How many people would tune in to the Macy’s Parade if all the floats were manned by stereo speakers instead of celebrities?
It’s not deception, because miming to prerecorded music is perfectly standard as part of public performances such as that which makes up the inaugaration ceremony as a whole, and of which Yo-Yo Ma and Perlman made up one small element. (Would millions have turned out just to watch those guys play?)
Would you be satisfied to attend a stage performance of *Cast Away * and find that it consisted of Tom Hanks sitting silently in a folding chair in front of a movie screen showing Cast Away?
I’m frankly surprised that ascenray is being presented so much grief for his opinion here, and that so many of you blithely accept deception (and it is deception, notwithstanding the sugar-coating) as a matter of course. That the “general public” may be indifferent to something is not, and never has been, for me a reliable indicator of its significance, or lack thereof.
I don’t watch the parade that often, do the celebrities on the floats perform or just stand there and wave?
Not the same thing. Cultural stands and all that.
Also, nobody paid to go see the musicians last Tuesday. Like most instances where lip-syncing is used, they were not the primary portion of the event.
I expect that the things I see that have the markers of genuine events are not faked. If it turns out that something has been faked, I expect there to be consequences for deception.
If my boss comes to my office to speak to me, I assume that she’s actually speaking to me and not mouthing along to a recording of her speaking. If I see the guy who practices his guitar during his lunch break in the lunch room, I assume he’s genuinely playing the guitar and not miming to a recording of himself playing the guitar. If I see Obama making a speech on television, I assume he’s actually speaking on the spot and not miming to himself making a recording.
If I pay for a seat at the Shakespeare Theatre to see a performance of Othello, I expect that the people on the stage are actually performing, not miming to a recording of a performance. Given that Yo-Yo Ma was willing to fake this performance, why should I trust that any live performance of his is genuine? It’s a lot cheaper just to buy Yo-Yo Ma’s records than to get a ticket to see him at the Kennedy Center.
If the government distributes video recording of the U.S. Marines engaging in military action that purports to depict an actual event, I expect that it will be a genuine recording of actual military action and not a video of people dressed as marines just acting as if they’re engaged in a military action. If it came out that it was faked, I would expect there to be disciplinary action.
Any musician would have had the problem (well, excepting one playing a purely digital instrument). Any instrument would have been adversely affected by the temperature and humidity. As for coming up with a way to keep the instruments and/or performers warm, there would have to be something capable of generating a dome of uniform temperature around them. A small space heater would still provide too much of a temperature gradient.
I thought this board was a bastion of skeptics. Why are there so many people operating under the default assumption that everything is the way it seems?
Most years it’s the worst lip-syncing since the Supremes sang Baby Love.
It’s this sort of statement that completely prevents me from taking you seriously.
Did the kids marching in the parade play pre-recorded music?
Did you just skip over the rest of that post?
Do you walk around life assuming that everything around you is a work of deception? That your wife is lying to you about having a job that she goes to every day? That your children are just pretending to like taste of chocolate? That the milk in the carton might have come from squirrels instead of cows? That this country actually has a president named Barack Obama? That the fluid you’re pumping into your car is fuel-grade gasoline? That if you found out that any of this was untrue, that it wouldn’t prompt you to do something about it or expect someone else to?
No. However, (most) people don’t expect marching bands to play with the same level of intonation as a small orchestral quartet. In fact, I’d go so far to say that the style of traditional marching band music differs so vastly from symphonic pieces to the extent that marching band music is more forgiving or poor intonation, tone, and cohesion of the ensemble. I base this off my years and years of experience in both a marching band and a symphonic band.
Nope, hence my statement about cultural norms earlier. You specifically responded to it, so I will take that to mean that you read it and understood it.
There’s a very real difference here between these issues and the music issue in question. Presumably Labrador Deceiver trusts his (hypothetical) wife because he’s known her for years and come to a very intimate, personal understanding of her. He believes that the liquid he pumps into his car is actually fuel-grade gasoline because he’s pumped gas dozens of times and and has years of personal experience to believe that this time the liquid is still gasoline. He believes that the milk in his fridge comes from cows because he’s seen people milk cows. He’s seen pictures of cow’s lined up in stalls producing milk. Scientifically and economically, there’s a very good reason for mass-producing cow milk. He’s never seen anyone milk a squirrel, nor he has ever even see squirrel milk in the most health-nutty of grocery stores.
