Sometimes a rant is just a rant

[Esprix]

If someone comes into the Pit and blows off steam about something, is it required that everything s/he says be dissected and challenged? Or can they be allowed to simply vent a little, get it out of their system, enjoy a few "Hell yeahs!" and move on?

I've noticed a trend lately that unless you post the most innocuous rant (which in and of themselves get the oft-quoted "Lamest. Rant. Ever." responses), the OP gets their ass handed to them for something they write in their rant, even when it's obvious the person is having a bad day, things have built up to a full head of steam, and they just need to bitch for a minute, regardless of their true attitudes or feelings.

Are we no longer entitled to that?

That would be sad.



(That's me looking sad.)

In all honesty, I just want to discuss the idea.

Esprix, fully expecting to be taken to task for posting this, as someone out there will find it painfully witty

[d_redguy]

You are absolutely correct.




Didn't see that one comin', didja?

[Gorgon Heap]

For once, Esprix I am right here to back you up.

However, you might take into account the fact that the Pit is being somewhat overused these days. When 100 people a day post rather lame rants on normal things that pretty much anybody will rub into, you become a little desensitized.

It may not be right, but hey.

And you don't see me starting new Pit threads all the time!

No sir-ree!

Only one or two. Ever.



That I can remember.





Oh yeah, forgot to mention:


Screw you Esprix! Get a fucking clue! You're not the boss of us!

[Esprix]

Oh, and before anyone says it (and I know they will), yes, I fully admit I've done it before myself.

Esprix

[Bippy the Beardless]

I agree to much of this, I thought FK's 'Fuck you all' pit thread was closed unnecessarily it was clear he/she was having a bad day and just wanted to burn off steam, and it made a challenge of trying to create humor to lighten his/her day.

Oh an Esprix that was the "Lamest. Rant. Ever."

[d_redguy]

Originally posted by Esprix
Oh, and before anyone says it (and I know they will), yes, I fully admit I've done it before myself.

Esprix

Hmm. Well, we'll stone you next week. Though your sin is grevious, these 2 guys made this Christian pr0n website and...well...they've got priority.

Anyhoo, the fact that you acknowledge that you've done this in the past and are ranting about it now will just serve to make you more aware of pissing on someone's rant in the future, IMHO.

Good on ya.

[A Monkey With a Gun]

Originally posted by Esprix
Or can they be allowed to simply vent a little, get it out of their system, enjoy a few "Hell yeahs!" and move on?

In all honesty, no. This is a mesage board that specializes in finding the underlying truths in whatever the subject is at hand and so we discuss everything, ranging from chemical reactions to geopolitics to words ending in "-gry". If someone posts a rant about their neighbor's loud pet duck, this wouldn't be the SDMB if there wasn't at least some discussion on the myth that a duck's quack doesn't echo. Besides, it would be pretty boring if all we did was sit around and agree with each other.

[macabresoul]

I so totally agree with you here. It seems anyone who rants these days gets critiqued on all the ways thier rant doesn't meet the neccisary criteria of a proper rant. It usually ends in flame wars (I know my first rant did), and in the end nothing is solved except the poor ranter is probably even more pissed off about the situation.

Haha about the christian porn website, yes i do believe they get first dibs on the stone I shalt cast at thier arses.

[Polycarp]

Originally posted by A Monkey With a Gun
In all honesty, no. This is a mesage board that specializes in finding the underlying truths in whatever the subject is at hand and so we discuss everything, ranging from chemical reactions to geopolitics to words ending in "-gry". If someone posts a rant about their neighbor's loud pet duck, this wouldn't be the SDMB if there wasn't at least some discussion on the myth that a duck's quack doesn't echo. Besides, it would be pretty boring if all we did was sit around and agree with each other.

I disagree!!!

[lezlers]

I feel you Esprix.

I've wanted to post some rants here over the past couple of months but I never went through with it b/c they were sensitive topics and I didn't think I could handle some fuck head picking it apart just for the sake of picking it apart.

That's not right.

[hajario]

If you don't want responses and discussion, put it in your Live Journal. The whole point of message boards, in my opinion, is for discussion of issues. Here in the Pit, we get to be a little more rude about it and use more colorful language. If you must post it here, and you really don't want discussion, preface the rant with a statement that you're just blowing off steam and you need to vent. How are we supposed to tell if someone wants to argue or if they're only venting?

