I don’t know how this is going to go, but I will put myself out there as someone who obsessively followed Michael Jackson’s career from 1969 to about 2001 or so. I’ve been watching CNN’s coverage and listening to the radio there has been a lot of factual misinformation out there. (I imagine for the 80s pretty much anyone out there can do as well as me.)
I’m also happy to recommend his greatest performances, etc. This thread might sink like a stone, but maybe at least us Jackson freaks can talk about him here.
I think he was in arrested development. That he really felt he was 11 or 12 years old and he behaved as such as an adult. That being said, I think he probably behaved inappropriately with some of these kids - sleeping in the same bed, showing them Playboy, etc. But I somehow don’t believe he sexually abused the kids… certainly, showing an underage kid a Playboy is inappropriate and in some folks’ eyes may constitute sexual abuse. I don’t believe he fondled or had sex with the kids that accused him. But I can also state that it’s possible he did. I wish he’d exhibited better judgment.
Stuff like his last album was 1995’s HIStory, when it was 2001’s Invincible - which scored him a Top 10 hit (“You Rock My World”). There was an aborted second single, “Butterflies,” which was a Top 20 hit as well. Or that The Jacksons’ last album was Victory in 1984 - they recorded another album in 1989, 2300 Jackson Street, which featured Michael on one track. The Jackson Five were not discovered by Diana Ross - this was part of Motown’s PR campaign - Gladys Knight has a better claim to this, and the group was already signed to a local label when Motown showed up. Pretty minor stuff that a fanboy would catch.
Difficult. As a Motown artist, Michael did not write his own material. But his last solo album, Forever Michael (1975), has material much more suitable for a 17 year old to sing. It has my favorite ballad of his, “One Day in Your Life.” I think his voice was at its best from 1975 to 1981 - yep, right before Thriller. With The Jacksons, I would go with Destiny (1978). I actually think Off the Wall (1979) holds up better as an album than Thriller. But I could go on… that’s my first stab, subject to revisiting.
I think Michael had body dysmorphic disorder. He was very insecure about his looks, especially his nose, and had pretty bad acne as a teen. His first nose job was around '77 or so, and from what I understand, it looked good cosmetically but the surgeon botched something internally, which is why he had such a problem with his nose - and of course the BDD.
I think he probably experimented with skin bleaching products, which I understand can replicate the effects of vitiligo. His BDD went to a whole other level after the Pepsi commercial burn incident, which I think was far more serious than was reported.
Do you mean that he was trying to look like Diana? I think Michael was extremely reverent of the women in his life. He was something of a mama worshipper, and I think all the Jackson sons especially seem to have this. I suspect there’s a little Elizabeth Taylor and Diana Ross in his facial surgeries.
Diana Ross may not have discovered the J5, but she was a mentor to the band, especially Michael. That was the way Gordy ran Motown, but there was definitely a special relationship between the two. They starred together in “The Wiz,” in fact, I think Diana Ross lobbied for Michael to get the role of the Scarecrow. Michael wrote “Muscles” which was a hit for Diana as well.
Being that Diana is also… er, eccentric, I think they probably understood each other in a unique way.
Beautiful answer, HH, thanks, and it reminds me to say a good strength-giving prayer for Diana Ross as I head to bed: MJ’s death must be so hard for her.
I believe it, but here’s a concern: post-Quincy Jones, I don’t think MJ had a strong producer that really “got” him. Quincy didn’t try to do Quincy Jones music with Michael Jackson vocals - he made Michael’s ideas better. And he was not a yes man. Quincy hated Billie Jean and tried to talk Michael out of putting it on the record.
Teddy Riley did a good job of capturing Michael’s essence on Dangerous, but after that he went to a rotating stable of producers - Rodney Jerkins, R. Kelly, Babyface, etc. HIStory had way too many “poor persecuted me” tracks that I’m sure Quincy would have nixed.
I know that he had done tons of tracks with various producers du jour. I’m not confident that a will.i.am produced track is going to satisfy me - might get asses on the dance floor but will it have the gravitas or impact of a “Human Nature” or “Beat It?”
