Recently I was watching, for various stupid reasons, one of the many odious judge shows currently on the air. In the episode in question, a young black gentleman–in his early 20s, I’d estimate – was being sued for child support, or something akin; I can’t say specifically as I was paying more attention to my book than the set. At any rate, the gentleman in question kept denying that he was the father of the plaintiff’s baby, saying several times that ‘females’ were always accusing him of such things, that he had a nearly unlimited supply of ‘females’ at this beck & call.
This both vexed me and got my attention. I know any number of men of my race (but usually a few years my junior) who tend to refer to women as ‘females.’ To me this usage seems dismissive and vaguely offensive; it seems dehumanizing, somehow. I-It rather than I-Thou & all that. But then I think too much, so maybe I’m overanalyzing.
Anywhistle, I thought I’d start a thread to solicit opinions. Dopers, how often do you hear men referring to women thusly? Are you offended by the usage, or does it depend on the context, and, if the latter, how? And, if you don’t mind, please indicate your gender, ethnicity, and approximate age.
41, white male. Also a veteran, which is possibly relevant here. Things may have changed since I got out, but when I was in service, it was common to refer to males and females rather than men and women. Dunno if it was some official policy, or if it just happened that way. After I got out, I continued the practice until a female classmate raised the same objections noted in the OP. Now, I usually use man/men or woman/women. It just sounds less impersonal or something…
I saw that episode of Judge Bitchypants, and while I find it weird, I don’t find it insulting. He’s obviously got a problem with women, but the term itself isn’t the problem. The fact that he uses it to refer to women is weird in a detached-from-the-relationship kind of way. I’m sure he doesn’t refer to men as males. It’s as if he sees them as aliens that are beyond his grasp.
24 white male. I’ve heard this before; however, I’ve more often heard women say things to the effect of “What is it with males?” (generally in a plaintive tone, similar to the “What is it with men?” question, but distinctly not the same). To some level it bothers me because its slightly dehumanizing, but at the same time one can benefit by not refering to the words “men” and “women” which have distinctive conotative meanings ontop of gender (ie, a man/woman is mature, responsible, an adult, etc.), while “male” and “female” allow the user to refer to the person’s gender only.
Personally, I could care less which is used, but I could see certain usages being potentially offensive. In the case brought up by the OP, it appears as though the guy doesn’t respect her “womanhood”, or that of women in general, instead he sees them merely as “females”. As Kalhoun pointed out, it looks like the guy has a problem with women in general and this usage is just a sign of that. Or, it could simply be someone trying to sound smarter or more intellectual, as “female” is clearly less common in language than “woman”; being that he was in court, a facade as such is not beyond reason either.
Way back in 1991, two of the women in my grad school dorm chewed me out for using the term “female.”
Ever since then though, I’ve heard a lot of women use the same term. Whenever I’d bring this incident up, they’d look at me with bemusement and ask “What’s wrong with using the word ‘female’? That’s what we are!”
It does sound odd, like something from a police report. On the other hand, it’s hard to find a word that won’t make a woman mad. I worked with a lady who said nothing made her more furious than having a man call her “woman.” Various others get peeved about “girls, gals, dames, chicks, bitches, ladies, darlin’, dear, etc.” There’s no universally safe thing to call these humans who aren’t male. A guy just has to take a chance with some word, because, “you with the tits” just won’t get it.
I find it vaguely insulting, but it would really depend on the delivery. In the example cited in the OP, obviously the guy in question doesn’t have a super opinion of women; however, in a different context it could be neutral or mearly descriptive.
If a man used the term in the particular way the OP describes, around me then I’d assume him to be still slightly uncomfortable around women they way teenage boys are. And let’s face it, if he was only around 20 then he might well still have a good bit of growing up to do.
I assume you were making a joke (and it is funny), but I think you’ve hit on what might make it annoying to women. It’s like we were talking about lab mice or something - I have 10 females and 8 males. I think it depends heavily on context and the user, too. Women can usually tell when a guy truly likes or dislikes women, and the actual words he uses aren’t as important as the intent.
(AskNott, the only safe term for us Double X’s is “Mangrove Throatwarblers.”)
featherlou, 39, white, female (ha! - see, that usage doesn’t bug me)
My father used to use “female” when the word “lady” didn’t apply. I guess it was considered more a “slight” than an outright insult. It certainly wasn’t intended to be flattering. I have noticed that usage from other men of his generation, too.
I definitely think of it as at least potentially insulting. It’s emphasizing the biological gender rather than simply being a label.
Choice of words in language is all about shades of context, and I would place the use of “female” to refer to a specific woman or to generalize about women a few steps down the ladder from “woman” away from “lady” and towards “fuckhole”.
Could be a military thing. My brother was in the Army and was taught to refer to women in the service as “females.” I guess “girls” and “ladies” are pretty loaded terms, and I don’t know what’s wrong with “women,” but “females” strikes me as a very “trying to be PC” term. Or it could be that the guy on the court show was trying to sound more formal and “females” was the best thing he could come up with.