Haj

[Guinastasia]

Well, I think it depends on the rant and the comments, naturally.

Is there anything particular you're referring to, Esprix?

[Doomtrain]

It's just not a Pit thread if someone doesn't overuse the rolleyes smiley.

[Flamsterette_X]

Originally posted by hajario
If you don't want responses and discussion, put it in your Live Journal.

Yes, put it in your Live Journal and disable comments to that particular entry. Otherwise, people just might comment on it when you don't want them to.

Or, even better.. create a blog without a comment utility (like SPOZ's and mine).. then you'll definitely not get any comments or discussion.

Either of those would work.. or just put it in your offline journals (my affectionate nickname for the one I have is "the eternal update").. that'll definitely work. (unless, of course, it gets into the wrong hands..)

F_X

[Miller]

Frankly, I like it the way it is. Keeps you on your toes.

[Flamsterette_X]

Originally posted by hajario
If you don't want responses and discussion, put it in your Live Journal.

Yes, put it in your Live Journal and disable comments to that particular entry. Otherwise, people just might comment on it when you don't want them to.

Or, even better.. create a blog without a comment utility (like SPOZ's and mine).. then you'll definitely not get any comments or discussion.

Either of those would work.. or just put it in your offline journals (my affectionate nickname for the one I have is "the eternal update").. that'll definitely work. (unless, of course, it gets into the wrong hands..)

F_X

[Esprix]

Originally posted by hajario

If you must post it here, and you really don't want discussion, preface the rant with a statement that you're just blowing off steam and you need to vent. How are we supposed to tell if someone wants to argue or if they're only venting?

Doesn't work. Seems disclaimers never do around here anymore.

Esprix

[samarm]

I like it the way it is. So what if people pick your rant apart - its all part of the pit experience. Better this way than to have (for example) a stupid/ignorant OP go unchallenged simply because its a rant.

Not talking about your OP, btw Esprix! In fact your OP is a good example of why argument and discussion is healthy.

[Happy Lendervedder]

Originally posted by Miller
Frankly, I like it the way it is. Keeps you on your toes.

I agree. If everytime something pissed someone off, they posted about it "just to blow off steam," this place would be overrun with "I hate my boss" or "ARRRGH! My girlfriend!" threads (not that we don't have a plethora of those types already).

I like this place for the same reason it frustrates me: everyone is held accountable for everything they say. The Pit is no exception to that rule.



Happy

[masonite]

Originally posted by lezlers
I feel you Esprix.

Esprix, I agree with you too. I get tired of there being some sort of "entertaining" standard in the Pit, as though the OPs have to please the masses, or else get dissed.

If I post something completely lame in most other forums, it will likely be ignored. But in the Pit I'll be told what a waste of time it was for me to post it, or that my rant rated 0-point-something on somebody's scale. Whatever. If people are not entertained, it's not my problem.

actually I'm too timid to post many Pit OPs at all.

[hyperjes]

Well, Esprix, I also agree.

And I tend to be somewhat disagreeable.

*wanders off to re-evaluate personality....*

[samarm]

To those who agree with Esprix: In a perfect world, I would agree with you too. In reality though, how do you know which pit threads are just blowing off steam and which ones aren't? Also, what if a rant is so full of ignorance that it begs for people to rip it apart?

[BadBaby]

I have a tendency to be too agreeable. Sometimes I'll read someone's rant and just nod my head, heart breaking that their life isn't as they'd like it. Then another poster will come along and knock them upside the head with the common-sense stick. Thank goodness for the SDMB, y'all are helping me become a first class 'meany.'

On the other hand, you have a point Esprix, sometimes a person will be the target of a vicious pile-on and-- okay, so I have a way to go before I'm no longer a push-over.

[dantheman]

Originally posted by Happy Lendervedder
I agree. If everytime something pissed someone off, they posted about it "just to blow off steam," this place would be overrun with "I hate my boss" or "ARRRGH! My girlfriend!" threads (not that we don't have a plethora of those types already).

I like this place for the same reason it frustrates me: everyone is held accountable for everything they say. The Pit is no exception to that rule.



Happy

That's not what Esprix means, I don't think. He means when the responses are along the lines of "your rant sucks" instead of basically attacking the nature of the rant itself. There's nothing at all wrong with people blowing off steam, but to have it all ripped up by a simple "lamest rant ever" post isn't in the spirit of the forum. It comes off snarky and condescending. To put it another way, you can rip into the OP for what they're ranting about ("I can't believe you don't think handicapped people should vote! Why I oughta . . ."), but it's silly and trite to simply give a curt, shrill response that neither supports the OP nor refutes the OP but simply exists to be pissy.

