Stick a fork in her: Clinton's done

Three weeks ago, in a thread about the chance of a brokered convention, I posted :
On the Democratic side, I see a very small chance of a brokered convention. At this point, it’s a two person race, and it comes down to mega-Tuesday. If Clinton is perceived (i.e. anointed by the media) as having scored a fairly clear win, Obama is out. If Obama is perceived as having won or tied, he’ll been seen as having broken the front-running Clinton in the big game, and should be able to leverage that into wins in most of the remaining states. Yes, there is some gray area between the two, but the perception should solidify shortly after the results are counted.

Well, no matter how you counted it, by almost any measure last Tuesday was a flat-out dead even tie between Clinton and Obama. That, to my mind, was a big win for Obama. First, it made him undeniably credible as a candidate (and not someone who whites would be afraid to vote for), and second, it broke Clinton’s aura of inevitability.

Before that, he had announce that he had raised $32 million in January, to resounding silence from the Clinton camp. On Super Tuesday it broke that Clinton had loaned $5 million to her campaign, and then Obama raised $7 million on the internet. Shortly thereafter Clinton said that she had raised another $5 million, but one thing that never really came up was the question of whether those were primary-eligible funds, or just general election funds that must be returned if she loses the primary. That is highly significant as she is maxed out on primary funds for many of her donors, and she might have been able to ask for general election funds that would have to be returned, but those would be useless now. Over the last few days, she started shaking up her campaign staff (the whiff of desperation).

Before today, she announced her strategy of ignoring all of the “little” states coming up, and staking everything on Texas and Ohio. The last candidate to do that was Giulani who waited for Florida, and look how that did for him.

Now comes today’s results. To me, the significant thing is not just the three convincing wins, it’s the fact that Obama won virtually every demographic category, according to the exit polls (Virginia Maryland ). Clinton’s lead among women, older voters, and Hispanics is crumbling.

As Clinton has essentially conceded the next few states, it will be a string of wins for Obama. With the dreaded “momentum” on his side, I doubt that she’ll be able to do anything at her last stand at the Alamo.

Sorry, Clintonistas, she’s done. (Huckabee, too, but we knew that already).

Not quite.

Clinton is now battling for survival. Ohio, Texas, Pennsylvania. She must win them all, or she will be pretty much universally percieved as beated. And even if she does that, Obama could still very well be ahead in the delegate count and general popularity, and could still win the nomination.

The tide has certainly turned, but let’s not pretend Barack doesn’t have some work ahead of him to seal the deal.

Menochio I agree that the battle is not yet won. I’m liking Obama more everyday, as long as Obama does not step on his dick, he should be fine.
Yes, he is more liberal than I like but the Republicans need to go away.

She needs to win them convincingly, too - and at this point I think he’s likely to take at least one of the big March 4 states, the way she’s slipping. I can’t say ‘stick a fork in her,’ but it’s looking harder and harder for her to win.

Everyone likes a winner and no one likes a loser. Hillary has been a loser, and she’s going to continue to be a loser. Her support, such as it is, is going to fade even more. Obama is running a brilliant campaign, too. Can’t say I’m going to shed any tears for HRC. I much prefer Obama in the White House. This is going to be exciting.

Ah she is toast…

People want a fresh start again. They aren’t going to get it from HC…

The question though I ask is…what happens if the DNC doesn’t want Obama and those superdelegates vote/nominate HC?

Then I breathe in a sigh of relief, as I will be able to vote blue once again this year. :cool:

But why? If the superdelegates ignore the candidate that the people want, and go ahead and nominate HRC…wouldn’t that suck for people who voted for and wanted Obama to get the nomination? It’s like if that happens then the DNC isn’t being democratic…

I think the assumption that the superdelegates are just loyal to the Clintons is inaccurate. They’re loyal to her to the extent they think she will win. If she can’t beat Obama, a lot of them won’t believe she gives them the best chance to win.

Oh I don’t mean ALL of them. IF it comes down to the two of them and it’s close…and it comes down to X-many of superdelegates voting for HRC. People will HOWL I think. Yes?

I think Obama will retain a lead in pledged delegates even if Clinton wins TX, PA, and OH handily.

Combined, OH, TX, and PA have 492 delegates. NY had 232, or a little under half that. She won 46 net delegates in NY, and NY was extremely favorable to her. NY was set up to have far more odd-numbered delegate districts than OH, PA, or TX–it had odd-numbered districts in almost all of its districts! OH, by contrast, has only six odd-numbered districts. And, of course, NY was Clinton’s home state. So I think that she simply cannot get a greater percentage of delegates in PA, TX or OH than she won in NY. That makes her upper limit something near 100 delegates. Even allowing a significant fudge factor (maybe you think she’ll win OH by more than NY despite the polls), there’s no way she takes more than 120 or so.

Obama’s lead among pledged delegates almost swallows that victory right now. And it will in all likelihood be even higher by that time.

I submit, the only reasonably foreseeable way for Clinton to win this is to seat FL and/or MI or convince a significant majority of superdelegates. I don’t think the superdelegates will cut her way by enough margin, so it’s all MI and FL. If they seat MI without a re-vote, I’ll eat my keyboard. So, like Rudy, I think it’s FL or bust.

Give it up, Maniac. No matter how ineptly the Dems handle this, John McCain is not going to be our next POTUS. HRC might be; McCain, NFW. Bush has placed this election beyond even the reach of the Democrats’ incompetence.

YAAAAYYYY! We don’t suck bad enough to lose!

:smiley:

BG it won’t happen but … if HRC wins by means widely seen as dirty pool (seating FL and/or MI without new votes or by superdelegates overcoming the pledged delegate total) then not only would McCain beat her in a cakewalk but the damage to the Democratic Party would be devastating.

Most superdelegates know that so they’ll serve the function they were designed for - making sure that the party’s best interests are served. Barring a surprising blow-out by her in WI or a blow-out by well over 2:1 in both Texas and Ohio, even she will see that soon. Any attempt to continue past then would require her to be even more of a narcissistic self-centered politico than even most Hillary bashers peg her for. And would diminish her power to come in the Senate, where I expect her to be quite effective for many years to come.

I wouldn’t be so sure of that, myself.

Remember, in the last two presidential elections the country has been split pretty much fifty-fifty. This means roughly half the populace favors Republicanism, and Bush isn’t running. So, even granting that perhaps many conservatives/Republicans may be unhappy with GWB, they still hew to their basic conservative philosophies and IMO are still going to go with the conservative/Republican candidate.

Combine that with Obama’s ultra-liberal positions getting wider exposure once he becomes the clear Democratic candidate, and you just might find yourself cursing the electorate again this fall.

Only because this time 'round we’re outclassed.

Such as?

Not really.

I fear that we do. I think it likely that McCain will win. I hope I’m wrong.

Not a chance. Have you been watching the relative turnouts in these primaries? If you’re paying attention at all, you’ll find that voters are swarming to the Democratic primaries and caucuses in such unprecedented numbers that they’re running out of ballots, running out of room, opening more locations and closing down highways. The Republicans – not so much.

Example: In Virginia, Obama got more votes than all of the Republican candidates combined. Obama: 619,036. McCain+Huckabee+Paul+Romney: 479,220. 'Nuf said.

As for sticking a fork in Clinton, I hope when they do, she has to choke on her own words.