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Old 07-23-2004, 01:30 AM
PaulFitzroy PaulFitzroy is offline
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Why do so many Pentecostal women look like this?

First off: I realize I'm treading on dangerous ground here, so this can go straight to the Pit if anyone feels it neccessary.

Secondly, I don't know if Pentecostals are even heard of outside the Midwest. Another big risk is nobody here knowing what I'm talking about. But I hope you do. And if not, I'd like to hear from any Midwesterners here.

Alright: My state, Indiana, is full of Pentecostals (a Christian sect, where the women wear long hair and long skirts all the time. The guys look the same as anyone else.) I don't know why they are required to wear the hair and the skirt, and I don't care, because that's not what I started this thread to find out.

I started this thread to find out why they all seem to weigh upwards of 300 pounds. Almost all of them are big, built like barns, and extremely homely (and I don't just mean lack of makeup and jewelry-I mean flat out unattractive.) I know this is a generalization....but, errr, not really. Anyone who sees these people on a regular basis as I do will know what I mean about the appearance.

So:

Is there some kind of Pentecostal diet that consists of a lot of extremely fattening foods, causing all the women to have this build?

Are there genes in the Pentecostal families that are widely shared and that result in the homely looks and the large, rotund bodies?

I'll point out that I have been friends with several Pentecostal guys over the years, and none of them are what I'd call unattractive...they are all normal looking, and here's the thing: almost NONE of them have been fat. In fact they are often lean from working on the farms (many of the Pentecostals are farmers, though not all. Those that aren't can get summer work on farms of friends' families.) I guess that might explain the weight, but certainly not the looks.

What's the deal, Dopers? Am I just a lookist snob with too-high standards, or am I on to something here?
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  #2  
Old 07-23-2004, 01:58 AM
Dog80 Dog80 is online now
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I don't think it has to do with their religion. A bad batch maybe?
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Old 07-23-2004, 02:15 AM
FriarTed FriarTed is offline
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I live in SE Indiana, & know enough Pentecostals to know that there are a significant amount of Penty women who aren't huge- tho I've also seen enough who do fit the OP. *L*

I think it has to do with the "Holiness" culture- perhaps the men are outside working hard & burn it off while the women stay inside, also working hard, but doing a lot of cooking, and tasting, and eating *L*; also let's face it, there's not a lot of other things they are allowed to indulge in. And those foods are usually high in fat & starch.

I also wonder if perhaps a religion which emphasises NOT dolling oneself up may attract/retain homely women. Just a total guess there.

Now to be totally pervy- when an attractive woman, be she Pentecostal, Holiness, Mennonite or similar, has that whole clean-scrubbed no-makeup, long dress, long-hair-done-up look, she can be really hot. The attractiveness along with the purity/taboo/"don't touch" look can be a powerful combination.
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Old 07-23-2004, 02:21 AM
CrazyCatLady CrazyCatLady is offline
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My best friend from high school is Pentecostal (well, was raised Pentecostal and sometimes attends church with her family, at any rate), and near as I can tell, Pentecostal women are fat and homely in about the same proportion the American female population is fat and homely. My friend, her mother, and her sister weigh maybe 110 each, and that's if you hose all that hair down. They are also remarkably attractive women. (Courty is one of those women that if she weren't such a wonderful person, I'd hate her guts. Gorgeous hair, perfect skin, beautiful eyes, naturally straight teeth, wonderful bone structure, fabulous figure, effortless sense of style...it's disgusting, I tell you.)

I've been to church with them a few times, and clothing and hairdressing issues aside, they look remarkably like any other congregation I've ever seen. Some short, some tall, some fat, some thin, some pretty, some not-so-pretty, some stylish, some frumpy. Just an ordinary collection of folks, really.

I think the issue is partly one of selective perception. You don't notice the ordinary-looking Pentecostal women because they're, well, ordinary-looking and don't draw attention. It's the very obese ones you notice, so you've got a preconceived notion of Pentecostal women as fat and homely. Because of that, you're less likely to realize that the very attractive young woman with the long hair and the skirt and heels is also a Pentecostal woman.

The other part of it is that I think very few men realize just how different most women look without makeup. Look at a picture of your favorite supermodel without makeup sometime--most of them are very ordinary, and some of them are flat-out homely.

