What if she didn’t see the money falling out of his pocket? Maybe she was avoiding looking at Eddie because he’s such an ass, and noticed the money in the seat after he left.
If you really hold with the principle of the first sentence here, there would be no basis for the second. The only way to construe it as “decent”–right–to return the money would be to perceive that he had a claim on it.
I just re-read the OP, and in fact it does not say that Iris saw the money falling out of Eddie’s pocket. She saw it in a precarious position IN his pocket, but that she saw it fall is not explicit; it is not impossible (though certainly it is quite improbable) that the money is not his. While I certainly intended it to be Eddie’s money, the Rhymer Rules require that I admit other possibilities.
To the folks who believe Iris a thief (a category that includes me): If she didn’t know Eddie’s name and where he worked, would your answer change?
See, that’s the problem.
The case of Finders v. Weepers is universally misunderstood. The Court actually found for Weepers.
By this I mean that the money in the case described was not abandoned.
As one court observed:
Where the owner does not make a conscious decision to throw it away, the finder may not simply take the property and convert it to his use.
Put another way, if bus surveillance cameras show Iris taking the money, she can be arrested, and your invocation of “Finders” and “Keepers” will not save her from a criminal conviction as a thief.
Nope. She could have turned the money over to the police, or even the bus driver, but she kept it and spent it.
Interesting point. Would she have kept the money regardless, or because it was Eddie she kept it as revenge?
Here’s an issue–can she safely return the money? If she had called out to him, he’d have taken that as a come-on and stepped up his harassment. If she approaches it to return it to him, he’ll take THAT as a come-on and step up the harassment. If she gives it to a third party to give to him, there’s really no guarantee that he won’t figure it out (unless they actively LIE to protect her, which is not ethically awesome, either) and take THAT as evidence that she’s just shy, but totally wants his jock. And she may not know an appropriate third party.
So basically he’s created a situation where she can’t safely return the money. The best thing to do would have been to just leave it, but she panicked. Given that, I suppose the second best thing is to turn it in to the bus company as “lost”, or donate it to charity.
I agree that Iris woiuld have been a damn fool to return the money to Eddie, but where are you getting “panicked” from? Eddie wasn’t on the bus when she took it; she was obviously in no danger from him. She could have simply passed it by or handed it to the driver.
I’m not seeing how lying to protect Iris (if she’d given the money to a third party to return to Eddie) would be unethical. I’d do it without blinking. Truthfulness is not the highest virtue.
Why give hte money to the police? She’s poor (losing the $10 flip phone hurt, she’s riding the bus, she can’t be rolling in it). Going to the police is gonna involve time and effort on her part and probably will net her nothing. She should have just handed the money the driver or passed it by, but going to the police is more trouble than is worthwhile.
Perhaps “reacted poorly in a pinch” is better than “panicked”, but either way, I can see feeling like it was an emergency.
And I wouldn’t like asking a third party to lie for the sake of someone who was such a jerk. I am fine lying in such a case, but I wouldn’t ask someone else to get mixed up in the situation–tangled web and all that.
She is a thief, not a common thief who plans to steal something, but not just an opportunist either. She knew who’s money it was. She knew it was in his pocket and fell out. He did NOT “abandon” it. If she would have given it back to him, he MAY have chosen to lighten up on her. It is interesting the diverse sense of what is right and wrong.
Because in some jurisdictions, that is the proper thing to do with found property. You turn it in as required, and if no one claims it within the specified time, then you get to keep it.
ETA: seems like I remember something about cops setting up a sting operation on a subway with a wallet some time ago…
Why on earth would that make him lighten up on her? He doesn’t think he’s hurting her now, so it’s not like if she decides she’s a good person, he’ll be nicer. Any sign from her that she likes him (and giving him his money back would be taken that way) will encourage him to keep pressuring her. I’m not saying she should have taken the money, but she would have been totally justified in watching him walk away and not saying anything, just letting someone else take it.
I wasn’t talking about going to the police as opposed to keeping the money; I was talking about going to the police as opposed to ignoring it. I don’t think Iris can ethically keep the cash under any circumstances; she knows whom it belongs to. But she doesn’t owe Eddie anything–certainly not the time and effort of an extra bus ride. I say ignore it.
Yes, this is theft. Eddie’s obnoxious behavior has nothing to do with whether it is theft or not. If the idea is that “It’s not theft because Eddie was annoying” - well, that logic is troubling.
Of course, this is a hypothetical scenario so I do not know the ages or personalities of the participants, or if it really occurred, however my comment went towards shaming Eddie. She could have given the money back while at the same time telling him she does not want anything more to do with him. There are still SOME people who have a conscience, although from some of the comments seen here, there seems to be a really twisted sense of whats right and wrong.
If she’s not certain the money is Eddie’s, then I don’t think she’s a thief. If she knows it’s his, then she is a thief.
I think that case was several decades previous to 1979.
Anyway . . . yes, she’s a thief. But I would have done the same.
I think it kind of gets to the thing my mom told me when I was a kid, “two wrongs don’t make a right”. She is a thief. She is only responsible for herself and her actions, not his. He’s a whole lot of words that I’ll avoid using, but she’s still a thief.
She’s a thief and I would have done the same thing.
If the same thing happened but Eddie was a nice guy and Iris an evil bitch, we’d all agree she’s a thief. She took his money. The personality type of the characters involved doesn’t matter.