If we stop expecting names to be gendered this won’t be an issue. And it’s important to remember that name gendering changes constantly; the fact that it changes more frequently in the direction male -> female says something about what kind of “misgendering” we care about more.
It won’t be an issue for names, but that doesn’t mean it won’t be an issue in general, and that the boy named Sarah won’t care if people don’t realize he’s a boy. And yes, things that are seen as stereotypically male are more valued, by society, than stereotypically female things. That seems to be a different, although related, point.
But if that person equated being given a non-Afrocentric name to “abuse”, I would certainly roll my eyes at them. I understand the need to have one’s racial and cultural background respected. So if I tell you I’m black, I don’t need you giving me hell about how “unblack” I look. But I’m not going to blame my parents if they give me an Anglo name that gets me teased on the playground. I can give myself a name that affirms all of my various identities, if I care THAT much about having my identity affirmed. It’s not my parents’ job to do this. It’s just their job to give a handle.
Both my gender and race are often misidentified. Big whoop. If I ever have kids and they come to me compaining that the name I gave them was too feminine and too white, I’ll tell them they’re free to come up with whatever name they want. I’ll even pay to make the name-change legal. But I would secretly worry about how obviously insecure they are about themselves.
I would agree with you about the name. I’d also roll my eyes at anyone who claimed that someone would have to be racist to identify as part black, when they look white, or part white when they look to be what this society thinks of as fully black. Because that’s basically what’s going on in this thread, except with accusations of sexism and insecurity. You can want to be seen as who and what you are without being insecure in who and what you are, or disliking people who aren’t like you.
A male says, “I don’t want to be named __, because it’s too girly and feminine! I ain’t no girl!”
Another male says, “I’d rather be called __, because I like this name. It suits me better than __.”
The second male probably isn’t sexist or insecure. But the first probably is.
It’s all in how you frame it. You can frame your displeasure with a name or class of names in a way that communicates “sexist and insecure”. Or you can frame it in a way that doesn’t.
“Years” before you started school? How old were you when you started?
Six. I could write my own name by the time I was three.
Huh? If we stop expecting to be able to identify people’s gender based on their name, this boy won’t have to worry about people mistaking him for a girl just because he’s named Sarah. Instead of expecting that a person’s gender will be pre-advertized by their name, we will expect that when we meet them in person we’ll find out if they’re a boy or a girl. Is this so hard?
“I like the name Elizabeth, just fine, however I’d prefer to have a name that matches my gender,*” is probably coming from sexism and insecurity? It’s common for transgender people to choose a new name after the transition. Are all these people sexist and insecure because they didn’t stick with their original names, or choose a different name that matched the gender on their birth certificate?
*While we’re still living in a time where names and genders match.
The point isn’t that he’d worry about being mistaken for a girl because his name is Sarah. The point is that he’d still wish to be identified as a boy, in general. We already have a handful of non-gendered names. If/When they become the majority, that doesn’t mean that no one will react, to some degree, like **Skald’s **ex, when they’re mistakenly called sir.
There are entire human societies in which given names don’t indicate sex or gender. They seem to get by somehow.
If someone said they chose a name just because it fits their gender better, YES, I would have negative opinions about that.
It’s like if I heard someone say, “I’m going by Keisha now because that’s a black name, and I gotta have a black name.” That would give me a bit of pause. But I wouldn’t think twice if she said: “I’m going by Keisha now because I like that name more than my current name, Elizabeth.”
I mean, what if you had a friend who decided to change his masculine name (let’s say, “Michael”) to something even more macho (like “Max Power”). And his justification was, “Michael sounds too much like Michelle. I’m a manly man.” Wouldn’t you think there was some insecurity there?
I don’t begrudge anyone the right to change their name however they see fit. I don’t begrudge anyone the right to name their kid however they see fit. But the moment they start giving justifications for it, they are giving me the right to wonder about their motives.
If Amy Jones told me she was changing her name to Keisha X because she wanted to choose something that reflected the subset of American culture that she felt close to, my response would be okay. Same as if Yu Darvish became an American decided he’d like to be called Christopher. Not something I understand on a visceral level, but I wouldn’t think they were racist or ashamed of who they were.
Yes, I’d think Michael’s thought process was a little odd.
Shit, maybe it is, but I have 3 daughters and never once regretted not having a son.
It get’s tiresome as handsome harry points out to be in the first day of a new school, having the teacher call your name, exclaim “why that’s a girls name”, the other kids laugh, and then get bullied and teased about it unmercifully for, well, an eternity. You tell me if that’s a reflection of me being bother by being compared to a girl, or just fucking pissed off about being 8 years old and being dealt a shit hand of cards in life that no 8 year old should have to deal with?
Now that I’ve vented, I’d like your opinion if it sounds like my masculinity is challenged or if it was simply an unintentionally naïve and fucked up thing that my parents inflicted on me? And furthermore if you think that people who make fun of a guy with a girls name are complete jerks or I should deal with it?
I do remember an old thread about a male nurse on the board named Lucy. Wonder if he’s still around
I also don’t tolerate kids in my house making malicious fun of anyone’s name. And oddly enough my daughter Jacqueline happily goes by Jac but not Jackie and certainly not Key and Peele’s Jaykuellen
I wouldn’t do it. It would be a very good way to indicate to the child that I cared about my politics more than I cared about them.
Those societies, like Sikhs, for example, tend to have other gender signifiers from early childhood, like the mini-turban for boys and the difference in surnames indicating whether said person is male or female.
If there is some place where, by long tradition, names are gender neutral and there’s no other sign of gender by surname or clothing then I bet it’s a teeny tiny community where everyone knows everyone else.