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#1
11-05-2009, 07:54 PM
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Why did Jesus appear on the scene when he did?
Is this explained anywhere, because I certainly don't remember seeing it mentioned in the bible?
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#2
11-05-2009, 08:14 PM
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Do you mean from a religious perspective or historical one? Jesus was not by any means unique there were lots of people going around the same time Jesus was preaching similar things. It's just that his version took off.
If you mean a religious perspective the Gospels lay out how Jesus was the fulfillment of the messiah to come. Others came along but they either weren't the true fulfillment or else their teachings and followers didn't get any "press," so to speak and their movements died out
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#4
11-05-2009, 08:26 PM
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Obviously, there's no one single answer to this.
However, there is a prophecy in Genesis that says the Messiah will come before "the scepter departs from Judah" which is generally understood to mean "before Israel is conquered and loses self-rule". After Herod, Israel/Palestine was ruled by the Romans and this transition happened during the time Jesus was alive so that Pontius Pilate was there to crucify him. (For reference, see here.) In addition, the Jewish temple was destroyed around 66 AD by the Romans. If you believe Christ was the fulfillment of the temple law, then it makes sense that the temple would not be destroyed until shortly after he makes it obsolete. For those who don't look for a prophetic or religious reason, the rise of Rome can still be blamed. Rome made transportation, trade and communication easier and safer, and gave special protection to its citizens. Paul was Jewish and a Roman citizen; he was uniquely able to spread the Gospel at that point in history.
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#6
11-05-2009, 09:06 PM
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#8
11-05-2009, 09:10 PM
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If he'd come today he'd have reached a whole nation. Israel in 4 BC had no mass communication.
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#10
11-05-2009, 09:17 PM
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#11
11-05-2009, 09:19 PM
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There was about a 75-year time span when a unified state covering the majority of the civilized world ruled over a Holy Land in which the Jewish Temple still stood, when the Jews remained a people predominantly living in one area and with their commitment to YHWH in place, and capable of being spread to all peoples (i.e., all peoples within the oikoumene) by that unified state enabling ease of commerce and travel. It was during this period that Jesus was born and grew up, performed his ministry and Atonement, and word of what he had taught and done was spread throughout the Empire. Although it may be post hoc, the timing on this seems too neat to be coincidental.
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#12
11-05-2009, 10:01 PM
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Why did Jesus appear on the scene when he did?
That is just the way the Director envisioned the play. John, The Baptist, was wrapping up his scene and cued Jesus. Jesus walked on stage, hit his mark, said his lines, and exited. There is probably more to it than that. Various interpretations have been written about the issue. More than a few books. You could look it up.
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#13
11-05-2009, 11:24 PM
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Jesus was most likely a metaphor for various astrological phenomena. There are 12 astroogical ages running 26,000 years and the birth of Jesus is a metaphor for the transition from the age of Aries which ran from 2150BC-1AD into the age of Pisces, which runs from 1AD-2150AD, which is why the story of Jesus arose around this time period.
He was born on December 25th because December 25th is the day when in the northern hemisphere the days start getting longer and the sun starts to ascend. The position of the sun on the horizon constantly gets lower after its peak on the summer solstice (June 21st) until the winter solstice is December 21st, and for 3 days (22-24) the sun does not move up or down, it has reached its bottom. On December 25th the length of daylight becomes longer and the sun begins its ascent into the horizon (eventually peaking on June 21st, to begin the descent again from June21-December21) again which is where there story that the sun 'dies' for 3 days and is then reborn and arises up to heaven. http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_menu.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrolo...e_Arian_Age.29 The ages of Aries ended roughly 100BC-1AD (there is controversy over the exact date) after running 2000+ years, which is why Jesus entered the picture in that period. I have no idea if a guy named Jesus actually existed. If he did then IMO he was just one of the dozens of guys running around claiming to talk for God back then. But even if he did exist his story has basically become a metaphor for astrology, and its unlikely the Jesus we know (assuming he ever existed) was born on the day or year we assume he was born on, since these are astrological metaphors. Last edited by Wesley Clark; 11-05-2009 at 11:27 PM.
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#14
11-05-2009, 11:33 PM
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The overwhelming majority of historians -- theist or atheist, Christian or non-Christian -- agree that Jesus existed. There is a tiny handful of writers who claim otherwise, but by and large, they have no credentials as historians. The most prominent of these writers, G.A. Wells, is a professor of German, not history -- and even he has abandoned the notion that Jesus did not exist. Last edited by JThunder; 11-05-2009 at 11:33 PM.
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#15
11-05-2009, 11:49 PM
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Robert price, for instance (Doctorates in theology and New Testament, Professor of theology, former Baptist minister), and Richard Carrier (PhD in Ancient History), but you're right that Jesus Mythicism is still very much on the ouside looking in at the moment and is all but universally rejected by most of academia.
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#16
11-05-2009, 11:50 PM
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Saint Paul took a great story about the little guy getting martyred, a promise of eternal paradise, a fear of eternal damnation, and some good ol' fashioned hard salesmanship and turned it into a massive enterprise. It's like the Beatles. They didn't do anything new so much as they went out and found all the best parts of what everyone was doing at the time, made it mass market, and kicked everyone else's butt. Practically speaking, what difference is there between David Koresh and Joseph Smith, Jr. besides that one was a better salesman? If you want to account popularity and longevity with divinity, you have to explain why there's nearly as many Islamic people in the world as Christian. You have to explain why Jesus was more plausibly the bearer of divine knowledge than any other person at the time preaching the same message.