[samarm]

Looks like dantheman has nailed the essence of what Esprix is talking about.

I've changed my plea to "I agree"!

[dantheman]

If I did, that would be the first time I nailed down anything anyone ever said. Always a first time, though.

[Happy Lendervedder]

Originally posted by dantheman

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Happy Lendervedder
I agree. If everytime something pissed someone off, they posted about it "just to blow off steam," this place would be overrun with "I hate my boss" or "ARRRGH! My girlfriend!" threads (not that we don't have a plethora of those types already).

I like this place for the same reason it frustrates me: everyone is held accountable for everything they say. The Pit is no exception to that rule.



Happy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That's not what Esprix means, I don't think. He means when the responses are along the lines of "your rant sucks" instead of basically attacking the nature of the rant itself. There's nothing at all wrong with people blowing off steam, but to have it all ripped up by a simple "lamest rant ever" post isn't in the spirit of the forum. It comes off snarky and condescending. To put it another way, you can rip into the OP for what they're ranting about ("I can't believe you don't think handicapped people should vote! Why I oughta . . ."), but it's silly and trite to simply give a curt, shrill response that neither supports the OP nor refutes the OP but simply exists to be pissy.

Ahh, then I agree.

[Fuji Kitakyusho]

I posted the "Fuck you all." OP in part because I was having a bad day, and in part because I could have otherwise written about 50 specifically directed pittings, which, while perhaps more in line with the moderators' view of what a pitting should look like, were commonly indicative of human nature in general. "Fuck you all." was an attempt to save bandwidth by summing up those 20 potential pages into an all-encompassing OP that would not be unnecessarily long for the inquisitive reader. Thanks to the moderator that closed the thread for prohibiting even that attempt at venting a little steam. That is exactly the sort of action that would have made you number 51 in the unabridged version.

-FK

[lezlers]

[minor hijack] I wasn't talking about people disagreeing with the OP because they genuinely disagreed, I was talking about people that disagreed with the OP for the sheer purpose of disagreeing with something. You know, the types that will argue that the sky is red if you say it's blue? You know, like when someone's pissed because they tripped over a shoe or something someone left in a parking lot and someone just has to respond with an "well, you should look where you're walking dumbfuck" or something equally useless?[minor hijack over]

[hajario]

Originally posted by samarm
Looks like dantheman has nailed the essence of what Esprix is talking about.

I've changed my plea to "I agree"!

If that's what Esprix meant, then I agree now too. The rant rating thing is a waste of electrons.

Haj

[Esprix]

Well I'll agree with what dantheman said, but I also meant other things that are slightly more serious than, "Your rant sucks."

I WILL USE THE FOLLOWING AS AN EXAMPLE, AND AS AN EXAMPLE ONLY - PLEASE DO NOT LET THIS BECOME THE VERY THING I WISH TO DISCUSS. THIS DID NOT ACTUALLY HAPPEN.

Sometimes, straight people get on my nerves. Yes, all of them, when I feel like the world is against me. If my life is bad, if crappy things are happening to me, if my relationship is on the skids, if work is driving me insane, and I'm just in a cranky mood, and the straw that broke the camel's back is my co-worker who insisted on shoving her wedding photos in my face and was bubbling over with joy, then guess what? I'm gonna want to let off some steam. And in that venting, I may start a tirade against straight people and their fucking weddings and their patriarchal heirarchies and their demeaning of women and society's attitudes towards gay weddings and how unfair it all is and I just want to punch my boss's lights out and set this woman on fire and blow up my building and and and...

You get the idea.

Do I hate all straight people, all the time? No. Or my boss? Or this woman? Or society? No, probably not. But in that particular moment, when life is at a very, very low point, I just want to vent, rage at the machine, let it all out. I also want to hear some people agree with me, and validate my feelings. (No, the SDMB isn't a replacement for therapy, but it still counts as social interaction.) The next day - hell, the next hour - I will be back to normal.

So, basically, am I allowed a moment of anger, passion, or blood-boiling frustration - that will pass once I've vented - or must I suffer through everyone picking apart my post and calling me a straight-hating, man-hating, marital-status-discriminating, authority-bucking, society-bashing bigotted asshat?

