I Used to Privately Snicker at the Dems

[Bricker]

Karl Rove set up Dan Rather, they’d scream. And I’d snicker, because it was such a ridiculous attempt to deflect attention from the fact that the documents were phony. They had a hundred excuses… “But there WERE documents that said that, just not these.” Uh huh. My party, though I never pictured them as saints, would never even try to float trial balloons that flimsy.

In the past 24 hours, I have seen and read attempted defenses of the Foley issue from people that are putatively on “my side” that make the Democratic responses to Diebold vote control and Rather document forgery seem positively sane and logical.

I apologize unreservedly to anyone to whom I ever suggested that my side wouldn’t do anything like that. Nope – as it turns out, we’ll do worse.

My reaction to the ACTUAL ill remains as it was yesterday: Foley’s resignation was correct; he should be criminally investigated; and the GOP leadership should be vigorously investigated as well. If it develops that Hastert, or anyone in the GOP leadership, knew about these criminal acts and did nothing, he should resign or be forced out, and subject to criminal process as well. It’s a very simple equation.

My reaction to the tactics that are appearing from the Right on this is utter disgust. “The Dems set him up!” Yeah, suuuure they did. And even if they did – what of it? He DID the acts in question. I’ve heard hopeful attempts at “Well, the chat logs can be forged.” That might make sense if Foley were denying them; he is not and the time for him to do so has long passed. What garbage! “The Dems knew and were waiting until now to spring this!” Only relevant to the extent that if someone on the Democrat’s side knew and let the situation go on for political advantage, that is despicable as well and THEY should resign… but it doesn’t change, deflect, or detract one iota from the issue at hand: namely, we had a sexual predator sitting in Congress.

I am just sick about this. I expected the party I support to take this hit and clean house. Instead, I’m seeing lame effort after lame effort to cover it up, change the focus, deflect the blame, and talk about anything but what matters.

Fuck you, GOP leadership. Stop dodging. Our boy screwed up. Admit it. Let’s find out who else screwed up, get them the fuck out of government, and then we can say we stand for law and morality again. Right now, we seem to stand for weasel-dom.

[Clothahump]

There’s no denying he did it. There is also no denying that the Dems have sat on the knowledge of it for more than a year, waiting until just before the election to roll it out so they could make maximum political hay from it.

[you_with_the_face]

@Clothahump

There’s no denying he did it. There is also no denying that the Dems have sat on the knowledge of it for more than a year, waiting until just before the election to roll it out so they could make maximum political hay from it.

Cite?

[silenus]

@Bricker

Right now, we seem to stand for weasel-dom.

And this would be different from any other time how?

Neither party has been outstanding in their pursuit of integrity in politics. They only act when forced to, and they spin it into the realm of fantasy overnight. I don’t know the solution, but I can sure recognize the problem.

[LonesomePolecat]

@Clothahump

There’s no denying he did it. There is also no denying that the Dems have sat on the knowledge of it for more than a year, waiting until just before the election to roll it out so they could make maximum political hay from it.

I don’t doubt the Dems are trying to squeeze as much political advantage out of the situation as possible. It doesn’t change the fact that Foley is guilty as hell. If anything, he should be held doubly in contempt for stupidly providing the Dems with such wonderful ammunition to use against the Pubs.

[Debaser]

Great OP, Bricker. It sums up my thoughts exactly.

STFU, Republican congresscritters, and take your medicine.

[Bricker]

@Clothahump

There’s no denying he did it. There is also no denying that the Dems have sat on the knowledge of it for more than a year, waiting until just before the election to roll it out so they could make maximum political hay from it.

What of it? How is that relevant?

I grant you that it should certainly be investigated, and any Dem leader that did this should resign as well. But that’s a tiny little sidebar to the main point here. We claim we stand for something. Now we’re in the process of trying to vigorously prove we don’t. That’s what’s important, and that’s what I’m pitting. Whatever the Dems knew or didn’t know will come out int he wash, but it seems WE KNEW. WE were on the hook to do something. Are we really saying enforcement of moral and ethical standards by the GOP leadership is reliant upon what the Dems know or don’t know?!?

[the_PC_apeman]

Wow, Bricker. You’ve been hanging out with us lefty pinko commie fags too long. I can’t disagree with anything you said. I thought organization and party discipline were the GOP’s biggest advantages. That seems to have gone to hell lately.

[Lord_Ashtar]

This just goes to show that people on both sides of the isle suck. I think I’m about to become an anarchist.

[633squadron]

@silenus

And this would be different from any other time how?

Neither party has been outstanding in their pursuit of integrity in politics. They only act when forced to, and they spin it into the realm of fantasy overnight. I don’t know the solution, but I can sure recognize the problem.

The solution is to call politicians on it, regardless of party. I’m a Democrat, but I won’t excuse or defend Democratic politicians at any level if they act without integrity or morality.

