not hard at all to imagine him happy if citizens of a nation robustly support a strong safety net that provides compassionate and decent care for its most needy.

N.B.: What Jesus believed is not necessarily the same thing as what even the earliest Christians believed. E.g., Jesus probably never really believed himself God.

“give onto Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give onto God what belongs to God.”

Clearly a separation of the church and state. I myself not see that as a liberal’s statement.

Huh? Are you saying liberals want more religion in the government?

One thing he would most certainly not be is a Christian. As a devout Jew (and all the evidence suggests that’s exactly what he was) he would find his post-mortem deification shocking and blasphemous. Politically I think he would lean liberal on some things and conservative on others. Same-sex marriage? As if! Anyone from his era (and most others previous to this) would find the concept appalling. Abortion? I think he might adopt a more liberal position on this. Donald Trump? Jesus wept.

Since you believe it to be probable, you must have some evidence for it.

All the discussion so far seems to be using what the early church reported about Jesus to decide if He was a liberal or conservative or whatever. Do you have any of that level of evidence to indicate what Jesus believed about His own nature?

Keeping in mind that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Regards,
Shodan

Easy: Jesus had a human body, capable of feeling pain. (I know there have been branches of Christianity that denied that, but most don’t.) Even God would be crazy to think He was God if He found Himself stuck in a situation where He kept on feeling pain regardless of whether He wanted to or not. Was Jesus crazy?

Also: Jesus was a nice Jewish boy – well-versed enough in Scripture to argue it with Pharisees – he knew very well that the Messiah is not God in any sense.

The following is not the bible but Trump would not look nice to Jesus indeed, it is unfortunate that Jesus will not intervene like he did in “The Selfish Giant”

♪ [QUOTE] Building a wall to surround you, Gathering all your treasures around you, Living a life apart.

Not having anyone near you;
Building a wall and making them fear you,
Saying you have no heart.

You’re a fool if you think you can live
Your life without sharing sunshine and gladness;
If you think you can live without love,
You’re building a wall of sorrow and madness.
[/QUOTE]

Christianity teaches that the Incarnation and crucifixion were voluntary. Therefore your argument doesn’t work.

Regards,
Shodan

All versions of Christianity teach that?

But how would he advise me?

“Hey, question for you, Jesus: I was gonna whip some rocks at that gay couple for marrying each other; is that okay? Huh. Okay, you got me there – but I can judge them, right? I mean, later this afternoon I plan on judging the heck out of someone who trespassed against me, and – wait, what? What? Oh. Well, still: can you gimme an exception for a homosexual who hates and curses me? One of 'em is suing me tomorrow, and – sonofabitch, that’s some weirdly specific advice. Yeah, I hear ya. Real nice talking with ya, Jesus.”