Feel free to replace "I" with "anyone" to make it more universal.

Esprix

[CalvinHobbes]

Oh and whatever you do, when you're angry at the moment and venting about whomever, do not use the 'F' word... <whisper> fat! Otherwise, suddenly you'll become the most vile person to draw breath and will be beaten black and blue.

[Trion]

Originally posted by Esprix

So, basically, am I allowed a moment of anger, passion, or blood-boiling frustration - that will pass once I've vented - or must I suffer through everyone picking apart my post and calling me a straight-hating, man-hating, marital-status-discriminating, authority-bucking, society-bashing bigotted asshat?

I dunno. Tough call.

On the one hand I can fully support the idea that people might want to blow off a little steam. On the other hand, the question becomes: "Are we letting a statement based on baser emotions that is ultimately ignorant remain unchallenged? Ya know, just sitting there. On a board devoted to fighting such things."

I dunno.

[Miller]

Well, Esprix, I'd say that's precisely the sort of thing you shouldn't be ranting about in the Pit. Like others have said, that's something you vent about in a private journal or to like-minded friends. It's not the sort of thing you say to a roomfull of random strangers. Which is what The Pit is, postcounts not withstanding. You don't blow off steam about straight people bragging about their weddings in a setting where straight people who brag about weddings are likely to hear: not unless you want a fight. Because whatever it is you're venting about, sure as shit someone who does that themselves is going to read it and take offence. So either target vices that no one is ever going to admit to (murder, pedophelia, telemarketing), or be prepared to defend your rant. If you just want validation, that's what you have friends for. Get a bunch of your buddies together for beers and bitch about that breeder cunt. They're your friends, they'll understand that you're just frustrated, because they know you. I don't mean this to sound harsh, but we're not you're friends: we're just a collection of vaguely interested strangers. We don't know you, and we don't know you're just frustrated. You might, in fact, be a "straight-hating, man-hating, marital-status-discriminating, authority-bucking, society-bashing bigotted asshat."

[3trew]

I see your point, Esprix, and I agree with it by and large. I think, though, the fact that the pit is also open for you to come back an hour or so later, when you are back to normal, sort of saves the enterprise.

You have ranted, and having ranted can move on. In a more reflective mood, you will be able to learn what people who don't share your (temporary) opinion think. You will be able to enjoy the wit that is scattered within the vitriol, and if nothing else you'll be able to construct a better rant next time based on what happened to that one.

It also serves as a kind of natural selection. There are many posters here who have pitted, and been pitted, for years. They are, whether one agrees with them or not, usually worth reading. There are also a number of posters who have arrived, visited the pit, and shortly thereafter transgressed the boundaries to the point where they were banned. This may be viewed as a good or bad thing, but you have to admire the elegance of the mechanism.

I like knowing that if I post a pit thread I may see my OP torn to little tiny pieces. If the opinion can't stand up to the scrutiny, it wasn't worth having anyway.

[Drastic]

To echo others--no, you cannot realistically expect to be able to "just vent." Posting is a free and deliberate choice to speak in front of potentially thousands of listeners. Many or most of those listeners are every bit as much of emotional beings as the speaker, with the same needs to "just vent". Quite possibly, they just need to vent about how you chose to just vent.

Personally, I've found it an initially bitter, but ultimately calming realization that demanding human nature be changed because the warts of it make me uncomfortable is a hopeless errand.

Mind you, I also think that the idea that venting-catharsis is a helpful and good thing is pretty much a crock--I don't think that's distorting my view here, but it might well be.

[j.c.]

Esprix qualifies the rant though, by saying that sometimes straight people get on Esprix's delicate nerves, and why.

If someone posted a rant with real moral outrage about straight people, I'd ... well, I'd proably not bother. The point is if someone is going on and on about some horrible person or workplace, and the facts in the story don't exactly point to the ranter as a victim, I'm might call bs on that - or at least ask some pointed questions.

You know: "my boyfriend still hasn't forgiven me for sleeping around all those times, my mom still doesn't trust me even though I haven't stolen any of her credit cards for at least a week, and my boss expects me to show up for work every single day... poor poor me."

[Michael Ellis]

You must remember this,
a kvetch is still a kvetch,
a rant is still a rant,
the fun-da-men-tal things survive,
as flames go by.