And I know you didn't want the information, but I'll share with you anyway: the long hair is because of a bit of scripture that talks about a woman's hair being her crowning glory, and something I was never real clear on about cut hair being the sign of a harlot. They wear skirts and dresses because of Biblical admonitions against women dressing like men, thus no pants. They eschew makeup and jewelry because of Biblical admonitions against "vain adornment."
  #5  
Old 07-23-2004, 02:45 AM
tygerbryght tygerbryght is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulFitzroy
...
I started this thread to find out why they all seem to weigh upwards of 300 pounds. Almost all of them are big, built like barns, and extremely homely (and I don't just mean lack of makeup and jewelry-I mean flat out unattractive.) I know this is a generalization....but, errr, not really. Anyone who sees these people on a regular basis as I do will know what I mean about the appearance.

So:

Is there some kind of Pentecostal diet that consists of a lot of extremely fattening foods, causing all the women to have this build?

Are there genes in the Pentecostal families that are widely shared and that result in the homely looks and the large, rotund bodies?
Hokay. There are two reasons for the apparent dichotomy.

First, Pentecostals (of the type you describe) do not have much in the way of recreation except for going to church ... and eating. Many still obey the no TV rule, definitely no movies (though some went to see the Passion movie), and under no circumstances, dancing. No swimming, unless it's in a (gender) segregated venue. And the women aren't allowed to participate in sports where they'd have to wear revealing attire. Are you getting the picture? The women's only physical activity is cooking, which is less demanding than it used to be, unless they're growing the veggies and fruits themselves and doing it all, from cleaning and washing up through putting it into the serving dishes.

However, I don't think the percentage of Pentecostal women who are overweight is that much greater than for other women of comparable age and activity levels. It's just that they are the ones who are the most noticeable.

BTW, the reason they look so ugly to you is the lack of makeup and the hairstyles (not permitted to cut their hair) ...

Quote:
1Corinthians 11:6 A woman should wear something on her head. It is a disgrace for a woman to shave her head or cut her hair. But if she refuses to wear something on her head, let her cut off her hair. (Contemporary English Version)
and, coloring and perms are also out, as preached by (male) ministers. Cosmetics make a vastly larger difference in the appearance of a woman than you might otherwise think.

There are lots of Pentecostal women who are not overweight, even here in Mississippi, which is statistically the most overweight state. The thing is, they're just not as noticeable. The slender Pentecostal women aren't as obvious-looking, because long skirts are fashionable. Unless the nearby churches are anomalous, if you visited one of them, you'd see some thin Pentecostal women (and not just the young ones). And probably find that the young ones aren't either as obvious, or quite as homely, as you had supposed.

And Pentecostals are found in most parts of the world. Here's a link that offers a search for church locations across North America.
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Old 07-23-2004, 03:12 AM
PaulFitzroy PaulFitzroy is offline
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I disagree with the idea that someone would notice only the unattractive ones because the normal-looking ones wouldn't stand out. At least that's not the case in my situation. The only time I've ever seen an attractive Pentecostal girl around my age, she REALLY stood out, because I was so shocked to have finally seen a decent-looking Pentecostal girl!

Believe me, the better-looking ones would stand out given the ones I'm used to seeing. I know I live in a fat part of a fat country, but there does seem to be a disproportionate number of fat women in that demographic.
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Old 07-23-2004, 03:26 AM
tygerbryght tygerbryght is offline
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Originally Posted by CrazyCatLady
...
something I was never real clear on about cut hair being the sign of a harlot. ...
Allow me:

Do you recall the part in Acts where St. Paul & company stayed in "Asia"?

