I’m wondering if the idea makes sense, why wouldn’t an existing cruise ship operator (Carnival, Norwegian, etc.) just do it, using one of their older ships (perhaps one that they were about to sell off)? They already know the ships’ running costs and have access to staff and supplies. On the other hand, if cruise ships are like passenger airliners, they’re getting rid of the older ones because the newer ones are cheaper to operate.
Though upthread someone mentioned Semester at Sea, which is a shorter-form version of this idea, as are those round-the-world cruises.
Yeah. Although IMO there’s often not much daylight between those two apparently quite different stories.
Some “business visionary” gets an idea in an area where he (almost always he) has no baseline competence. No way to tell if the idea passes the laugh test or not. Hire a couple people, make a glib presentation in total sincerity, and suddenly the ball is rolling better than they expected. People out there want this idea to be true.
Now experts are hired, say it can’t work as business, and the Boss will not take “no” for an answer. Now you have a de facto con even if you didn’t a week ago.
The boss is a charismatic (or at least driven) True Believer, a few in the next layer down are gambling they might get lucky & get shares, and the lower workers are cynically delivering something that they’re certain will be DOA, but for now the work is steady.
Each layer has a different view of whether it’s a con or not. And they’re all partly right.
Rush from the Titan submersible, Skilling at Enron, Holmes at Theranos; the list goes on for hundreds of names both big and obscure.
Something you, myself, and my friend all agree on. The results are largely the same, and at that point, does the motivation and intent of the originating parties matter all that much? We’ve had the same sort of discussion on the whole Elio Motors thing several times as Overambitious/Vaporware/Scam three way.
Probably because there are people who already basically live on cruise ships without the operators needing to do anything like commit to providing services for three years straight.
I’ve read about such people. I think one article said that given the cost of assisted living residences, people are able to live for extended periods on regular cruise ships for less. Some get discounts as long-term customers and become well-known by the crew.
“Assisted living” is a lot more personal care and oversight than anyone gets on a cruise ship. Like somebody to stick your spoon in your face, give you your pills, bathe you, and check on you every 20 minutes to ensure you’re still breathing and are (mostly) not lying in a pile of your own shit. None of that is on offer on a cruise ship.
Even the lesser “independent living” still includes a bit more formal elder services for the residents. But you’re 100% right there’s a LOT of overlap between living on a cruise ship and living in an Independent Living place. You get food, maid service, a library, and entertainment. And enough staff recognize you that if you do have a medical crisis somebody will find you in a day or two.
Some people in assisted living need more assistance than others. I have a friend who moved to assisted living because he has a serious balance problem (due to a stroke) and he can’t safely drive, so he can no longer live independently. But i bet he’d be okay on a cruise ship. Of course, they wouldn’t be well positioned to treat the next stroke…
And then there are those that don’t have an immediate need for most of the “assistance” but it can be nice to call upon, provide a reason to be more social (since some of us are hateful shut-ins by nature), and possibly just forward-looking towards needing such things.
I mention @ThelmaLou in this regard, after circumstances forced her to move recently, and made lemonade from lemons by picking a totally has-its-crap-together facility to future-proof herself.
Would I consider the current cruise lines to be equivalent? Probably not, and I’d worry about the already known issues of them being a semi-literal petri dish of hot and cold running illness. But a well run, well managed cruise ship with lots of planning could certainly serve as such for those with sufficient assets. And it might be nice to dodge some of the obscene US Pharma pricing by handling it via more rational pricing. But that’s another thread.
A person who can’t drive may not need assisted living if that’s the only issue - when I was looking at retirement communities plenty of the “active adult” 55+ ones had transportation to stores and medical appointments.
At least around here, that is totally consistent with what we call “independent living”.
“Assisted living” is the next step up with personal attendants who aren’t full-time one-to-a-patient, but they’re close. Like one attendant to 3 or 4 patients as long as they’re awake.
It seems these terms aren’t universal in the US eldercare industry. Yet.
I’ve met a few of these on cruises. (You meet more of them when you travel solo. Solo gets you seated at a “singles” table at dinner. On Carnival, this is the equivalent of going to the frat pledge party in “Animal House” and getting taken over to sit with…well, you know.)
One guy had retired from the Federal government and owned a house or condo just outside of DC. He rented it out, of course, though he retained one bedroom so he could stay there occasionally. He was there a total of about three weeks a year. The rest of the time, he was on a cruise ship. He had a travel agent who did all the scheduling and negotiating for him, looking for the best last-minute deals on inside cabins and coordinating departure/arrival ports.
He confirmed that it was only about $1500/month to cruise, which, of course, includes food. He doesn’t own a car and the energy/water/trash bills at his house are covered by the renter. Because of his cruiser status on ALL the lines, he gets all kinds of special event invitations, including dinner with the Captain and free drinks at regular intervals. He claimed to bank every bit of his actual Federal pension. The rental on his house covered his home insurance, property taxes, and cruising.
Probably exaggerated, but everything I saw seemed to confirm what he told me.
He may have decided that if he couldn’t actually live independently, he’d pick a place that could care for potential future problems. The downside of assisted living is that half the residents have significant cognitive impairment, which makes them less than ideal company. The upside is that he has a lot of resources.
Yeah. Many such facilities around here have two sections, the Independent section and the Assisted section.
The Assisted folks benefit some from interacting with the Independents. The opposite isn’t so true: staring into the face of living with great disability when you’ve already got at least a toe and maybe one whole foot in that camp yourself is not good for one’s morale.
But for sure being positioned where you can step up your own care without great disruption or logistics once you need it is only wise.
Aged MIL died while still in Independent living. Her problem was mostly mobility with some forgetfulness.
By far her biggest source of unhappiness was the significant cognitive impairment of most of the rest of the crowd. Nobody had Alzheimer’s, but everybody was mentally getting ever-slower and ever-feebler. Her too, but less far and less fast than almost all the rest. 'Twas a vexation to her. And would certainly be so to your friend as well.
Thanks for that. $1500 per month is pretty cheap. It’s less than many pay just for a mortgage or rent. I imagine that he’s also really familiar with the ships so he can advise first-time cruisers on what to do and where to go.
He was a helpful guy. But…he never paid for a drink and he only wanted to attend free activities. He had this pegged. Everyone knew him and he had one of those hats that had “Super Deluxe 100+ Cruiser” pins from every cruise line imaginable.
I asked him about getting from cruise to cruise or port to port. (I think we sailed out of Miami.) He pointed out that the lines provide shuttle service to the airports, terminals, etc., for free. He might go to the airport and wait a couple hours to get a free bus to the next cruise. Sometimes he got a flight as part of the cruise. The travel agent probably worked his/her ass off for him.
if that business model catches on … we really might see some disruption in 2 industries:
old age care
cruise ships
I can see the upside of it … elderly people seeing a lot of world for not too much $$$$, social events, tailored for their needs
… but I also shiver at the thought of “a ship full of infirm/old/cogn. challenged people” and possibilities for abuse (at high sea, and far away from others)…
I have no doubt that - should the numbers add up - we might see a lot of that stuff in our future … ol’ uncle Ernie getting parked on a cruise-ship until expiration
Unless the ships are going to be outfitted with facilities and staff equivalent to a land-based hospital (which AFAIK they aren’t currently, and which would significantly increase costs for all passengers), you’ll be seeing a bunch of people dying at sea of conditions that might not have been fatal on land.
At an ordinary senior community, if the in-house medical facilities can’t deal with a given situation, a full-blown hospital is usually only a quick ambulance ride away.
are hateful shut-ins by nature), and possibly just forward-looking towards needing such things.