_{Yes, I know it doesn't really rhyme. Shut up.}

[dantheman]

Originally posted by j.c.
If someone posted a rant with real moral outrage about straight people, I'd ... well, I'd proably not bother. The point is if someone is going on and on about some horrible person or workplace, and the facts in the story don't exactly point to the ranter as a victim, I'm might call bs on that - or at least ask some pointed questions.

You know: "my boyfriend still hasn't forgiven me for sleeping around all those times, my mom still doesn't trust me even though I haven't stolen any of her credit cards for at least a week, and my boss expects me to show up for work every single day... poor poor me."

There's actually a place for the milder rants - MPSIMS. If you can get worked up enough to use a bit of profanity, then the Pit is the right place, but if you just want to talk about how you had a crummy day at work, MPSIMS is the right place. In MPSIMS, people won't rip you apart, so you can feel safe in posting. And, as an added bonus, you're much more likely to get sympathy.

In fact, all too often we see people put minor rants in the Pit and then throw in profanity at the end just because they somehow feel obligated to do so: "And since this is the Pit, fuck you all." If the OP didn't need profanity in the first place, it's more likely that it could have been put in MPSIMS.

[xenophon41]

In the example rant (e.g. "Straight People Sometimes GET ON MY NERVES!!"), no SDMB posters or publically known figures were used as examples of a "type" specifically being ranted against. So it would be easy to ignore the coworker's-wedding-picture example, and respond with sympathy and understanding to your general irritation with "straight" society preconceptions and conceits. However, in the hypothetical instance where an OP is unyieldingly condemnatory of actual board coacquaintances, one might reasonably expect those examples to be dealt with critically.

JMO

[Jonathan Chance]

Hey, Esprix! Have a cigar!

Seriously, I think anything posted in a public forum is ground for dissection and discussion. Simply introducing it into the debate makes it fair game.

I realize that people might want to vent steam but is it really proper to do so?

In your example (which in no way should be used to attack anyone)(and I better not see it pop up six months from now quoted out of context to prove that Esprix hates straights, get me?) I think if I'd posted that (or something like it) I would later be ashamed of myself for doing so. Better by far to realize that it's not an issue worth getting worked up about and move on.

[Aries28]

I agree with the OP for the most part.

If there is a thread that I disagree with then I will post my opinions. If I agree then I will post my opinions.

However, if someone has an opinion different from mine I want to hear their specific arguements as to WHY. I don't want to hear how I'm an idiot or since I'm Southern I must be white trash or since I hold to some religious principles I must hate anybody different than me, etc. Tell me why you agree or disagree with me.

I know it's the Pit and all, but does everything have to result in a "me against you" trying to insult each other the most thing if we don't agree?

I have read many threads where I originally didn't agree but after the poster gave their arguements or other people weighed in I actually could see the OP's point.

I'm much more open to hearing someone else's opinion if they give valid arguements and don't resort to insulting me, my family, my dog, my mother, my spelling, my grammar, etc.

Just my $0.02.

[Fin_man]

Aries28, I agree with you 100%. I think people post their rants for commiseration. However, as you say, once given other opinions/points of view, the OP can then see things a different way and maybe "understand" why what happened happened.

Enough of this bullshit "me against you". I would like to think "If you don't have anything beneficial to add, don't post." But of course, that's not going to happen.

And before anybody else can do it...
This is the lamest post ever.

[elf6c]

Too many people are confusing MPSIMS with the PIT. Also, many of those blowback Pittings are richly deserved.

Want to rant without feedback, both positive and negative alike-- get some livejournal code.

You want comiseration and a few "ah poor baby" and lots of hugging and such then post in a forum other then the Pit.

Post a stupid Rant, get made fun of- that's how it should work. Since when did we declare a truce on stupidity?

Since GMRyujin beat me to the smiley abuse, I guess I will have to abuse the size and color functions to cover the required cliche bases:

Bad Rants Make Hulk Smash !

[dropzone]

Originally posted by Esprix
Sometimes, straight people get on my nerves.

I just KNEW this was going to be another of your breeder-bashing, one-trick-pony rants!





Just ribbing you, kid. I agree with you, even your "example rant." (Goddamn wedding and baby showers! Giving details of giving birth that I'd happily live without knowing! Making me pretend every antic of your inbred spawn is "cute" or that I give two shits about your relationship with your juvenile delinquent teen because I have to work with you!)