Quote:
Act 19:23-41 And the same time there arose no small stir about that way. For a certain man named Demetrius, a silversmith, which made silver shrines for Diana, brought no small gain unto the craftsmen; Whom he called together with the workmen of like occupation, and said, Sirs, ye know that by this craft we have our wealth. Moreover ye see and hear, that not alone at Ephesus, but almost throughout all Asia, this Paul hath persuaded and turned away much people, saying that they be no gods, which are made with hands: So that not only this our craft is in danger to be set at nought; but also that the temple of the great goddess Diana should be despised, and her magnificence should be destroyed, whom all Asia and the world worshippeth. And when they heard these sayings, they were full of wrath, and cried out, saying, Great is Diana of the Ephesians. And the whole city was filled with confusion: and having caught Gaius and Aristarchus, men of Macedonia, Paul's companions in travel, they rushed with one accord into the theatre. And when Paul would have entered in unto the people, the disciples suffered him not. And certain of the chief of Asia, which were his friends, sent unto him, desiring him that he would not adventure himself into the theatre. Some therefore cried one thing, and some another: for the assembly was confused; and the more part knew not wherefore they were come together. And they drew Alexander out of the multitude, the Jews putting him forward. And Alexander beckoned with the hand, and would have made his defence unto the people. But when they knew that he was a Jew, all with one voice about the space of two hours cried out, Great is Diana of the Ephesians. And when the townclerk had appeased the people, he said, Ye men of Ephesus, what man is there that knoweth not how that the city of the Ephesians is a worshipper of the great goddess Diana, and of the image which fell down from Jupiter? Seeing then that these things cannot be spoken against, ye ought to be quiet, and to do nothing rashly. For ye have brought hither these men, which are neither robbers of churches, nor yet blasphemers of your goddess. Wherefore if Demetrius, and the craftsmen which are with him, have a matter against any man, the law is open, and there are deputies: let them implead one another. But if ye enquire any thing concerning other matters, it shall be determined in a lawful assembly. For we are in danger to be called in question for this day's uproar, there being no cause whereby we may give an account of this concourse. And when he had thus spoken, he dismissed the assembly. (King James Version)
"Diana" of the Ephesians was also known as Artemis (and some other names; I can explain if needed, but will have to do some reference checking first. This is GQ, and my brain doesn't seem to hold as much as it used to). However, any resemblance to the Roman Diana or the Greek Artemis was purely in the name. The Asian "Diana" required that women worshippers serve at least one term (IIRC, a month) in their adult lifetime as a temple prostitute. In some cities, women could not marry until they had done this.

What's that got to do with hair? Glad you asked.

A woman who was serving in the temple had her head shaved. So if you saw a woman out in public whose hair was short, you had reason to believe she had recently served a term as a temple prostitute. So that's why St. Paul made such a big fuss about women having short hair. He didn't want Christian women to be mistaken for worshippers of the goddess.

So why are Pentecostals following that rule, 2,000 years later? It's because only those who know something about the culture and religion of the region understand the reason for the rule. <sigh> And very few Pentecostals, even the ministers, are graduates of secular colleges/universities, much less study ancient religions or history. OTOH, the number of people with secular educations in Pentecostal churches is growing. There's hope that this kind of knowledge will gradually penetrate.
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Old 07-23-2004, 12:16 PM
BMalion BMalion is offline
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be careful, you used "Pentacostal women" and "penetrate" in the same paragraph.
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Old 07-23-2004, 12:33 PM
The Controvert The Controvert is offline
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Originally Posted by CrazyCatLady
The other part of it is that I think very few men realize just how different most women look without makeup. Look at a picture of your favorite supermodel without makeup sometime--most of them are very ordinary, and some of them are flat-out homely.
Here's a link to a site for comparisons of women with and without makeup. See Yasmine Bleeth or Wynona Judd for some rather shocking contrasts. On the other hand, it seems impossible to take a bad picture of Nicole Kidman.
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Old 07-23-2004, 12:50 PM
samclem samclem is online now
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Perhaps better suited to IMHO rather than GQ.

Moved by

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Old 07-23-2004, 01:09 PM
Ethilrist Ethilrist is offline
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Controvert--lots of those "no makeup" pictures are just pictures from movies where they aren't wearing as much makeup, or as [i]pretty[/] makeup, as the high-fashion picture--look at Winona Ryder, for example. The non-makeup picture is from a screenshot of Alien Whatever.
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Old 07-23-2004, 02:05 PM
Indygrrl Indygrrl is offline
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Winona Judd looks like hell no matter if she wears make up or not.

Anyway, I don't know about the obesity thing with Pentecostals, there are quite a few in my hometown and they are as thin/fat as anyone else. Indiana has one of the highest rates of obesity, so maybe that's why you notice it more.