Why do you automatically assume a performance that “appears” to be live will actually be “live?” Because of the big speakers? Those could just as easily play a recording as they could play live feeds from the performers’ instruments. Do you know the artists? Did you talk to them beforehand to find out whether it would or would not be live? Do you have a rapport with the producers? Did they tell you the show would be live?
And I have rejected your assertion that it is a “cultural norm” unless you can show me that I was the sole viewer deceived or disappointed to learn of the deception.
I’m with the OP.
An announcement should have been made before, or during, the performance. A small scroll on the bottom of the TV feed saying that the music being amplified for the masses was pre-recorded.
My panties remain untwisted over the matter, however. But the OP has a valid point IMHO.
There are just as many good reasons to support this assumption as the others: For example, I have actually seen people play instruments and sing without miming to a recording, I have attended performances where the audience behaved as if the performance was real, I have observed people’s enthusiasm for viewing a “live” performance as opposed to a recorded one, I have seen promotions for live musical events in which the live-ness of the event was emphasized as a selling point, because I have read or listened to interviews of performers who describe their experiences performing live, because during those performances, I see people moving and behaving as if they are genuinely playing the music live.
Perhaps I am still at heart a wide-eyed innocent, but yes, I expect not to be lied to, deceived, or defrauded in my daily life. While remaining vigilant and aware that such dishonesty does occur, I don’t cast my life around the fundamental maxim that everything I am told, sold, given, or shown is bullshit. This argument, and the “cultural norms” rationale, and the notion that expecting consequences for fraud is so ridiculous as to completely discredit someone who suggests it, might ring true if I were raised by a band of thieves. As it happens, I was not.
Not only do I find the apologetics here completely bizarre, I wonder what level of dishonesty you’d be willing to accept in other areas of your life. Sold a lemon car by a neighbor? Lost your stock investment to a pump-and-dump scheme? Kid plaigiarized a book report word-for-word? Spouse cheating on you with your best friend? Any of these cause a ripple?
I don’t think it’s a cultural norm. It may well be an industry norm, however. Just like in television interviews they edit the hell out of the interview which may or may not have an impact on how the interviewee comes across, or magazine photos get retouched (which was a lot less well-known before Photoshop). Stuff happens behind the scene to present a flawless show to the audience. Folks outside the industry don’t know about it, and because the performance looked good they have no reason to question it.
It’s really no different than using makeup on an actor. The actor’s face still comes through, but without the makeup it wouldn’t be nearly as photogenic. The makeup/recording works to idealize the visual/audio experience. I’m sure more than a few people have been just as disappointed seeing a picture of their favorite actor without makeup than have been disappointed at learning President Ma used a recording, even though it’s of his own work.
ETA: For the record, I think I would feel cheated if I learned that a live performance I saw was a recording, too. It’s the nature of the beast, and the reasons (such as in President Ma’s case) can be understandable, but that doesn’t mean I have to like it.
I’ll grant that there are some good reasons to presume that what appears to be a live performance is actually live, many of which have you named. However, my original point still stands. Namely, Yo-Yo Ma had very good reasons for not performing live, the media were informed of this possibility in advance, and the world didn’t end because a recording was played.
I’m afraid you might be mis-characterizing my position here. Call me a cynic, but I expect a certain amount of dishonesty in most things in life, if only to the extent that it “greases the social cogs”, if you will. Having said that, I most certainly do not accept deception if it affects me materially or emotionally. I would most certainly not tolerate being sold a lemon car. I would be outraged if I were scammed into a ponzi stock investment scheme. Similarly, I would be thunderstruck if my (hypothetical) spouse cheated.
However, there are key differences between these scenarios and this Yo-Yo Ma one. As I said, I don’t accept dishonesty if it affects me materially or emotionally. I had no financial investment in this musical performance. I didn’t lose any money whatsoever because they played a recording. Second, I couldn’t care less whether or the thing was recorded or truly live. In short, I tolerate the deception in this case because I just don’t give a damn.