I'll admit that I'm not the sort to rant publicly without expecting (hoping for) discussion and disagreement, especially since I generally disagree with everything I say, but I can see why some people would like to use the Pit to blow off some steam. And not everybody has a live journal to do it in, and a single rant is hardly worth starting an LJ over.

[TaxGuy]

Anyone who's paid attention to Exprix's recent pit threads will know exactly what the OP in this thread is really getting at: "I don't want anyone to challenge my POV on an issue when I'm ranting about something."

I call bullshit on that. If you take one little incident and proceed to pit all straight people over it, then I'm gonna take you to task, and (to use your phraseology), you shouldn't be surprised about it.

You know, I've never ever ever seen a straight person on the SDMB pit all gay people because of the actions of one or a few of them. If someone did do that, they'd at least get piled-on, maybe banned.

As others have said, if you don't want any comments on your point of view, then get a Livejournal. I for one will continue to tell you to stuff it when you say all straight people suck just because a particular straight person did something to get on your delicate nerves.

[Waverly]

Originally posted by Esprix
Are we no longer entitled to that?

That would be sad.



(That's me looking sad.)

Depends. Occasionally people are ranting and feeling sorry for themselves based on a mischaracterization of the situation, outright falsehoods, or no reason whatsoever. If you want to supply links and discuss specific threads, we can do that, but I can't agree to just nod in agreement with every gripe that pops up.

[Esprix]

Originally posted by Miller

Well, Esprix, I'd say that's precisely the sort of thing you shouldn't be ranting about in the Pit. Like others have said, that's something you vent about in a private journal or to like-minded friends. It's not the sort of thing you say to a roomfull of random strangers. Which is what The Pit is, postcounts not withstanding. You don't blow off steam about straight people bragging about their weddings in a setting where straight people who brag about weddings are likely to hear: not unless you want a fight. Because whatever it is you're venting about, sure as shit someone who does that themselves is going to read it and take offence. So either target vices that no one is ever going to admit to (murder, pedophelia, telemarketing), or be prepared to defend your rant. If you just want validation, that's what you have friends for. Get a bunch of your buddies together for beers and bitch about that breeder cunt. They're your friends, they'll understand that you're just frustrated, because they know you. I don't mean this to sound harsh, but we're not you're friends: we're just a collection of vaguely interested strangers. We don't know you, and we don't know you're just frustrated. You might, in fact, be a "straight-hating, man-hating, marital-status-discriminating, authority-bucking, society-bashing bigotted asshat."

Good points, all. Thanks for your input.

Originally posted by j.c.

Esprix qualifies the rant though, by saying that sometimes straight people get on Esprix's delicate nerves, and why.

Unfortunately, even when you qualify, people ignore it and/or it doesn't help.

Here's a question - what if you post something questionable, come back the next day and say, "Hey, folks, I apologize. I was just venting steam. I really don't think that AT ALL and it came out wrong, and it was said in anger/frustration." Can that be accepted, or will this forever besmirch them as "we finally saw what you really feel?"

Michael Ellis, I hate you, you clever twit.

And for the record, I have a LiveJournal and use it regularly. I enjoy, however, venting to a much larger audience and getting helpful, supportive feedback here.

Another point - AFAIK, you can't swear up a storm in MPSIMS like you can in The Pit, so that's why a lot of mundane pointless rants end up there.

Oh, and leave it to my new bestest buddy TaxGuy to pop in and be a dick. You rock, buddy! But no, I'm not going out on a date with you, so stop hounding me, you big lug!

Esprix

[dantheman]

Originally posted by Esprix

Here's a question - what if you post something questionable, come back the next day and say, "Hey, folks, I apologize. I was just venting steam. I really don't think that AT ALL and it came out wrong, and it was said in anger/frustration." Can that be accepted, or will this forever besmirch them as "we finally saw what you really feel?"

I would tend to think it would be perfectly acceptable, Esprix. In fact, many of us have done so and have been met with a fairly comforting response. It does depend, however, on where you post your apology. If you post it in the Pit, you will always get some people who don't take you at your word and who will throw your earlier thread up in your face. If you post it in MPSIMS (which is probably where it ought to be), you will most likely be received rather warmly. I'd think people would gain respect for you for having begun that apology thread.

And of course it also depends on how nasty your original thread became (by "you," of course, I mean "anyone," not Esprix). If you had this long, drawn-out thread in which you insulted everyone over and over, people might be loath to accept any apology and would be hesitant to believe you're sincere.