I suspect there is going to be huge issues with settling his estate and there will be a Tupac-esque torrent of MJ music. And I’ll probably buy it out of curiosity, but I’m not expecting great things from the majority of it. As long as they keep Wyclef and Diddy away from the tracks we’re cool. (Actually, that’s my biggest fear - that someone will hand a master over to someone like Li’l Wayne and ask him to rap on it.) :mad: :mad: :mad:
I’m really surprised that in all the In Memorium coverage on the news channels I’ve seen thus far, nobody mentions the Pepsi incident (in fact, your post is the only one in all of SDMB that mentions Pepsi in any MJ thread). I’d always heard that this accident was incredibly traumatic to him, and really sent him over the edge in terms of fear, self-consciousness, exposure to pain meds, reclusiveness, and other deep-rooted psychological damage that didn’t fully (and more visibly) manifest itself until many years later. I almost have to wonder if he would have ended up the way he did if not for this one event. Sure, he probably would’ve stayed eccentric and hermetically sealed as any bigtime pop megastar is, but he might’ve better handled his demons and reined in his impulses if not for this turning point.
Yeah, this surprised me too. I lived in England when this happened and we were on the phone with friends in America - of course the initial reports were that he died, he was seriously burned, etc. But it was at the height of his commercial power, and I’m sure the handlers knew they were in danger of losing their meal ticket. So I don’t think that a) we ever got the true extent of his injuries, and b) it’s entirely possible that he never had adequate time to convalesce. Of all the places to be burned, the scalp has to be one of the worse - all of the nerve endings and so on. I have no doubt that he was doped up to the gills during this time.
Michael was already “eccentric,” and I agree, this would have easily pushed him over the edge.
Basically because I thought the quality control with his output and the media had swung so seriously in the other direction. Michael was making news for everything but music (and dance and acting). I was still a fan, absolutely. But more like a “let me put on Destiny from '78” fan vs. “when’s MJ’s new record dropping?”
I think he totally lost it when he blasted Sony for racism. He was Sony’s golden child for decades and then decided he wanted to whinge about it. Then the concerts in Dubai, etc.
Is being a MJ fan a sort of one-off for you? Do you listen to other pop music? I just wouldn’t expect someone with a name like “Hippy Hollow” to be into MJ.
Oh hell yeah, I listen to tons of stuff. I’m known (at least I thought I was) for my slavish devotion to Joy Division/New Order (I wore both shirts this week), The Smiths, XTC, Blur, The Clash, and so on.
I am a music trivia buff. But like I said, the one constant throughout my life was Michael Jackson and The Jacksons. My mom reminded me that I spent HOURS, to the point that my parents were worried that I was obsessive, listening to Michael Jackson records with the headphones on, when I was about 8 or 9. I used to go to record stores and sort the Jacksons albums if they were out of order.
Most of the bands I mentioned I got into during my adolescence. But MJ is a childhood love that endured. I was born in 1972 (in fact, the same day the J5 album Looking Through the Windows was released) so I missed the initial wave of Jacksonmania. I don’t think most kids my age thought Michael or The Jacksons were all that - the roller skating crowd, teenagers seemed to be into them. (I think the most popular band in my elementary school was KISS.)
Then Off the Wall hit in '79, and my guy became the business. And it got even better in '82 with Thriller. So I got to see my favorite artist become the biggest artist in the world. For that reason MJ and The Jacksons will always be at the core of my musical life.
I also really loved what they (at least publicly) stood for. The Jacksons’ production company was called “Peacock Productions.” All of the albums had this on the back:
Watching the Jackson Five cartoon was one of the highlights of my week - we didn’t have a TV so I watched it over at my mates house. I’m glad he died suddenly - it’s gotta be the best way to go.
Everyone’s saying that he was the first black artist to be played on MTV. But I heard once that this was not true, and that they did play videos by various R&B and soul artists of the day. MTV may not have given them as much rotation as the white artists, but the network was far from lily white.
Besides, who cares that he was black? His talent and prodigy level skill with dancing and singing were not related to him being black. I think MTV would have played his videos and songs even if he was white…or indian…or whatever. His talent, to me, was separate from his race and his race wasn’t even a big deal to me. He’s just a…talented dude, end of story.