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#17
11-06-2009, 12:13 AM
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I always wondered this issue myself. In Christian belief, God is omniscient - so he must have known at the time of Adam and Eve's fall from grace that he was going to eventually come down to Earth in the person of Jesus to redeem mankind. So why delay? He could have appeared the next day and let Adam crucify him.
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#18
11-06-2009, 12:16 AM
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Anyway, one would assume he appeared at this time because his parents had sex nine months earlier.
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#19
11-06-2009, 12:50 AM
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Why did Jesus appear on the scene when he did?
Because comedy is all about timing.
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#20
11-06-2009, 01:01 AM
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http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/...6&postcount=10 All I wanna know...
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#22
11-06-2009, 06:50 AM
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#23
11-06-2009, 07:21 AM
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#24
11-06-2009, 07:27 AM
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#25
11-06-2009, 07:45 AM
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Do any of the major religions attempt to explain why they began when they did? Why Abraham at that particular time? Why Muhammad just then? Why did Buddhism have to wait for the Buddha?
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#26
11-06-2009, 07:55 AM
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#27
11-06-2009, 08:03 AM
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Another Biblical answer- it was nearing up on the 490 years (seventy seven's) from Nehemiah 1's Medo-Persian decree to rebuild Jerusalem to the cutting off of the Anointed Prince & the following disasters on the City foretold in Daniel 9:20-27.
Whether or not you believe that was a prophecy of Jesus or the Messiah at all, JC & friends did.
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#28
11-06-2009, 08:23 AM
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God sets patterns for us to see, from atoms, planets, galaxies, the same basic concept repeated (perhaps atoms are star systems to other beings, and galaxies are atoms to others).
One such pattern is the Bible. At first, before the flood, at the time of conception (begotten), we know God, as Adam and Eve did. We depart from His ways and we loose the connection with God. The flood comes, which represents birth, where we are delivered into a new world. From here we start to learn about God, not from knowing him as we did in the beginning, but from men, such as Moses, and other spiritual leaders, as the Israelites did (very few actually knew God, most just followed the teachings of men and followed a written code). We continuously fall away from God's ways' (sin) then are restored, during this early stage of our life. At some time Jesus comes into our life, and we get to know God as a person, and get God's Spirit in us. After which Jesus works through us as we do His work, which is to deliver the rest of the 'Israelites' to Jesus. The Jewish day is also in this pattern, it starts at sundown, when the light of knowing God fades and we are in the dark, then Jesus, as the dawn, comes into our lives, and we walk in the light of the Son the rest of our lives. The pattern of our lives I believe is part of the reason why Jesus came when He did.
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#29
11-06-2009, 09:16 AM
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Um, kanicbird, I think the question was about the historical Jesus, why he showed up in the era he did. I would have expected a more complicated and intricate answer from you, with quotes from Daniel and Genesis. I'm a bit disappointed, actually.
You'd have managed better if you'd had it planned.
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#30
11-06-2009, 09:45 AM
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#31
11-06-2009, 09:50 AM
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#32
11-06-2009, 10:17 AM
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#34
11-06-2009, 11:11 AM
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Because the marketing guys thought it was time for re-branding/product re-launch?
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#36
11-06-2009, 12:42 PM
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Viral marketing.
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#37
11-06-2009, 12:57 PM
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My votes for a current day USA appearance would be either obscure cult leader in Nowhere, Arkansas, or locked up in a mental institution.
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#38
11-06-2009, 01:09 PM
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#39
11-06-2009, 01:12 PM
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#40
11-06-2009, 02:20 PM
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#41
11-06-2009, 03:17 PM
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http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/ba...ast-for-jesus/ http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091104/...dd_isuzu_jesus I do hear his mom gets around too...
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#42
11-09-2009, 07:26 AM
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It is possible that the Jewish nation was waiting for a couple of thousand years for a Messiah(They still are). Some of the people decided this was the time and person. The Jewish people were divided because of the way some of the priests and Pharisee's were teaching their religion. Jesus seemed to be against them and was easy for people who were against the leaders, they found a person in Jesus to accept. Paul may have found the reason he was looking for and used that and the stories that were going around. Early Christianity was very divided Just as today.
One could ask the same question about Hitler, Constantine, Obama,Bush, or any other leader in history. It could be Just 'Be' Cause that is the time it happened...no special time.
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#43
11-09-2009, 07:48 AM
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Well, according to the Bahai', every so often God sends a teacher to help raise mankind to the next level. For them, Zoraster, Moses, Buddha, Jesus, Mohammad, and their own Bahá'u'lláh, are all teachers from and of the same thing.
IOW, it was Jesus' turn.
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#44
11-09-2009, 09:17 AM
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#45
11-09-2009, 09:36 AM
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#48
11-09-2009, 09:56 AM
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#49
11-09-2009, 10:04 AM
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The anthropological explaination is that the population of Judea was ripe for the appearance of millenial movements. The same reason, in other words, why the "Ghost Dance" movement appeared among the Native Americans when it did - a population facing seemingly insolvable threats to its very existance and identity (in the case of Judea, from Rome) will be a fertile location for the development of various political-religious movements offering a way out, whether physically or spiritually. [Certainly the Romans themselves thought Jesus was a potential threat, probably with good reason - in spite of all Jesus' allegedly stated ambiguity on the matter in the gospels, the Romans knew appearance of would-be messiahs among subject peoples = trouble]
Interestingly, Christianity was outcompeted in Judea itself by movements dedicated to direct action (see: the Jewish Revolt, the Bar-Kockba rebellion). It caught on among the general non-Jewish Mediteranian population instead, including the Roman underclass and slave class - which was facing stress as well, in terms of loss of traditional identities and the inability to resist Rome.
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