Would you turn to the dark side?

I’d probably be light side. I see no benefit to being a dark side user. I don’t go around choking and tazing people IRL, why would I do it if I had that power? And have to be OTT evil? And have to worry about my closest ally killing me all the time? Seems dumb.

Only if there are cookies.

Dooku was definitely a Sith Lord. He adopted the name/title Darth Tyranus (the Sith are nothing if not subtle when coming up with their Sith names; of course, just about anything is better than “Dooku”). He addressed Darth Sidious as “Master Sidious” and Darth Sidious addressed him as “Lord Tyranus”. See this scene from Attack of the Clones.

You’d get arrested IRL.

But to be able to do it briefly then release them from across the room followed by a wink would be useful.

I dunno, when you can wave two fingers and make them say “There will be no charges. You can go home”, I don’t think that’s a problem, do you? :stuck_out_tongue:

Dukes UP!!!

There’s tempted by the dark side, and there’s fallen to the dark side. When you fall it’s a specific moment where there’s a switch to your psyche, and sometimes to your appearance. Every time we’ve seen an on-screen fall (Anakin, Asohka) it wasn’t particularly subtle at all. Changing to the dark side changes you - you automatically become duplicitous and conniving, or rage-filled and sadistic. It’s not that you get lightning powers - Yoda has lightning powers. It’s that you gain the willingness to use lightning on people.

As for Dooku, he left the order and was sort of a freelance light force user for a while - not a Jedi, but still officially a good guy. Then sometime off screen he fell to the dark side and became Darth Tyrannus. He didn’t become too visibly evil at that point, but that was probably because he was the ‘sneaky’ type of sith rather than the ‘rage monster’ type of sith; they come in different flavors.

As I vaguely recall, in one of the Kotor games we meet a ‘grey jedi’ a non-evil ex-jedi who rejects both light and dark. It’s not entirely clear to me how that works relative to the cinematic/television universe’s “a switch has flipped and now you wear black!” system of falling to the dark side, and the game may not be canon - the player himself was on a (very easily toggled) sliding scale.

The jedi were super-willing to do evil in the name of good. Beyond their demonstrated willingness to chop people up with very little provocation, the jedi even discussed executing a coup and taking control of the senate in Ep3!

I wouldn’t turn, but I’d be more the Galadriel type. Start off using the force for good but being slowly corrupted by the power.

Right. At the end, when Yoda comes to understand that the Clone Wars are lost and the Empire is a certainty, he recognizes that the Jedi brought about their own downfall by so eagerly rushing into the war and assuming leadership. That this turned them to hate and anger and undermined everything they believed in.

I think grey Jedi is the way to go. The problem with the Jedi is that they are to unwilling to use their powers where it might make a huge difference. I think the Jedi are probably comparable in ability compared to the Sith, they just aren’t as interested in using those powers. Here’s some examples.

Episode VIII and the way Luke handles the situation with Rey. Had he wanted to he could have not only given Rey a crash course in the ways of the force and lightsaber fighting, but he could have joined her on the way to fight against the First Order. Had he actually been on Crait I think he might have been powerful enough to change the outcome of the fight singlehandedly.

Episodes III. The infamous scene when the Jedi go to arrest Palpatine. Had the Jedi been on top of their game Yoda would have gone with Mace Windu and company with the knowledge that Palpatine was a Sith and have taken him out.

Episode VI. Luke vs. Palpatine. He doesn’t even try to defend himself, seemingly on the theory that merely trying to defend himself against the emperor would have made him turn to the dark side.

It’s the refusal to use their powers in an offensive capacity, even for good, that makes the Jedi weak.

I’ll have to rewatch episode III. I don’t quite remember it that way, but my memories of the prequels could be a little off, since I only watched them once when they came out.

Sorry, that was a Season 6 Clone Wars episode.

Old Luke was suicidally depressed and didn’t want to train anybody, after how it played out the previous time he tried. Young Luke realized that he was being coerced into killing, not the emperor, but Vader - and as I noted, killing somebody in anger (particularly your own father) is how you get your switch flipped and go dark. And as for Ep3, I think the idea was to show us that Palpatine was badass, but it mostly came off as the three jedi who were with Windu being completely incompetent - they got slaughtered in seconds, and then Windu went on to beat Palpatine singlehandedly. (At which point Anakin stepped in and killed him, falling to the dark side in the process.)

In chase scenes, I am the hapless street vendor who gets run over, and two seconds later is seen looking around bewildered at the confusing turn of events. And who doesn’t appear again. :slight_smile:

Really, I do sorely lack hap.

Well, when your parental figures are killed and you’re left with Obi-Wan and Yoda, both of whom freely admit that they’re training you to kill some great evil guy without bothering to tell you directly that he’s your real dad, things might get a little…squiffy.

What do you mean , “turn to”? :wink:

The true Jedi understand the law of unintended consequences and that huge power can lead to huge corruption.

Episode I - In their eagerness to train a promising young force-user, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan set in motion events that have terrible long-term consequences for the Galaxy.