I think since they consider it a sin to primp and look nice, they probably say fack it and eat all they want. Why not? They aren't supposed to concern themselves with looks anyway.
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Old 07-23-2004, 04:23 PM
CrazyCatLady CrazyCatLady is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulFitzroy
I disagree with the idea that someone would notice only the unattractive ones because the normal-looking ones wouldn't stand out. At least that's not the case in my situation. The only time I've ever seen an attractive Pentecostal girl around my age, she REALLY stood out, because I was so shocked to have finally seen a decent-looking Pentecostal girl!

Believe me, the better-looking ones would stand out given the ones I'm used to seeing. I know I live in a fat part of a fat country, but there does seem to be a disproportionate number of fat women in that demographic.
No, honey, you've seen plenty of attractive Pentecostal girls your age, you just didn't realize they were Pentecostal because they didn't fit your stereotype or run up to and announce, "I'm Pentecostal, btw!"
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Old 07-23-2004, 04:30 PM
Stonebow Stonebow is offline
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Originally Posted by CrazyCatLady
No, honey, you've seen plenty of attractive Pentecostal girls your age, you just didn't realize they were Pentecostal because they didn't fit your stereotype or run up to and announce, "I'm Pentecostal, btw!"
What do you mean? That they don't HAVE to wear the long denim skirts, white tennis shoes, and WWJD T-Shirts? They don't HAVE to have long hair in a bun tight enough to turn their face into a rictus of pain, or wear the huge, square framed, coke-bottle glasses?

Don't these women know that all of that shit seriously hinders their ability to get laid?

Just trying to keep some perspective here.

As for Arky Pentacostals...I've never noticed them to be fatter than anyone else...I've actually know many of them to be quite skeletal...but again, that might just be the 'spiral of death' hair bun they've got going on.
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Old 07-23-2004, 04:31 PM
SolGrundy SolGrundy is offline
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And just for the record, it's not just a midwestern thing. I was raised going to a Pentecostal church in the suburbs of Atlanta, Georgia. The churches closest to big cities are still fairly strict, but a lot looser in the day-to-day life requirements. So there was no more commonality in the appearance of the churchgoers than you'd see in any other large, modern, suburban congregation.

And our services had speaking in tongues, but no snakes.
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Old 07-23-2004, 04:40 PM
cher3 cher3 is offline
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Originally Posted by Ethilrist
Controvert--lots of those "no makeup" pictures are just pictures from movies where they aren't wearing as much makeup, or as [i]pretty[/] makeup, as the high-fashion picture--look at Winona Ryder, for example. The non-makeup picture is from a screenshot of Alien Whatever.
I agree--the one of Charlize Theron shows her normal appearance contrasted with the complicated makeup job they did for [i]Monster[i/], complete with false teeth and sprayed-on sun damage.
  #17  
Old 07-23-2004, 04:47 PM
AbbySthrnAccent AbbySthrnAccent is offline
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I thought this thread was going to be about the commonality of hairstyles on many Pentecostal women.

FTR, I am not knocking it. Just noting the similiarity of styles between many Pentecosal women. My hair is remarkably like Stephanie Harts, bottom photo last link, just a bit lighter and I am not Pentecostal.
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Old 07-23-2004, 05:11 PM
The Asbestos Mango The Asbestos Mango is offline
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I grew up in Indiana, too, lived in a rural area for a while, went to a "Christian" school for a few years, and...

I never noticed Pentecostal women being overweight more than the general population, but the homliness factor is definitely there. But I don't think it's genetic. It always seemed to me that when a Pentecostal (or Southern Baptist, IN has more than its share of those, too) woman got to be of an age where she had married and had a couple of kids, they started to get this incredibly haggard, worn look about them. Most of the jr. high to high school girls ran average to pretty. I think it's a lifestyle thing. Being as how Pentecostals, as well as many other fund'ist Xian sects, generally regard women as existing to be servants to their husbands, generally have no real emotional outlets (unless you count praying in tongues) and there seems to be a "look the other way" attitude toward domestic abuse when perpetrated by the male HOH, the women wear out and lose their looks by the time they've been married a decade or so.

OTOH, there are a lot of non-denominational sects that are not part of United Pentecostal churches where the women, even though wearing clothing that covers them from just above the ankle to well below the knee, still manage to look like hookers. Think Tammy Faye Bakker- that would be the norm in some of these churches. Makeup applied with a trowel, hair teased till it touches the walls and ceiling, and sprayed almost solid, bleached more than the average female population. Garish jewelry, flamboyant clothing in colors that could be used to warn folks of nearby highway construction. It almost seems like a reaction to the traditional image of the Pentecostal women.