I particularly won’t defend Bill Clinton for the Monica Lewinsky affair. Oh I know that other Presidents did the same thing; there’s little doubt about either Kennedy or Roosevelt. Doesn’t make it right. Clinton’s evasions make it worse.

These men and women work for us, not the other way around. They’re supposed to be spending their time (and our money) making our lives easier and more harmonious and delivering the solutions that we need for the future.

Hilary has the right to make up her own mind about her husband, but I wish she had confronted him a long time ago. Someone should have done the same for Foley. We don’t know what would have happened, but it couldn’t have hurt for both of these men to get help. Maybe we would have been spared all this crap, so that government could actually do something instead of making like a giant, costly night-time TV drama.

[Dinsdale]

I can generally count on disagreeing with just about everything you post on matters political Bricker, but I compliment you on acknowledging this instance of inappropriate behavior by your home team.

Always good to start out with an easy one. It’s a start, at least!

[Shodan]

In the past 24 hours, I have seen and read attempted defenses of the Foley issue from people that are putatively on “my side” that make the Democratic responses to Diebold vote control and Rather document forgery seem positively sane and logical.

Do you mean on this board?

I haven’t been following discussions on the Foley affair at all closely, since both the circumstances and the reactions here I expect are fairly cut-and-dried.

Regards,
Shodan

[An_Arky]

Well, Bricker, cheer up. I’ve felt pretty bad about some Democrat shenanigans over the years, but all in all, you have to just write off the bad apples and hope for some positive change.

Part of the problem is the old “absolute power corrupts absolutely” saw. We the people were not wise to hand all three branches of the government over to one party.

And as much as I am pleased at the schadenfruede of the GOP leadership twisting like pretzels over this flap, I also know darn well that it may not have been much different if the parties were reversed.

You are a principled conservative, and there are principled liberals out there, too, and we should all be able to table our differences long enough to make sure that ALL of our elected leaders behave appropriately. We should unite against the slimy spin doctors who would have the nerve to stand up and utter these sorts of untruths, no matter what ideology they or we espouse.

I also realize we probably don’t have a sno-cone’s chance in hell of affecting positive change in this area in our lifetimes…

[Sevastopol]

@633squadron

…
Hilary has the right to make up her own mind about her husband, but I wish she had confronted him a long time ago. …

What makes you think she hasn’t? And either way, how is it anybody’s business other than Mr + Mrs C’s?

[Left_Hand_of_Dorkness]

@Lord Ashtar

This just goes to show that people on both sides of the isle suck. I think I’m about to become an anarchist.

I used to be one a them college-level principled anarchists, and for a few years, I hung out a lot in anarchist circles.

They suck, too.

Daniel

[Skald_the_Rhymer]

Well said, Bricker.

[Steve_MB]

@Clothahump

There’s no denying he did it. There is also no denying that the Dems have sat on the knowledge of it for more than a year, waiting until just before the election to roll it out so they could make maximum political hay from it.

I mean, they must have found out about it from their man on the page-program committee, right?

The irony here is that, were it not for their reflexive instinct for one-party governance, the Republicans could have spared themselves this scandal, or at least ensured that it was a bipartisan one. But their initial response to reports of a potential problem was to keep it inside the family – not to inform, for example, the Democratic member responsible for overseeing the page program, Rep. Dale E. Kildee (Mich.).

[ EMILY LATELLA ] Never mind… [ /EMILY LATELLA ]

[Gfactor]

“Mark Foley wants you to know he is a gay man,” Roth said.

While acknowledging Foley sent sexually explicit e-mails to underage youths, Roth insisted that Foley never had sexual contact with a minor.

“Any suggestion that Mark Foley is a pedophile is false,” he said.

The attorney declined to identify the clergyman who allegedly molested Foley or the church with which the clergyman was affiliated, saying only that the incidents took place when Foley was between the ages of 13 and 15. Foley is Roman Catholic.

http://www.southernvoice.com/thelatest/thelatest.cfm?blog_id=9437

The come-out-and-blame-a-priest defense. Nice.

@Shodan

Do you mean on this board?

Republicans Offer Explanations in Wake of Foley’s E-Mail Scandal With Teen Boy (FOX News)

[Steve_MB]

@Bricker

Fuck you, GOP leadership. Stop dodging. Our boy screwed up. Admit it. Let’s find out who else screwed up, get them the fuck out of government, and then we can say we stand for law and morality again. Right now, we seem to stand for weasel-dom.

And it seems to be getting worse rather than better, what with Newt Gingrich floating (oh, and is it ever a “floater”) the excuse that the Republicans handled Foley with kid gloves for fear of being perceived as “gay-bashing”. :rolleyes:

[elfbabe]

@Bricker

Right now, we seem to stand for weasel-dom.

Hey! HEY! :mad:
I won’t stand by and listen to such things being said about weasels!