Episode II - In an effort to save his mother, Anakin freaks out at her death and massacres an entire tribe of Tuskens.

Episode III - Anakin’s entire efforts to protect Padme from some prophesized doom sets in motion his transformation to Darth Vader and ultimately her death.

Episode IV - Obi-Wan fails to learn from his lesson with Anakin and does the same thing with Luke.

Episode V - Luke’s efforts to save his friends on Bespin nearly results in getting himself killed.

Episode VI - RoTJ is, I think, the only episode where no one fucked up anything with The Force.

Episode VII - Luke’s efforts to build a Jedi dojo leads to a similar result to Obi-Wan’s.

Episode VIII - We shall see.

Jedi have an astonishingly poor success ratio with regard to training padawans. Regarding the cinematic/TV universe and freely conceding that I’m a season or two behind on Rebels and Freemaker, of the known master/padawan relationships I can think of:

(Er, spoliers!)

Yoda/Qui-gon: Not bad. Qui-gon turned out to be bit of a rebel (enough to disqualify him as a jedi master), but was personally not too evil.

Yoda/Dooku: This didn’t turn out well.

Qui-gon/Obi-wan: This turned out great! Best jedi ever.

Qui-gon/Anakin: This didn’t turn out well - not that he lasted long enough to have a real impact on anything other than the recruitment.

Obi-wan/Anakin: This didn’t turn out well - but you can’t really claim it was his fault.

Obi-wan/Luke: Was Luke even officially Obi-wan’s padawan? In any case Obi-wan gets recruitment credit, and Luke turned out okay, his end-of-life behavior notwithstanding.

Yoda/Luke: Luke, as noted, turned out fine.

Luke/Kylo: Didn’t turn out well.

Luke/Various other murdered padawans: Er…

Luke/Rei: I’m fairly confidence she was never his padawan, but if we count her, then so far so good.

Anakin/Asokha: Turned out good - sure she quit the order, but that turned out to be good for her life expectancy. In any case she didn’t turn evil (in anything I’ve seen, anyway).

Kit Fisto/Nahdar Vebb: Not so great - wasn’t evil, but was reckless and didn’t last long as a full Jedi.

Luminara/Barriss: This didn’t turn out well. (Not as bad as, say, Dooku or Anakin, but still not well.)

Kanan/Ezra: I can’t speak to how this plays out in later episodes, but Ezra seems okay so far.

I’ve certainly missed some, but even taking that into account and speaking generously that’s a barely a 50% success ratio in training padawans. I get that jedi aren’t near as wise as they claim to be, but still.
On the other side of the coin, the Sith do remarkably well with their apprentices - sure, you get around half of the masters eventually being killed by one of their several apprentices, but sith apprentices are supposed to kill their masters. You’d expect sith apprentices to cause a lot more trouble for their masters, but instead they seem to be almost slavishly obedient, even when operating planets away, until they finally eventually maybe decide to try some rebellion - which half the time gets slapped down after which they become slavishly obedient again. It’s almost more than can be credited to mere fear of their masters; it almost seems like the dark side compels slavish obedience until the moment you flip to betrayal or (more probably) get killed while still a loyal servant.

I don’t know about that.

Palpatine/Sidious deliberately sacrificed Dooku for Anakin after grooming Anakin for the role. He seemingly planned for a long time to be rid of Dooku, his apprentice through the Clone Wars.

In the Clone Wars series, Dooku had multiple lesser Sith apprentices. He was ordered to kill Asaj Ventriss, his primary apprentice, when she became too powerful.

In the Rebels series, Vader had the Grand Inquisitor and the other Inquisitors working for him.

So the Sith Rule of Two only seems to apply to Sith Lords. They tolerate and nurture lesser Siths as long as they do not become too powerful (Ventriss) or become rivals (Maul).

This was also his explicit plan regarding Luke. Palpatine sacrificed Dooku in an attempt to trigger Anakin’s fall to the dark side as his replacement (it didn’t work, at least not that time), and attempted to do the same with Vader/Luke. It’s actually one of the things I like best about the prequel trilogy - it sets up rules about falling to the dark side that actually make the end of episode VI make sense - which, let’s face it, it kind of didn’t on its own.

Right - Sith Lords tend to have bunches of apprentices and lesser sith around (there was a whole school planet for them in Kotor: Korriban), and despite it being explicitly stated that sith are supposed to backstab their masters, very few of these minions actually take the leap and attempt klingon promotion. Much less attempt it successfully - I think I’ve only seen that happen once myself, again in the Kotor games (Revan/Malek).

Being a sith lord with apprentices isn’t near as dangerous as you’d think it would be.

I feel obliged to correct, or at least amend, one my earlier statements - in addition to the ‘standard’ way of falling to the dark side by murdering somebody in cold blood, it’s also possible to forcibly turn somebody to the dark side by simply torturing them sufficiently. However this doesn’t seem to be as effective a method - the two instances I know of this being done (Ahsoka, Bastila) both could be reversed with relative ease.