I personally find both types equally freaky.
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  #19  
Old 07-23-2004, 07:44 PM
Vlad/Igor Vlad/Igor is offline
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Originally Posted by PaulFitzroy
Secondly, I don't know if Pentecostals are even heard of outside the Midwest. Another big risk is nobody here knowing what I'm talking about. But I hope you do. And if not, I'd like to hear from any Midwesterners here.
Oh, Lord, I know exactly what you're talking about. When I worked at College Mall, I saw several families with the women wearing the "uniform": Denim or other fabric skirt, plain texture, ankle-length; non-descript, unflattering blouse; white socks and the same white tennis shoes. No make up, hair pulled back in a bun or pony-tail. That was what all the Pentecostal women from Monroe, Greene, Morgan and Lawrence Counties seemed to wear. I saw variations on that in Columbus, and now here at home an hour south. There was a particular family who frequented the mall, and the women were thin. One of the daughters was attractive, and had a nice figure. That "uniform" seems to be indiginous to the Greater Metropolitan Bloomington area; I haven't seen it elsewhere, except where I mentioned already. What was truly strange (at the time) was to see Mennonites from Beanblossom in the mall.

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Old 07-23-2004, 08:21 PM
The Asbestos Mango The Asbestos Mango is offline
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Originally Posted by The Asbestos Mango
OTOH, there are a lot of non-denominational sects that are not part of United Pentecostal churches where the women, even though wearing clothing that covers them from just above the ankle to well below the knee, still manage to look like hookers. Think Tammy Faye Bakker- that would be the norm in some of these churches. Makeup applied with a trowel, hair teased till it touches the walls and ceiling, and sprayed almost solid, bleached more than the average female population. Garish jewelry, flamboyant clothing in colors that could be used to warn folks of nearby highway construction. It almost seems like a reaction to the traditional image of the Pentecostal women.

I personally find both types equally freaky.
Oh how I wish we could edit posts. I guess they figure people will actually use the preview button.

Anyhoo, there are a lot of non-denominational charismatic sects where the women, even though wearing clothing that covers them from the neck to just below the elbow and well below the knee, still manage to look like hookers. Think Tammy Faye, etc...
  #21  
Old 07-23-2004, 09:07 PM
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I have family members who belong to a strict group, but not Pentacostal. Still women had no makeup, jewelry, can't cut hair, etc.

Let me tell you about 3 sisters:
The oldest left the church ASAP, the other two are still in it. By age 40 the oldest looked 10 years younger than them. By age 60 you could make a generational mistake. Never underestimate the value of regular use of moisturizers, sun block, and such.

And none of my female relatives in the church are in the least bit heavy. A few men are. But that could be genetic...

As for relative looks of young women in such churches, if you learn to spot women with huge amounts of makeup on them, you will develop an strong distaste for such a synythetic look. The mass media strongly supports the synthetic look (because they gotta push the products), but you should just ignore that. Natural skin can look really nice.

(So all the women on so-called fundamentalist TV look like the Whore of Babylon/Mimi from Drew Carey to me, not just the Tammy Faye wannabes.)
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Old 07-23-2004, 10:16 PM
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By Pentecostal, I assume you mean United Pentecostal churches and such.
I thought all non-Catholics were referred to as Pentecostal..

Anyway, my husband and I, and our friends; 2 females and a male, visited a UPC church once.
We felt funny, as we all wore pants and the females wore make up.

They were nice to us, but I really didn't try to size up the females, so I can't say thats so, but who cares what they look like anyway?
  #23  
Old 07-23-2004, 10:28 PM
AbbySthrnAccent AbbySthrnAccent is offline
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Originally Posted by vanilla
I thought all non-Catholics were referred to as Pentecostal..
You're thinking of Protestant.
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Old 07-24-2004, 12:07 AM
vanilla vanilla is offline
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thank you!
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Old 07-24-2004, 05:31 AM
VunderBob VunderBob is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbbySthrnAccent
I thought this thread was going to be about the commonality of hairstyles on many Pentecostal women.
<snort>
Does anyone see the irony in the use of 'Pentecostal' and Bourbon in the same page title?

Carry on...
  #26  
Old 09-29-2012, 01:15 AM
angeliquejacks angeliquejacks is offline
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why do so many pentecostal women look like this

well to refer to the overweight part it is simply the lack of activity like any other person or could be some medical problems.

to refer to the hair our hair is our covering from God and our glory.

The reason we do not watch tv is because of all the ungodly stuff shown on them. Garbage into the mind then Garbage comes out.

The Bible tells us to come out and be separate from the world living a Holy life unto God. we are not perfect but we are suppose to try to be more like Christ.

God came to earth to walk amongst us to set the example. He walked upon the earth in the form of Jesus Christ.
He told us all to repent be baptized in Jesus name for the remission of our sins and we shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. It is unto you to your children and to your children's children as many as far as the Lord God shall call. You are then adopted into His family. You die spiritually to the old life you lived and begin a new life without sin. Walk Knowing He has given you strength to overcome sin daily.

God never promised an easy life He just promised to be with us through it all. He loves everyone but hates the sin in our lives.

To be saved You must repent ( give your heart to God and make up your mind to live the best you can without sin and asking God for forgiveness for the sins you have committed) Be baptized in Jesus name ( you are being baptized into Jesus it washes away all your sins that you have committed you are born again get a chance at a new life with Jesus) The first gift Jesus promises you is the gift of the Holy Ghost His spirit in you to help you over come this world. There are no words that could ever explain the Feeling and emotion that washes over you when the Holy Ghost fills your body every person is different. It is better than any drug or alcohol you could ever take or consume. Pure freedom, happiness, joy, spiritual peace it is nothing like you could ever feel by living for the World. Find a pentecostal church and see for yourself.
Remember this you are not going for the people you are going for Jesus which is God.
There was no perfect person on earth that God could use to walk around on the earth in so He had to create Himself a perfect body to use to be able to give it as a sacrifice for our sins. read the old testament people had to sacrifice different animals for different sins and they had to be perfect without fault or blemish. So in order to give us complete freedom from sin when we give our lives to Him by being Obedient to His plan of salvation and follow His word He had to have a perfect sacrifice. God which is Jesus Took your place on the cross.
Where do you want to spend eternity in heaven or hell. Are your choice of today able to get you to heaven.
  #27  
Old 09-29-2012, 01:32 AM
April R April R is offline
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Originally Posted by angeliquejacks View Post

The reason we do not watch tv is because of all the ungodly stuff shown on them. Garbage into the mind then Garbage comes out.

)
Then how does getting on the internet slip through that little rule?
Entertainment and Education

Pentecostal women are not allowed to participate in co-ed sports or classes that require them to wear revealing clothing that exposes their body, such as swimming, calisthenics or softball. Women, and all members of the Pentecostal church, are not permitted to watch television or videos, go to the theater, attend dances or listen to radio programs. It is believed that these activities encourage evil. Pentecostals believe that this is important process for their spirituality because the Lord will soon come back for the people of the Pentecostal church.


Read more: Rules for Pentecostal Women | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_7905881_rul...#ixzz27qUPsSak


You would think the internet would be just as evil as renting a Disney movie from Redbox
  #28  
Old 09-29-2012, 01:41 AM
Mona Lisa Simpson Mona Lisa Simpson is offline
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I am really trying to avoid making a joke about Pentacostal Zombies running around going "Mmmmm Tongues" instead of "Mmm Brains".
  #29  
Old 09-29-2012, 01:42 AM
Lord Feldon Lord Feldon is offline
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A friend of my mom went to a church that considered TV and radio evil, but they were also fine with the Internet. Basically, IIRC, it slipped through before the rules could change and they liked it too much.

Last edited by Lord Feldon; 09-29-2012 at 01:43 AM..
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:18 AM
Gukumatz Gukumatz is offline
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angeliquejacks, welcome to the Straight Dope Message Board.

As I presume you came here from a search or through a link, I should point out that this thread has been abandoned for eight years, since it was first posted in 2004. Resurfacing old, dead threads are known as "zombies", hence the jokes above. As many of the people who started the thread are no longer around, I'm closing it.

Lastly, we request that witnessing be restricted to the forum known as Great Debates.

Enjoy your stay.

- Gukumatz,
Game Room & IMHO Moderator
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